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Thread: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    Again gays have the same right I do.........they can marry anyone of the opposite sex exactly as I can........They are trying to establish a soecial right for them......Why don't you inderstand that......Why don't you understand that if you allow gays to marry then you have to allow other groups as classes of people to have the same right..Maybe you have no problem with that but I do..............
    Really Navy? When you chose to get married, were you able to marry the person that you were in love with? Were you able to marry a person that you were sexually attracted to? Were you able to marry the person who above all others you CHOSE to spend the rest of your life with?

    If so, then gay people do not have the same rights to marriage that you have.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post



    As far as a gay person unless they flaunt their sexuality you would not even know they were gay.......
    ...and we all know that you prefer it that way Navy. You are ok with gay people...as long as they act straight in public.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Sure it was. Prior to changing the definition, marriage was defined as marriage between a man and a woman of the same race. That definition was changed.

    As you point out, the restrictions changed who could enter into it with whom.
    How is gay marriage any different than that?
    What you continue to ignore is its still a man and a woman getting married regardless of their color......
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Really Navy? When you chose to get married, were you able to marry the person that you were in love with? Were you able to marry a person that you were sexually attracted to? Were you able to marry the person who above all others you CHOSE to spend the rest of your life with?

    If so, then gay people do not have the same rights to marriage that you have.
    Sure I was as long as they are the same sex..........I did not ask to change anything like gays are trying to do.......
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    ...and we all know that you prefer it that way Navy. You are ok with gay people...as long as they act straight in public.
    Unlike you I don't like to see anyoneflaunt their sexuality be they straight or gay...........I have said it over and over again that what to people do in the privacy of their bedroom is their businne......Unlike you I don't wnat to know about it.........I am not going to tell you that again.......
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    Sure I was as long as they are the same sex..........I did not ask to change anything like gays are trying to do.......
    What change? Gays have been getting married ever since their were gays.

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    Sure I was as long as they are the same sex..........I did not ask to change anything like gays are trying to do.......
    Doesn't answer the question:

    Were you able to marry the person that you love, the person that you were sexually attracted to and the person that you CHOSE to spend the rest of your life with?

    If so, you have more rights than you are willing to extend to your fellow brothers and sisters simply because they are gay.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Sure it was. Prior to changing the definition, marriage was defined as marriage between a man and a woman of the same race. That definition was changed.
    No, it wasn't. It was defined as being between a man and woman, with restrictions as to who could enter into it with whom. It's not the same thing.

    Making things up is bad faith. You hurt yourself by doing so.


    As you point out, the restrictions changed who could enter into it with whom.
    How is gay marriage any different than that?
    Because you're make a fundamental redefinition of the institution, not making the existing one more inclusive, or removing arbitrary, irrelevant barriers from it.

    Besides, is it "gay" marriage? Are you saying that two non-gay men (or women) could not enter into a same-sex marriage?
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    No, it wasn't. It was defined as being between a man and woman, with restrictions as to who could enter into it with whom. It's not the same thing.

    Making things up is bad faith. You hurt yourself by doing so.




    Because you're make a fundamental redefinition of the institution, not making the existing one more inclusive, or removing arbitrary, irrelevant barriers from it.

    Besides, is it "gay" marriage? Are you saying that two non-gay men (or women) could not enter into a same-sex marriage?
    Absolutely it was. Heed your own advice...Making things up is bad faith. You hurt yourself by doing so.

    If marriage were simply defined as a union between a man and a woman, then ANY man could marry ANY woman. That wasn't true until the inter-racial discrimination ended and CHANGED that definition of marriage.

    Allowing gays to marry the person they love is no more a "fundamental redefinition" than changing it to allow inter-racial marriage.
    They both made the exisiting definition more inclusive and remove arbitrary and irrelevant barriers from it.

    As to your final point. Certainly, two non-gay men (or women) could enter into marriage, however, I can't see that they would want to. But if they did, what reason does the government have to be involved?
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: New Jersey Senate Defeats Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Absolutely it was. Heed your own advice...Making things up is bad faith. You hurt yourself by doing so.

    If marriage were simply defined as a union between a man and a woman, then ANY man could marry ANY woman. That wasn't true until the inter-racial discrimination ended and CHANGED that definition of marriage.
    This is stupid. Show the language. Show that. Show that an interracial marriage was not considered a marriage at all.


    Allowing gays to marry the person they love is no more a "fundamental redefinition" than changing it to allow inter-racial marriage.
    They both made the exisiting definition more inclusive and remove arbitrary and irrelevant barriers from it.
    Not the same thing. Obviously, your passion on the issue makes it impossible for you see that, but it's not the same thing.


    As to your final point. Certainly, two non-gay men (or women) could enter into marriage, however, I can't see that they would want to. But if they did, what reason does the government have to be involved?
    Never said it did. But considering your inability to argue honestly, I'm not surprised you try to make it seem as though I did. You have great difficulty entertaining ideas which are in any way contrary to your worldview, so you assume that anyone who raises an academic point against you must be against you in principle.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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