Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

  1. #1
    Advisor Plato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Here be Dragons
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    317

    Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    Liu Xiabo, the founder of the Charter 08 campaign was jailed for 11 years yesterday on Christmas day, for "subversion" in calling for greater democracy in China.

    "Liu Xiaobo's case is about agreed international human rights standards, not merely the internal affairs of China," said John Ralston Saul, the president of International PEN. "China is signatory to international treaties and conventions, and cannot be given a free pass when it acts against its own and international standards."

    Chinese human rights activist Liu Xiaobo sentenced to 11 years in jail | World news | guardian.co.uk

    Liu's most famous words are probably: "we should end the practice of viewing words as crimes".

    The contemporary artist Ai Weiwei was among those at the courtroom. "This does not mean a meteor has fallen. This is the discovery of a star."

    Recently in Hong Kong the memoirs of Zhao Ziyang were published that called for free elections, and the separation of the judiciary from the Communist Party and the executive. For such grave thoughtcrimes, as well as undue sympathy to the students in Tiananmen Square and an opposition to the martial law that was unleashed against them on June 4th 1989, Zhao, a former General Secretary of the Chinese Communist Party and premier of the people's Republic of China, spent his last ten years under house arrest.

    But all this hides a great fear on behalf of nationalist hardliners and those in government with a corrupt self interest in China's economic boom. The Chinese Communist Party is inpenetrable, but harsh sentences like this do not take place unless there is a large faction within the ruling elite which favours Liu and the legacy of Zhao Ziyang.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zhao Ziyang
    It would be wrong if our Party never makes the transition from a state that was suitable in a time of war to a state more suitable to a democratic society...the reform of the legal system and an independent judiciary should take precedence. Our hope is for the ruling position of the Communist Party to be maintained for a considerable period of time so that the transition can be made under its leadership...however this ruling position should not be maintained by using the constitution to monoploze this status. Rather the Party must be made to compete for it. I believe that this is a worldwide trend that we cannot defy.
    These words are banned in mainland China.

    Sun Yat Sen's are not:

    Quote Originally Posted by Sun Yat Sen
    Worldwide trends are enormous and powerful; those who follow them prosper; those who resist them perish.
    Surely a form of liberal democracy, with Confucian Chinese characteristics, will emerge in China? This instinctive fear of freedom cannot go on for ever.
    Last edited by Plato; 12-26-09 at 11:16 AM.
    There is a way to gain the whole world. It is to gain the people, and having gained them, one gains the whole world. There is a way to gain the people. Gain their hearts and minds and then you gain them. Mencius

  2. #2
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Last Seen
    12-26-10 @ 06:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    8,083

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    The difficult thing is that China has never had an effective democracy. Its people are used to 1000 years of dictatorial rule, either under dynastic monarchy or the Communists. They want more rights but no one knows how to fight for them.

    I think once the current status quo of development begins to plateau and the middle class fall into hard times there, the government will see the end of its days. The CPP provides right now.

  3. #3
    Advisor Plato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Here be Dragons
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    317

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    I find it sad that free peoples and believers in democracy should show so little interest in the plight of one of their own being persecuted for their beliefs. The inward looking isolationism depresses me.

    So I'm bumping this month old thread in case I'm wrong.
    There is a way to gain the whole world. It is to gain the people, and having gained them, one gains the whole world. There is a way to gain the people. Gain their hearts and minds and then you gain them. Mencius

  4. #4
    Filmmaker Lawyer Patriot
    Harshaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:20 PM
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    29,564

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    This surprises you?

    They don't care about it in Cuba. They don't care about it in Iran. They don't care about it in Venezuela. They didn't care about it in the USSR -- or even current Russia. Why would they care about it in China?
    Last edited by Harshaw; 01-23-10 at 12:13 PM.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

  5. #5
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    University of San Diego
    Last Seen
    04-14-11 @ 02:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    672
    Blog Entries
    3

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    But Obama sent a strongly worded message to Honduras! That counts for something, doesn't it? Sure, the message warning Honduras to change their "absoluist" ways was lost in the hub-hub of the Honduras election. But at least he... Tried?

  6. #6
    Shankmasta Killa
    TacticalEvilDan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Western NY and Geneva, CH
    Last Seen
    08-30-15 @ 04:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    10,444

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Plato View Post
    I find it sad that free peoples and believers in democracy should show so little interest in the plight of one of their own being persecuted for their beliefs. The inward looking isolationism depresses me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    They don't care about it in Cuba. They don't care about it in Iran. They don't care about it in Venezuela. They didn't care about it in the USSR -- or even current Russia. Why would they care about it in China?
    I don't think that's it. I think it's been quiet in here because there's really nothing to say. Yes, it sucks. Yes, it is wrong. Yes, the government needs to change. Yes, the people need to change it.

    How many times can you say that on an Internet forum which is most likely not being watched by anybody of any particular importance?

    Maybe people are sticking to threads where there's actually . . . gasp . . . something to disagree about.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  7. #7
    Guru
    Skateguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Houston/Heights
    Last Seen
    02-07-12 @ 08:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    2,571

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    Politicians mean everything they say in order to get elected.
    "Don't be particular bout nothin, but the company you keep"

  8. #8
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:51 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,305

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    This is a setback for China.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  9. #9
    Shankmasta Killa
    TacticalEvilDan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Western NY and Geneva, CH
    Last Seen
    08-30-15 @ 04:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    10,444

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Skateguy View Post
    Politicians mean everything they say in order to get elected.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  10. #10
    Filmmaker Lawyer Patriot
    Harshaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:20 PM
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    29,564

    Re: Major setback for human rights in China as Liu Xiaobo is jailed for 11 years

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    I don't think that's it. I think it's been quiet in here because there's really nothing to say. Yes, it sucks. Yes, it is wrong. Yes, the government needs to change. Yes, the people need to change it.

    How many times can you say that on an Internet forum which is most likely not being watched by anybody of any particular importance?

    Maybe people are sticking to threads where there's actually . . . gasp . . . something to disagree about.
    I'm not talking about message boards.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •