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Thread: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    It's not a reasonable question.
    Only people not accustomed to reason would believe that asking why a person would do something they can't afford is unreasonable.

    If they're married before they enlist, they're irrational if they don't examine the pay scale against their (known) living expenses and the emotional stresses service life will impose on them.

    If they're thinking of getting married after the serviceman enlists, they're irrational to do so prior to examining their (known) income and their expected costs of living.

    So, in either situation, if the analysis indicates a gross budget shortfall of income vs living costs, what reasons forced them to persist in their actions, and under what circumstances should the taxpayer be expected to bear the cost of their poor decision making ability?




    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    To repeat myself for the Nth time in this thread, you get what you pay for.
    We're paying for people to snoop luggage and feel people up.

    We've got people at the airport who snoop luggage and feel people up.

    Most of them are government employees, and free-lancers who get caught are punished.

    What's the problem?
    Last edited by Scarecrow Akhbar; 01-07-10 at 07:40 PM.

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Only people not accustomed to reason would believe that asking why a person would do something they can't afford is unreasonable.

    If they're married before they enlist, they're irrational if they don't examine the pay scale against their (known) living expenses and the emotional stresses service life will impose on them.

    If they're thinking of getting married after the serviceman enlists, they're irrational to do so prior to examining their (known) income and their expected costs of living.

    So, in either situation, if the analysis indicates a gross budget shortfall of income vs living costs, what reasons forced them to persist in their actions, and under what circumstances should the taxpayer be expected to bear the cost of their poor decision making ability?
    Wow.

    . . .

    Wow.

    Okay, I . . .

    Wow.

    Dude.

    Okay, I'll take a shot at this, but I can't guarantee you'll understand it.

    We are talking about people who have volunteered to serve our nation. While politicians often use that service to further selfish, imperialistic ends, the fact is that our servicemen and servicewomen signed up to defend our nation and our allies against our enemies.

    There certainly are many benefits to military service which include valuable experience, education assistance, and so on. Ultimately, however, everyone who enlists faces the very real possibility of being asked to risk their lives at the behest of their commanding officers.

    When we're asking someone to be ready to make that kind of sacrifice, it is incumbent upon us to support them in many respects. We must give them the training they need to survive and to defend their compatriots in arms. We must give them opportunities to better themselves, both so that they may serve us better and so they may be better prepared to make a life for themselves once they have left our service. We must allow them the opportunity to advance as a result of hard work and dedication. We must look after them and care for them if they are wounded or traumatized in our service. We must not leave them to the untender mercies of the enemy if they are captured. We must not leave their bodies behind to be desecrated if they are killed.

    We must permit them the opportunity to raise a family while in our service.

    Aside from our obligation to those who enter our service, the simple fact of the matter is that the training our soldiers receive instills a solid core of values that are valuable to pass on to the next generation. In general, people who enter the service of others for a noble cause, whether that service is military or otherwise, take away from that service lessons which must be passed on if at all possible. Military service is no exception.

    That you do not understand these imperatives saddens me.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    Okay, I'll take a shot at this, but I can't guarantee you'll understand it.

    We are talking about people who have volunteered to serve our nation. While politicians often use that service to further selfish, imperialistic ends, the fact is that our servicemen and servicewomen signed up to defend our nation and our allies against our enemies.
    More or less.

    Most of them sign up for training, job security, and adventure, with patriotism being somewhat secondary.

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    There certainly are many benefits to military service which include valuable experience, education assistance, and so on. Ultimately, however, everyone who enlists faces the very real possibility of being asked to risk their lives at the behest of their commanding officers.
    Or, sometimes, their lives are placed at risk because their CO is a fool. And, oh, by the way, the word is "ordered", not "asked".

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    When we're asking someone to be ready to make that kind of sacrifice, it is incumbent upon us to support them in many respects.
    We do.

    They get food, housing, clothing, medical.

    What junior enlistee's don't get is enough money to support a family. They need to wait for when they're NCO's before they get enough pay.

    Welcome to life. People making minimum wage in the civillian world shouldn't be making families they can't afford, either.

    What's your point, that a seaman recruit isn't paid a whole heck of a lot?

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    We must give them the training they need to survive and to defend their compatriots in arms.
    We train them to perform the missions they've volunteered for.

    Because we want them to accomplish that mission.

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    We must give them opportunities to better themselves, both so that they may serve us better and so they may be better prepared to make a life for themselves once they have left our service.
    Yes, they get opportunities to advance in the service because we want to reward performance and retain the best.

    We don't owe them squat to "make a better life for themselves" once their enlistments are up. They're trained to perform well in a military culture, and yes, many of the lessons are helpful when dealing with all of life's problems.

    So? That does not mean we should be raising the pay of the typical fireman apprentice so he can afford to feed a wife and a couple of kids. Not one thing you're saying alters the fact that the enlistee has to have the maturity to decide if he can afford a family on the wages he's earning or if he should wait until he's earning more money. This is what's expected of any mature adult.

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    We must allow them the opportunity to advance as a result of hard work and dedication.
    Irrelevant.

    Get to the point you've got wrong already.

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    We must look after them and care for them if they are wounded or traumatized in our service.
    An obligation.

    Ain't got nothing to do with their inappropriate decision to have families they can't afford.

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    We must not leave them to the untender mercies of the enemy if they are captured.
    This is called "honor".

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    We must not leave their bodies behind to be desecrated if they are killed.
    Depends.

    If it puts more lives at risk to bring home the dead meat, they should be expected to be left behind.

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    We must permit them the opportunity to raise a family while in our service.
    We do.

    When they have enough seniority, they're earning enough money to raise a family.

    IF they're careful with their money, as is true of any family.

    What's you're point again?

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    Aside from our obligation to those who enter our service, the simple fact of the matter is that the training our soldiers receive instills a solid core of values that are valuable to pass on to the next generation. In general, people who enter the service of others for a noble cause, whether that service is military or otherwise, take away from that service lessons which must be passed on if at all possible. Military service is no exception.
    Yes, military service is all weepy and noble and stuff. Pride and marching and flag waving and parades, I know.

    And if the junior men can't afford families, they shouldn't be bitching if they have them anyway and discover they can't feed them.

    You're pretending I don't have military experience. You're wrong.

    You're trying to imply I don't respect our servicemen. You're wrong.

    Been there, didn't do anything as stupid as having kids on an E-2's pay.

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    That you do not understand these imperatives saddens me.
    That you can't employ proper logic doesn't surprise me.

    As I said, if the junior man can't afford a family, he shouldn't have one. If a man has a family, he shouldn't enlist if the wages can't support his family.

    Neither creating a family one can't afford nor taking a position that can't support an existing family is an honorable position. The only thing less honorable is whining about how awful the military is for not paying you more to support your bad decision.

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Okay, so you have no understanding of the obligations I mentioned, and you made an appeal to authority based on an unverifiable claim of authenticity.

    I guess we're done here.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    I've never made the claim that federal employees, as a whole, are underpaid. I can think of a couple of dozen that I've worked with personally who are massively overpaid.
    You blamed the poor quality of TSA employees on the conservatives' supposed unwillingness to pay TSA workers enough. I just don't see that as being the problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    I'm a veryy worried about this stuation when when people with only GEDs can pull over at random. There needs to be something for these people to further their understanding beyond having authority and or a paycheck.


    I would like to see an education system for these people.
    The problem is that when only ~25% of the country has a 4 year degree and the numbers don't look to be changing that much any time soon, we can't keep roping off entire swaths of the employment sector for the college-educated only. Rather than worry about recruiting the best, we should also look at ways to minimize room for error. The proposed full-body scanner sounds like it would go a long way toward that.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    I'm a veryy worried about this stuation when when people with only GEDs can pull over at random. There needs to be something for these people to further their understanding beyond having authority and or a paycheck.


    I would like to see an education system for these people.
    You truly believe that they receive zero training beyond a high school diploma?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    We've all been through the airports, we've seen who the TSA agents are. These aren't people who went to college and studied hard to learn the law and court systems so that they can become police officers or FBI agents. I'm not really surprised that they're drug taking thugs. And these are the people responsible for our "safety".
    Right because police officers act better.

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    To be brutally honest, the socialist concept of Total Kontrol has failed, yet once again.
    Does that count for the Navy, as well? Screening passengers before air travel = socialist/fascism?

    koo koo.

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    Re: TSA Agent Arrested at LAX

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    You blamed the poor quality of TSA employees on the conservatives' supposed unwillingness to pay TSA workers enough. I just don't see that as being the problem.
    As my small-business-owning father always says, "You get what you pay for."

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