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Thread: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not sure that is what I said. Take buying insurance, premiums are to be paid. It isn't free. But as you are paying for them right now. If we do nothing at all, you are paying for them right now. Not just people in medicare or medicaid, but people, working people often, who are on in any government program, who are uninsured, and who receive medical care. You're paying for them right now, in the most expensive way. Seems to me that some intelligent spending might be better.

    You're skirting it. Everything you have been saying is me, as the taxpayer, through my ability, paying for those with a need. You've already said in several situations that is how it should be, so just admit it.


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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    You're skirting it. Everything you have been saying is me, as the taxpayer, through my ability, paying for those with a need. You've already said in several situations that is how it should be, so just admit it.


    j-mac
    What I have said is that we can tackle problems that effect us. We can. And that we pay for those getting health care right now. And we do so in a very non cost effective manner.

    I believe in both personal responsibility and community responsibility. When faced with a costly problem, or a harmful problem, we can work together to solve these problems. And it may require we spend some money through taxes.

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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    What I have said is that we can tackle problems that effect us. We can. And that we pay for those getting health care right now. And we do so in a very non cost effective manner.

    I believe in both personal responsibility and community responsibility. When faced with a costly problem, or a harmful problem, we can work together to solve these problems. And it may require we spend some money through taxes.

    do you believe that Medicare is an efficient program?


    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    do you believe that Medicare is an efficient program?


    j-mac
    considering they have to take the worse of the worse, yes. It isn't like a universal insurer would be, in which they had a large pool that included large numbers of well people. This is an important aspect.

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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Seems like a small point we're wasting so much time on
    ya think?

    LOL!

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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    considering they have to take the worse of the worse, yes. It isn't like a universal insurer would be, in which they had a large pool that included large numbers of well people. This is an important aspect.

    Isn't that the supposed scheme of Social Security? Able working people paying the tax to make the payments to the retired?

    Let's see how those two programs are fairing.


    Government obligations for Social Security and Medicare may soon exceed the combined net worth of every household and nonprofit organization in the country.

    Is America about to go broke? - MSN Money

    The financial condition of the Social Security and Medicare programs remains challenging. Projected long run program costs are not sustainable under current program parameters.

    Trustees Report Summary

    The 2009 Social Security and Medicare Trustees Reports show the combined unfunded liability of these two programs has reached nearly $107 trillion in today's dollars! That is about seven times the size of the U.S. economy and 10 times the size of the outstanding national debt.


    Social Security and Medicare Projections: 2009 - Brief Analysis #662

    Now you want to add another social program like these?


    j-mac
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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Isn't that the supposed scheme of Social Security? Able working people paying the tax to make the payments to the retired?

    Let's see how those two programs are fairing.
    Not entirely no. SS was suppose to a supplement and not the entire program. It's really very different than Medicare and medicaid. It's a case of doing something it wasn't designed to do.



    Now you want to add another social program like these?


    j-mac
    Despite problems, these programs do serve a real purpose and shouldn't go away. What I want is to design a program that is effective and less costly than what we're doing now. Present proposals won't likely do that, but we can only to one that will by moving forward. Letting the fear mongering win won't help us much.

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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not entirely no. SS was suppose to a supplement and not the entire program. It's really very different than Medicare and medicaid. It's a case of doing something it wasn't designed to do.

    I know it pays more than just retirement benefits, however, I always understood the act to be that as a safety net to retiring persons, that everyone participates, and everyone collects after the designated age. Now in earlier times, I think it was three workers contributing to one retirees check, that number has fallen to nearly one to one. Or in other words, unsustainable.

    When I think of all the money taken out of my earnings over my years in the work force, and had that money been invested in other ways, I would have alot more than I do now.


    Despite problems, these programs do serve a real purpose and shouldn't go away. What I want is to design a program that is effective and less costly than what we're doing now. Present proposals won't likely do that, but we can only to one that will by moving forward. Letting the fear mongering win won't help us much.

    I think you are dreaming. Nothing leads any rational person in this country to believe that the government can do what it is you're looking for. The purpose these programs serve is to redistribute my earnings to those who don't or won't earn them on their own. That is not what this country was founded on.


    j-mac
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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    I know it pays more than just retirement benefits, however, I always understood the act to be that as a safety net to retiring persons, that everyone participates, and everyone collects after the designated age. Now in earlier times, I think it was three workers contributing to one retirees check, that number has fallen to nearly one to one. Or in other words, unsustainable.

    When I think of all the money taken out of my earnings over my years in the work force, and had that money been invested in other ways, I would have alot more than I do now.
    Yes, that is a large part of the problem, but it was also suppose to only be a supplement, not all of retirement. I know of a few who invested money and right at retirement time saw it disappear (I think you know a few as well). Investment isn't a magic bullet either.



    I think you are dreaming. Nothing leads any rational person in this country to believe that the government can do what it is you're looking for. The purpose these programs serve is to redistribute my earnings to those who don't or won't earn them on their own. That is not what this country was founded on.


    j-mac
    Well, we certainly see this differently. I completely disagree. Government is a means by which we can work to solve problems.

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    Re: Nelson says he'll support healthcare bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yes, that is a large part of the problem, but it was also suppose to only be a supplement, not all of retirement. I know of a few who invested money and right at retirement time saw it disappear (I think you know a few as well). Investment isn't a magic bullet either.





    Well, we certainly see this differently. I completely disagree. Government is a means by which we can work to solve problems.

    The largest thing I think we see differently here is that you seem to see government as the answer to problems, and I see it AS the problem.


    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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