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Thread: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

  1. #51
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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    To be honest I had never heard of this. I knew about the sub Germans that were captured on American soil, and tried under a Military commission. But not that we kept POW's here.

    it doesn't change how I feel what Obama is doing is wrong, but it was educational. thanks.


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    Professor Charles Martel's Avatar
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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I'm not sure about the whole, "natural", thing, but we did bring German, Italian and Japanese prisoners to the US during WW2. We forced them to perform manual labor. Another war crime.
    Correct, and we gave them no rights.....no access to civilian courts.....no habeas corpus, no Constitutional defense, no ability to even challenge their detentions. During WW2, american citizens were captured by the US and electrocuted after being caught spying and conspiring against the US, Roosevelt wanted to send a message, held tribunals for the handful....and sent them to death, the American citizens afforded life sentences.

    I am sure about the natural thing. It ain't natural at all. There has never been an enemy combatant imprisoned here and given equal rights under our laws. If it was so natural, why didn't any of these 50,000+ Italian prisoners for example be given civilian trials? Why weren't any afforded "natural" habeas corpus? Why weren't any permitted to challenge their detentions?

    Those arguing natural or arguing precedence here, need to explain. Why is this decision by Obama so "natural" if it's simply never happened before? Ever?
    It was the Austrasians, that hewed on bravely through the thick of the fight, it was they who found and cut down the Saracen King.

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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by windovervocalcords View Post
    If you want to whine for the next four years, knock yourself out.
    I'm used to it

    I did it for 8 years under Bush and expect to do it for 8 years under Obama. From a libertarian point of view, there's not a nickel's worth of difference between the two.

  4. #54
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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Martel View Post
    Correct, and we gave them no rights.....no access to civilian courts.....no habeas corpus, no Constitutional defense, no ability to even challenge their detentions. During WW2, american citizens were captured by the US and electrocuted after being caught spying and conspiring against the US, Roosevelt wanted to send a message, held tribunals for the handful....and sent them to death, the American citizens afforded life sentences.

    I am sure about the natural thing. It ain't natural at all. There has never been an enemy combatant imprisoned here and given equal rights under our laws. If it was so natural, why didn't any of these 50,000+ Italian prisoners for example be given civilian trials? Why weren't any afforded "natural" habeas corpus? Why weren't any permitted to challenge their detentions?

    Those arguing natural or arguing precedence here, need to explain. Why is this decision by Obama so "natural" if it's simply never happened before? Ever?
    Not only that, the Supreme Court has already decided that military tribunals are constitutional and enemy combatants don't have rights under our constitution.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Professor Charles Martel's Avatar
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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by CrusaderRabbit08 View Post
    I'm used to it

    I did it for 8 years under Bush and expect to do it for 8 years under Obama. From a libertarian point of view, there's not a nickel's worth of difference between the two.
    We're discussing bringing detainees to America...and granting them rights under our laws, that's quite a bit more than a nickel difference
    It was the Austrasians, that hewed on bravely through the thick of the fight, it was they who found and cut down the Saracen King.

  6. #56
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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Martel View Post
    We're discussing bringing detainees to America...and granting them rights under our laws, that's quite a bit more than a nickel difference
    No, it's only 4.37

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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by CrusaderRabbit08 View Post
    No, it's only 4.37
    He spending hundreds of millions to hold trials in NY and house prisoners in Illinois. So, not only is your argument dead wrong, your colossal math mistake here doesn't go unnoticed either.
    It was the Austrasians, that hewed on bravely through the thick of the fight, it was they who found and cut down the Saracen King.

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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Not only that, the Supreme Court has already decided that military tribunals are constitutional and enemy combatants don't have rights under our constitution.
    True enough and the Supreme Court actually didn't need to rule. Enemies captured abroad have simply NEVER been afforded any Constitutional rights whatsoever. Ever. This would be unprecedented, so, not only don't I understand arguments this Obama policy is "natural", I don't understand why there is any confusion whatsoever. NO enemy combatant has EVER received rights, Supreme Court ruling or no Supreme Court ruling.
    It was the Austrasians, that hewed on bravely through the thick of the fight, it was they who found and cut down the Saracen King.

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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    AP sources: Ill. prison to get Gitmo detainees - Yahoo! News



    Is it just me, or did anyone else get the impression that closing Gitmo did NOT equate to transferring prisoners held there to U.S. prisons, without charging them, without submitting them to a trial, and without a conviction.

    How, exactly, is this an improvement?
    Are you questioning Obama!? Are you seriously questioning Obama? The man CLOSED Gitmo. Closed. That's it. And now just because some dilapidated jail in Illinois, which happens to be the State Obama is from, is getting a bunch of Gitmo inmates meaning that the State is going to receive a good chunk of federal money to fix the jail, staff the jail, and keep it running for indefinitely doesn't mean that Obama didn't close Gitmo. He closed it, closed it good. And now a bunch of people in Illinois get a lot of money. Not connected, don't look into it.

    But you Catz, I just can't believe the gall you have to raise objection to Obama. It's hope and change! I hope you've learned your lesson and will never again question the good works of Obama, the Hope and Change bringer.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: Illinois prison to get Gitmo detainees

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Are you questioning Obama!? Are you seriously questioning Obama? The man CLOSED Gitmo. Closed. That's it. And now just because some dilapidated jail in Illinois, which happens to be the State Obama is from, is getting a bunch of Gitmo inmates meaning that the State is going to receive a good chunk of federal money to fix the jail, staff the jail, and keep it running for indefinitely doesn't mean that Obama didn't close Gitmo. He closed it, closed it good. And now a bunch of people in Illinois get a lot of money. Not connected, don't look into it.

    But you Catz, I just can't believe the gall you have to raise objection to Obama. It's hope and change! I hope you've learned your lesson and will never again question the good works of Obama, the Hope and Change bringer.
    Thank you for those instructional swats, sir. I needed them.

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