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Thread: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

  1. #421
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    But, can't this be said of almost all large organizations, including big business?
    Yes, but at least with business their intentions are clear.

    Though we should note that we do currently have a broken system. Americans pay more money into healthcare than anyone else and have the least access to it. It's something that should be solved. And there are ways to use government to solve the problem. But we really have to watch, constrain, and constantly look over the shoulder of government to make sure that they are doing it well. Most industrialized countries have some form of public healthcare and it's not unreasonable to request it here. But if we want something which benefits the majority of the People, we have to make sure that Congress is acting in our interest, not the interest of their lobbyists. I think that on some from, government offered healthcare was an inevitability. And if it were to be inevitable, then we need to construct it right from the start and restrict how government can use the program to prevent fraud and corruption.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Now as for the pharmaceutical industry, what are you referring to exactly?
    That came about in one of the meetings with Democrats and I think Obama where they promised not to instituted any form of legislation against price gouging in order for them (pharmaceutical companies) to pledge a bunch of money into the system and getting the bill passed.

    I think one of the clearer things to do with this, if we had to go the path would be the following. Government covers big things. Cancer, diabetes, organ transplants, etc. Expensive procedures which cost a lot of money and one reason why insurance premiums are high and the whole "pre-existing condition" thing. Regular healthcare like going to see a doctor, getting a prescription for a cold, broken bones, etc. can be handled then through private insurance. That would decrease the cost of private insurance and make it more affordable to most people. Something like that would benefit a larger number of people than what we're going to get which is basically mandating that we have insurance and enforcing it through the IRS and police.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone


  3. #423
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Yes, but at least with business their intentions are clear.
    From what I read here, many think the governments intentions are claer as well.


    Though we should note that we do currently have a broken system. Americans pay more money into healthcare than anyone else and have the least access to it. It's something that should be solved. And there are ways to use government to solve the problem. But we really have to watch, constrain, and constantly look over the shoulder of government to make sure that they are doing it well. Most industrialized countries have some form of public healthcare and it's not unreasonable to request it here. But if we want something which benefits the majority of the People, we have to make sure that Congress is acting in our interest, not the interest of their lobbyists. I think that on some from, government offered healthcare was an inevitability. And if it were to be inevitable, then we need to construct it right from the start and restrict how government can use the program to prevent fraud and corruption.
    I don't disagree with this.


    That came about in one of the meetings with Democrats and I think Obama where they promised not to instituted any form of legislation against price gouging in order for them (pharmaceutical companies) to pledge a bunch of money into the system and getting the bill passed.

    I think one of the clearer things to do with this, if we had to go the path would be the following. Government covers big things. Cancer, diabetes, organ transplants, etc. Expensive procedures which cost a lot of money and one reason why insurance premiums are high and the whole "pre-existing condition" thing. Regular healthcare like going to see a doctor, getting a prescription for a cold, broken bones, etc. can be handled then through private insurance. That would decrease the cost of private insurance and make it more affordable to most people. Something like that would benefit a larger number of people than what we're going to get which is basically mandating that we have insurance and enforcing it through the IRS and police.
    That too sound reasonable. Think conservative or the opposition would buy this?

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    Sounds like a deal only good if everyone keeps their word, which have doubts about.



    It says the White House agreed to oppose any congressional efforts to use the government's leverage to bargain for lower drug prices or import drugs from Canada -- and also agreed not to pursue Medicare rebates or shift some drugs from Medicare Part B to Medicare Part D, which would cost Big Pharma billions in reduced reimbursements.

    In exchange, the Pharmaceutical Researchers and Manufacturers Association (PhRMA) agreed to cut $80 billion in projected costs to taxpayers and senior citizens over ten years. Or, as the memo says: "Commitment of up to $80 billion, but not more than $80 billion."

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    That too sound reasonable. Think conservative or the opposition would buy this?
    No. I don't think it's something that lobbyists would get on board with and I don't think it would funnel enough money to the major parties' coffers for them to attempt something like this.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    No. I don't think it's something that lobbyists would get on board with and I don't think it would funnel enough money to the major parties' coffers for them to attempt something like this.
    Sadly, I agree.

    Maybe you should run for office?

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Sadly, I agree.

    Maybe you should run for office?
    Can't. Atheist.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Can't. Atheist.
    Didn't know about the non atheist qualification.


    Anyway, we don't seem to be far apart. despite the flaws in government, I hope this stays a work in progress that one day gets closer to what we really need.

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Didn't know about the non atheist qualification.


    Anyway, we don't seem to be far apart. despite the flaws in government, I hope this stays a work in progress that one day gets closer to what we really need.
    Naw, atheists just have a near zero probability of being elected in this country. And I'm not sure how well I'd actually work in government given my innate hatred of it. The things I would like to see done have more to do with severe restrictions and drastic cuts in size and power of government than it has to do with the installation of new programs.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  10. #430
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Naw, atheists just have a near zero probability of being elected in this country. And I'm not sure how well I'd actually work in government given my innate hatred of it. The things I would like to see done have more to do with severe restrictions and drastic cuts in size and power of government than it has to do with the installation of new programs.
    Well, the devil is in the details. What you cut, how you cut it, and such. I suspect we'd find some disagreement there.

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