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Thread: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    I find cowardice in assuming that proper retaliation will please Bin-Laden...and the like. I also find it senseless to argue about unilateralism in a world full of unilateral activity. I guess it takes France and Germany to be onboard to make it non-unilateral? This argument that America acted unilaterally with Iraq was always satuid considering that it was no where near alone. Of course...that's me.

    The anti-Americanism that exists across the region was rooted long before Amerca even messed with Iran thanks to Qutb. I am not interested in America's popularity when it comes to the rest of the world. It is because we placate to popularity that we find ourselves constantly dealing with issues that we should have already dealt with. I do not care that toppling a dictator will encourage the slaughter of Muslims by other Muslims. I do not care that Muslims find themselves without pride because the rest of the world is having to deal with their terrorist creations.

    Until, Muslims decide that enough is enough and deal with their wrecked culture once and for all, they will have to contend with American bombs. Civilizations all over the world were colonized by Europeans and many of those colonies have become stong independant nations that are a part of the international stage. India? China? The U.S.? Egypt? That's off the top of my head, but you know there are more. Considering this, the Middle East has no excuse other than their culture. Trillions of dollars have flooded this region for oil, yet we are accused of stealing it. It is 2010 and this region can't even produce a car for the world's needs. Not one sense of real contribution towards the globe's prosperity and growth. I am a firm believer that much of their views towards the West, especially America, is based on long gone European imperialism and our success.

    I've become a huge fan of what the British used to call..."punitive strikes."
    So you think you can just bomb the entire region into submission? Good with that

    Al-Qaeda supporters are hardly a majority in the region. But generally if you bomb someones country they will perceive you as an enemy (people are strange like that) how is making additional enemies in your interests? Alot of these people hate Al-Qaeda. Why alienate them?

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    So you think you can just bomb the entire region into submission? Good with that

    Al-Qaeda supporters are hardly a majority in the region. But generally if you bomb someones country they will perceive you as an enemy (people are strange like that) how is making additional enemies in your interests? Alot of these people hate Al-Qaeda. Why alienate them?
    Al-Qaeda is responsible for attracting the bombs. They oust our enemies the bombs will stop. They continue to allow them to remain and operate like they did before we were even in their country or bombing them then they should expect hell to rain down from above. When they come to realize the awful cost of harboring and allowing our enemies to operate they might consider changing their ways.
    Last edited by ScummyD; 01-01-10 at 09:18 PM.

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    So, don't invade. Don't nation build. Just bomb?
    You want an honest answer?

    Yep, if they are really serious they should bomb everything with impunity, otherwise its just wasted effort.

    It sucks for the people who had nothing to do with any of it but destroying everything gives your enemy no place to hide.

    Although I don't support another war.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    So, don't invade. Don't nation build. Just bomb?
    Bomb. And insert SOF where and when needed. When you invade and begin nation building you only create an entirely new responsibility for yourself on top of killing Islamists.

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by ScummyD View Post
    Bomb. And insert SOF where and when needed. When you invade and begin nation building you only create an entirely new responsibility for yourself on top of killing Islamists.
    To a degree, I concur. Less thrilled about the bombing, as I think we get some of that wrong, and hurt ourselves. But something more surgical, less blunt, maybe. Has potential.

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by ScummyD View Post
    Al-Qaeda is responsible for attracting the bombs. They oust our enemies the bombs will stop. They continue to allow them to remain and operate like they did before we were even in their country or bombing them then they should expect hell to rain down from above.
    Thing is that if you bomb a country its people are unlikely to want to route out your enemies and will and will either want to support them or turn a blind eye to them, even if they are not their natural allies. Look at the surge in popularity of Hezbollah, even among some christians, after the 2006 war with Israel.

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    Thing is that if you bomb a country its people are unlikely to want to route out your enemies and will and will either want to support them or turn a blind eye to them, even if they are not their natural allies. Look at the surge in popularity of Hezbollah, even among some christians, after the 2006 war with Israel.
    Look at the firebombing of Tokyo and dropping atom bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima and the subsequent 60 years of peace.

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by ScummyD View Post
    Look at the firebombing of Tokyo and dropping to atom bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima and the subsequent 60 years of peace.
    Wouldn't be the same. Afghanistan and Pakistan could surrender, and still nothing would change. There are real differences that make those comparisons invalid.

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by ScummyD View Post
    Look at the firebombing Tokyo and dropping to atom bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima and the subsequent 60 years of peace.
    Different situation. Terrorists are a small, covert (mostly) portion of a population in most cases.

    Most of the population of Japan was prepared to fight invading forces.
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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    Re: Obama considering military strikes after Christmas Day aircraft plot

    Quote Originally Posted by ScummyD View Post
    Look at the firebombing of Tokyo and dropping atom bombs on Nagasaki and Hiroshima and the subsequent 60 years of peace.
    Look at the rise in sucide bombings escalating things to that level would produce. Doesnt seam like the preferable option when such an escalation is unnecessary the first place. Surely its more rational to want to keep people on your side if they dislike your enemy anyway?

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