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DC City Council votes to legalize gay marriage

apdst said:
That makes sense, seeing what the Libbos have done to the black community in this country. They've run the father out of the black family.

Now it all makes sense why Libbos are so hyped up over gay marriage.
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Why don't you try some honesty :

The Black Family 1965 said:
The report, which emphasized high rates of teenage pregnancy, absent fathers, welfare dependency, and crime in the black community, concluded that the black family structure was weak due in large part to the disproportionate number of female-headed households, or a “matriarchal”family structure. This conclusion, not surprisingly, has stimulated an extensive body of critical research into the conditions of the black family. Two broad themes can be identified in this literature. First, without necessarily taking issue with some of the basic findings, many scholars argue that this conclusion ignores the impact of racism, classism, and segregation. That is, the black family is more fractured and less stable than the nonblack family for reasons linked to endemic structural and cultural conditions that disadvantage the black family. Second, others more directly attack the conclusion that the black family is somehow dysfunctional, and instead point to the strength of the black family structure, as evidenced, for example, by strong kinship networks.

Read more: Families - BLACK IN HISTORICAL CONTEXT, FAMILY DIVERSITY Families - BLACK IN HISTORICAL CONTEXT, FAMILY DIVERSITY
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A major misconception in the early literature on slavery and black families, as written by white scholars, was that slave owners understood the economic benefits of a strong nuclear black family and therefore tried to preserve the family structure of slaves. Researchers later “discovered”what the descendants of slaves already knew, that about one out of every three slave marriages ended because of partners being sold. This discovery questioned the validity of the idea that slave owners cared about the well-being of slave families and, more importantly, provides an example of how research can be seriously flawed if it is informed by racism and a worldview fostered by privilege. More recent scholarship demonstrates that slave owners often used specific strategies (i.e., labor migration, interference in marriage, and sexual exploitation) to endanger the well-being of African American families.
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It's fun to debunk your false assertions on black people over and over again.
 
apdst said:
If you're saying that a child needs a male and female influence in it's life, then I agree 100%.
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Finally! Someone with reason and common sense.

I don't give a **** if gays marry, because I believe gays should have a chance to be miserable too, but I understand your point, if that is in fact what you're getting at.
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And if you don't care, and I don't care, but others might, we all involve ourselves, we define our society's institutions together, and we move on.
 
Hatuey said:
Why don't you try some honesty :





It's fun to debunk your false assertions on black people over and over again.
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Annnnnd, what did you debunk, exactly?
 
apdst said:
Annnnnd, what did you debunk, exactly?
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That some gay marriage supporters actually can understand the difference between race and homosexuality.

He certainly did debunk that!
 
apdst said:
Annnnnd, what did you debunk, exactly?
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:doh - I forgot you can't follow threads. Here - let bold it for you baby :

seeing what the Libbos have done to the black community in this country. They've run the father out of the black family.
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Hatuey said:
:doh - I forgot you can't follow threads. Here - let bold it for you baby :
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Want to expand on your intepretation of my point, blood?

I'm saying that the government has replaced the black father and that is bad. Are you disagreeing?
 
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apdst said:
Want to expand on your intepretation of my point, blood?
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I'm not related to ignorant people so please don't call me blood. My interpretation of your point? To make a point you have to actually provide supporting arguments. You made a single statement. That statement is proven untrue. The African American Family as your seemed to want to depict it is a myth.

The belief that once upon a time black families were something like the All American Family is proven to be untrue as the black community has for the most part of the last 150 years been characterized by high levels of not just criminality among males but also higher than average levels of teen pregnancies among females. Do you have any other baseless comments to make displaying your total ignorance of this subject?

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Adding :

I'm saying that the government has replaced the black father and that is bad. Are you disagreeing?
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That is not what you said. This is what you said :

seeing what the Libbos have done to the black community in this country. They've run the father out of the black family.
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I've shown how you how this is entirely false as the myth of the family is exactly that. A myth. There was never any real fathers to run out in the first place.
 
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Hatuey said:
I'm not related to ignorant people so please don't call me blood. My interpretation of your point? To make a point you have to actually provide supporting arguments. You made a single statement. That statement is proven untrue. The African American Family as your seemed to want to depict it is a myth.

The belief that once upon a time black families were something like the All American Family is proven to be untrue as the black community has for the most part of the last 150 years been characterized by high levels of not just criminality among males but also higher than average levels of teen pregnancies among females. Do you have any other baseless comments to make displaying your total ignorance of this subject?
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At one time, in this country, black fathers and black mothers lived together and raised their kids together. Obviously, not to the same extent as white failies, but to much larger extent than they do no. The effects on contemporary generations of children of the patriarchal absence is obvious.

Let us not believe the revisionist history. At one time, blacks in America had their **** together. Those days are gone, forever I fear.

I don't blame Libbos, totally, we have ourselves to blame, but the Libbos are constantly insituting policies that hurt blacks more han help them. If these policies were only a decade old, then I could accept ignorance as an excuse, however these policies are half a century old, so ignorance is no longer an excuse. At this point, it can only be the intentional destruction of slf dependence among the members of the black community in America.

The increased divorce rate among blacks has contributed to a decrease in the number of black 2-parent families. In 1970, 68% of black families had both the husband and wife present. This number dropped to just 50% in 1990, a decrease of 18 percentage points over 20 years, compared with a 6-percentage-point decrease over the same time period for white families. Black wives and husbands are also more likely to separate. Sixteen percent of black couples between the ages of 18 and 44 have separated, versus 4% of comparable white couples. Racial differences in divorce and separation rates persist, independent of education and parental marital status.


Black Men And Divorce: Implications For Culturally Competent Practice | Minority Health Today | Find Articles at BNET
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texmaster said:
Finally. This does have real tangible evidence.

And I will concede based the evidence presented does support the argument that children raised by stable lesbian and gay men couples do not according to these studies have an adverse effect on the child being raised.

However, I am concerned to how the data was obtained. One professor that was sourced many times over does not interview the couples or the children but instead relies on questionnaires, a very poor research tool.

. Fifty same-sex partners (25 couples) have completed questionnaires evaluating various individual, marital, parental and social aspects associated to parenthood. Variance analysis of theses aspects have shown the effects of two factors that is, the type of mother (biological/non-biological) and the procreation mode (known/unknown genitor).

http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/cbs/39/2/135/

One on one interviews would have provided far more reliable data because they can evaluate body language and see reactions to certain questions in real time.

Another author, again cited extensively relies only on volunteers which is not a proper sampling.

Existing research on children with lesbian parents is limited by reliance on volunteer or convenience samples.

Children with lesbian parents: a community study. [Dev Psychol. 2003] - PubMed result

Another author whose work is cited is itself citing others instead of doing the research themselves making it harder to track.

http://people.virginia.edu/~cjp/articles/cbrp98.pdf


In your second study we find this:

The study had been based on a convenience sample that had been assembled by word of mouth. It was therefore impossible to rule out the possibility that families who participated in the research
were especially well adjusted.

So we explore more into the article and once again we find the reliance on questionaires mailed to the households with no supervision when they were filled out, if the child was assisted or if another advocacy group assisted the families.

Materials were mailed to participating families, with instructions to complete them privately and return them in self-addressed stamped envelopes we provided.


This is not scientific research and it certainly does not explore the true psychological makeup of the child in these families because if this was out psychotherapy worked, no one would ever visit and therapist.

Again, I do concede if I based my findings solely on the evidence provided in the article and did not investigate the methods they use or the sampling they took, I would concede the conclusions you drew on earlier but now that I have done the research on the authors I find their sampling flawed based on volunteers no doubt eager to show how normal they are or based on questionnaires which are not sufficient to draw conclusions from since their body language and thought process cannot be explored.



I asked you to support yourself with actual evidence which you did. I'm not denying that. But you would do well to dig into the articles and find out why they have to keep citing other studies to support the very conclusions you agree with and what methods they used to gather the data to support those conclusions.

You can't be content because someone cited an article that makes the facts infallible. You have to dig to find out what methods they used to draw their conclusions.

Relying on volunteers and questionnaires for psychological evaluation is flat out lazy science and riddled with inaccuracies. Its the reason psychologists have offices and do not hand out questionnaires and base their findings on what someone wrote down.
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Let me get this right...you took the studies of single parents that Charles provided and argued they are irrefutable evidence of the harm caused to children with the absence of one gender in the home...which is inane beyond words...but then you dissect these studies with critical analysis of the tools of measurement and sampling methods...then you lecture on being objective in analysis. I sense quite a cognitive bias within you.

Frankly, you have made one mistake. You have assumed that the limitations of qualitative measuring methods make them insufficient evidence. But there is a quantitative element to qualitative studies. If we were were only talking about one qualitative study, then you would be correct. But when you have dozens upon dozens of qualitative studies, from various samples across the country and various researchers and various qualitative measuring tools and methods, and all them have concluded that gay and lesbian parents are no better or worse than different sex couples at raising children, then you have a quantitative measure.

Frankly, you have no evidence, aside from misused single parent statistics, to indicate that same sex couples are not adequate parents. The case is far stronger, both qualitatively and quantitatively in support of the argument that same sex parents are no better or worse parents that different sex parents.
 
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Hatuey said:
I've shown how you how this is entirely false as the myth of the family is exactly that. A myth. There was never any real fathers to run out in the first place.
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I feel sorry for you, if you really believe that.
 
apdst said:
At one time, in this country, black fathers and black mothers lived together and raised their kids together. Obviously, not to the same extent as white failies, but to much larger extent than they do no. The effects on contemporary generations of children of the patriarchal absence is obvious.

Let us not believe the revisionist history. At one time, blacks in America had their **** together. Those days are gone, forever I fear.

I don't blame Libbos, totally, we have ourselves to blame, but the Libbos are constantly insituting policies that hurt blacks more han help them. If these policies were only a decade old, then I could accept ignorance as an excuse, however these policies are half a century old, so ignorance is no longer an excuse. At this point, it can only be the intentional destruction of slf dependence among the members of the black community in America.
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And this is not related to liberal stances on any particular issue but to many different sociological factors. Notice how the black single parent rate is about the same for both blacks and whites even though blacks have higher rates of criminality AND drug use problems. If anything it has much to do with women becoming more and more independent in both the work place and at home. Where before women were almost socially forced to have children and provide care for their families, after the 1940s they saw they could be as big a part of the house when it came to providing material support as men.

Single Parent Statistics - Average Single Parent Statistics

She is Divorced or Separated:
Of the mothers who are custodial parents:

* 44% are currently divorced or separated
* 33% have never been married
* 22% are married (In most cases, these numbers represent women who have remarried.)
* 1% were widowed
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Father-only and Mother-only, Single-Parent Family Status of Black Girls and Achievement in Grade Twelve and at Two-years Post High School | Journal of Negro Education, The | Find Articles at BNET

In 1965, Moynihan reinforced this view, linking "pathology" with Black female-headed families, by proposing that Black families were matriarchal which, consequently, caused boys in these families to grow up lacking adequate role models for healthy adult masculinity. The wellknown Moynihan report led to three assumptions that influenced research on families for decades: (a) two-parent families, headed by men, are "better" than one-parent families; (b) single Black women are unskilled parents and this notably affects boys; and (c) Black female-headed families are a deviant cultural norm and, therefore, transmit deviancy to children that negatively influences aspirations and social roles (Moynihan, 1965). There continues to be an ongoing debate about the influence of the single-parent family on a child's development but few studies have examined the impact of single parenting on girls (Collins, 1993; Dickerson, 1995).
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Put two and two together. The high deviancy/criminality rate among blacks was already a problem in the 1960s. This was linked to the number of single black mothers at the time. Meaning it is obviously not something which is even remotely new(30 years old) but something which is the result a lot more than 3 decades of whatever you think liberals did to black families.
 
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apdst said:
I feel sorry for you, if you really believe that.
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.....

smallestviolinwz4.jpg
 
Hatuey said:
And this is not related to liberal stances on any particular issue but to many different sociological factors. Notice how the black single parent rate is about the same for both blacks and whites even though blacks have higher rates of criminality AND drug use problems. If anything it has much to do with women becoming more and more independent in both the work place and at home. Where before women were almost socially forced to have children and provide care for their families, after the 1940s they saw they could be as big a part of the house when it came to providing material support as men.

Single Parent Statistics - Average Single Parent Statistics



Father-only and Mother-only, Single-Parent Family Status of Black Girls and Achievement in Grade Twelve and at Two-years Post High School | Journal of Negro Education, The | Find Articles at BNET



Put two and two together. The high deviancy/criminality rate among blacks was already a problem in the 1960s. This was linked to the number of single black mothers at the time. Meaning it is obviously not something which is even remotely new(30 years old) but something which is the result a lot more than 3 decades of whatever you think liberals did to black families.
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But, there are far more single black mothers who are totall dependent on government handouts. So, yes, you combine that with the divorce rate and you can lay these issues squarely at the feet of the Libbos...white and black Libbos.

The Libbos have spent 40 years and $11 trillion dollars convincing the black community that they can't make it on their own.
 
winston53660 said:
It rained today it must be the libbos fault:roll:
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If it rained on some black kid that's living in the street, then yes, it's the Libbos fault.

Tell me Win, after 40 years and $11 trillion, what improvements have been made within the black community?

Black on black crime gone down? Black divorce rate gone down? Black teen pregnancies gone down? Black un-wed pregnancies gone down? Black drug use gone down? Black welfare rate gone down?

Tell us all the wonderful things that have happened to black since the Libbos decided to, "help".
 
Actually, the African American standard of living has actually gone up. :mrgreen:
 
apdst said:
If it rained on some black kid that's living in the street, then yes, it's the Libbos fault.

Tell me Win, after 40 years and $11 trillion, what improvements have been made within the black community?

Black on black crime gone down? Black divorce rate gone down? Black teen pregnancies gone down? Black un-wed pregnancies gone down? Black drug use gone down? Black welfare rate gone down?

Tell us all the wonderful things that have happened to black since the Libbos decided to, "help".
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Long-term, over the past 16 years, black men have improved their graduation rate from 28 percent to 36 percent.

This year the college graduation rate for black women rose by one percentage point to 47 percent. And over the past 16 years the graduation rates for black women have shown strong and steady gains. Turning in a powerful performance over the past 16 years, black women have improved their college completion rate from 34 percent in 1990 to 47 percent in 2006. So for black women, we appear to be very close to the point where one half of all students who enter a particular college will go on to earn their degree from that same institution.

Black Student College Graduation Rates Inch Higher But the Large Racial Gap Persists
 
winston53660 said:
Long-term, over the past 16 years, black men have improved their graduation rate from 28 percent to 36 percent.

This year the college graduation rate for black women rose by one percentage point to 47 percent. And over the past 16 years the graduation rates for black women have shown strong and steady gains. Turning in a powerful performance over the past 16 years, black women have improved their college completion rate from 34 percent in 1990 to 47 percent in 2006. So for black women, we appear to be very close to the point where one half of all students who enter a particular college will go on to earn their degree from that same institution.

Black Student College Graduation Rates Inch Higher But the Large Racial Gap Persists
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That's it? Are you saying that all you can come up with are few hundred more black college grads each year?

Please, tell us that that isn't your idea of, "success".

It's a shame that you Libbos just don't get it.
 
Hatuey said:
Why don't you try some honesty :





It's fun to debunk your false assertions on black people over and over again.
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You're just wrong:
In 1940, the illegitimacy rate among blacks was 19 percent, in 1960, 22 percent, and today, it's 70 percent. Some argue that the state of the black family is the result of the legacy of slavery, discrimination and poverty. That has to be nonsense. A study of 1880 family structure in Philadelphia shows that three-quarters of black families were nuclear families, comprised of two parents and children. In New York City in 1925, 85 percent of kin-related black households had two parents. In fact, according to Herbert Gutman in "The Black Family in Slavery and Freedom: 1750-1925," "Five in six children under the age of 6 lived with both parents."
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Taylor said:
I doubt it. Why would we even want to look? If it bothers you that blacks use the same drinking fountain as you do, I suggest you do your own research.
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Look up, there's an analogy flying right over your head.
 
Hatuey said:
And this is not related to liberal stances on any particular issue but to many different sociological factors. Notice how the black single parent rate is about the same for both blacks and whites even though blacks have higher rates of criminality AND drug use problems.
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Wrong again:

Figures available from the U.S. Bureau of the Census (which yielded all of the statistics presented here) indicate that the percent of American homes that were single parent in composition increased dramatically from 1970 (when 18.5% of homes were single parent) to 1999 (27.7%).


There are ethnic differences in the prevalence of single-parent families. In 1999 the rate of single-parent families among black families was 56 percent; among Hispanic families, 32 percent; and among white families, 20 percent.
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Wow, what a wicked red herring this has become.

Remind me what the state of the African American community has to do with legalizing gay marriage?
 
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