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Thread: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

  1. #221
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yes, you are wrong. You go to jail for not paying the tax and not for not having insurance.

    And as there is a hardship clause, not having the money is not really a barrier. Does she pay taxes? If she does, then she does so already and can simply have a few dollars more taken out a month. 2.5% would not be that noticeable.

    Again, don;t make excuses and be accurate about what is written. No one goes to jail for not having insurance. You have to break a second law.
    How does one establish the "hardship clause?" Do we need a bunch of federal bureaucrats do a case study to ensure she meets the criterion? Sounds like a full employment act for federal employees, is it not?



    Am I wrong?
    Last edited by Missouri Mule; 12-25-09 at 05:59 PM.
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Missouri Mule View Post
    How does one establish the "hardship clause?" Do we need a bunch of federal bureaucrats do a case study to ensure she meets the criterion? Sounds like a full employment act for federal employees, is it not?

    Am I wrong?
    Again, yes, you're wrong. We do this with a number of things and it isn't that difficult. We have a problem of people not insured running up cost in a number of ways. While this would have been easier and better to handle with a public option, this is still doable.

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Again, yes, you're wrong. We do this with a number of things and it isn't that difficult. We have a problem of people not insured running up cost in a number of ways. While this would have been easier and better to handle with a public option, this is still doable.
    Really? I did casework both in welfare and in child support. In order to establish that one would need to collect all of the supporting documentations and complete about 25 forms to establish the innocence of this dastardly offender. We would have to contact all their bank accounts, verify all of their income, compile their assets, do the math and see if they meet the requirements. I would say that would take several hours to accomplish. Otherwise the law is meaningless.

    Am I wrong?

    I think I see where this is heading. Obama's full employment act is the medical reform law. Eventually everyone will work for the government. Wasn't that tried in the Soviet Union?
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Missouri Mule View Post
    Really? I did casework both in welfare and in child support. In order to establish that one would need to collect all of the supporting documentations and complete about 25 forms to establish the innocence of this dastardly offender. We would have to contact all their bank accounts, verify all of their income, compile their assets, do the math and see if they meet the requirements. I would say that would take several hours to accomplish. Otherwise the law is meaningless.

    Am I wrong?

    I think I see where this is heading. Obama's full employment act is the medical reform law. Eventually everyone will work for the government. Wasn't that tried in the Soviet Union?
    You managed to do it, didn't you? People did get it don't didn't they?

    And no, silly and dishonest comparisons to the Soviet Union will only work in your mind. You're wrong about many things, and this is just one more area in which your take your hyperbole too far.

  5. #225
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You managed to do it, didn't you? People did get it don't didn't they?

    And no, silly and dishonest comparisons to the Soviet Union will only work in your mind. You're wrong about many things, and this is just one more area in which your take your hyperbole too far.
    Yeah, what a dumb comparison. The soviet union was a single party state that had a strong central government that meddled in the affairs of it's citizens a great deal. The US, on the other hand, is a single party state with a strong central government that........oh....never mind.
    He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire. ~ Winston Churchill

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You managed to do it, didn't you? People did get it don't didn't they?

    And no, silly and dishonest comparisons to the Soviet Union will only work in your mind. You're wrong about many things, and this is just one more area in which your take your hyperbole too far.
    So my 20+ years doing casework doesn't count. If I don't know what is involved, I must be a big ignoramus and thoroughly incompetent then.

    Am I wrong?
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    Yeah, what a dumb comparison. The soviet union was a single party state that had a strong central government that meddled in the affairs of it's citizens a great deal. The US, on the other hand, is a single party state with a strong central government that........oh....never mind.


    I loved it!!!!!!!!!

    I haven't laughed so hard in years!!!!
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

  8. #228
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by TBone View Post
    What are you using to make this forecast?
    The language and requirements in both bills do that.

    Cutting medicare payments to doctors will force them to cap the number of medicare patients they see or drop them altogether.

    The provisions dealing with community rating, forced insuring of those already sick and the minimum benefits will raise prices across the board but most notably will it hit young people, which are the people who have the smallest income of all age groups.

    The penalty for employers is less than what it costs to provide a partially covered insurance plan, plus they don't have to manage the paperwork or have days for open enrollment anymore.

    That fine on employers though, hurts small businesses the most.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yes, you are wrong. You go to jail for not paying the tax and not for not having insurance.

    And as there is a hardship clause, not having the money is not really a barrier. Does she pay taxes? If she does, then she does so already and can simply have a few dollars more taken out a month. 2.5% would not be that noticeable.

    Again, don;t make excuses and be accurate about what is written. No one goes to jail for not having insurance. You have to break a second law.
    One leads to the other. When people say that they can't afford the insurance it is because all other necessary bills get in the way. It means that they are living pay check to pay check (and sometimes the bills still don't get paid fully). Even a 2.5% loss could put a person out on the street. They may never get out of debt. Especially when the IRS charges interest.
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    Re: Senate OKs health care measure, reaching milestone

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    One leads to the other. When people say that they can't afford the insurance it is because all other necessary bills get in the way. It means that they are living pay check to pay check (and sometimes the bills still don't get paid fully). Even a 2.5% loss could put a person out on the street. They may never get out of debt. Especially when the IRS charges interest.
    If someone CANNOT afford insurance, the government will not "fine" them. They will get vouchers so they can purchase a healthcare plan.

    If they can easily afford it and are just too stubborn and/or stupid to get it, then that is their own fault.

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