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Italian court convicts Amanda Knox of murder

Ethereal said:
There's an appeals process, so it's not over yet. Since the initial trial was a complete farce, she will probably be acquitted.
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I am interested to see where this case goes.
 
aps said:
I am interested to see where this case goes.
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Here's what my business law profressor said about it:

One very interesting difference bewteen the two systems is her rights on appeal: In our system, only the application of the law can be challenged on appeal. The facts as presented in the original trial may not be challenged or re-argued. Under the Italian appeals system, however, both the adjudication of the facts and the application of the law in the original trial may be challenged and re-argued, giving her a much better opportunity to have the conviction reversed on appeal.
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Ethereal said:
Here's what my business law profressor said about it:
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I think your business law professor was a little off, can't you can 're-argue' the 'facts' in a case by challenging the constitutionality of evidence? I know a lot of appeals can be turned over due to errors in procedural law and that includes the gathering and handling of evidence.
 
EpicDude86 said:
I think your business law professor was a little off...
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I doubt that...:2razz:

...can't you can 're-argue' the 'facts' in a case by challenging the constitutionality of evidence? I know a lot of appeals can be turned over due to errors in procedural law and that includes the gathering and handling of evidence.
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Errors in procedural law do not pertain to questions of fact.

A question of law would be: Was the murder weapon obtained legally?

A question of fact would be: Is it really the murder weapon?

The adjudication of facts, in the American system, cannot be challenged on appeal; a jury has the final say on issues of fact.
 
Scarecrow Akhbar said:
Amanda Knox had a fair trial in the land where she committed her crime.

End of story, there.
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Did you even look at the evidence before you decided to run your mouth? No? I guess you'd better STFU then. Kthxbai. :2wave:
 
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Kandahar said:
Did you even look at the evidence before you decided to run your mouth? No? I guess you'd better STFU then. Kthxbai. :2wave:
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Well he may have a point; if no one in Italy is shouting "UNFAIR TRIAL! UNFAIR TRIAL!" then perhaps she received a fair Italian trial. That's nothing to do with comparing it to our court system.
 
Kandahar said:
Did you even look at the evidence before you decided to run your mouth? No? I guess you'd better STFU then. Kthxbai. :2wave:
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Kandahar, while I appreciate your believing in Knox's innocence, must you act in this incredibly aggressive manner whenever someone chooses to believe she's guilty or received a fair trial? Look at Ethereal. He provides rational posts in making his arguments about why the facts have been misrepresented. You say, STFU? What is the matter with you?
 
EpicDude86 said:
Well he may have a point; if no one in Italy is shouting "UNFAIR TRIAL! UNFAIR TRIAL!" then perhaps she received a fair Italian trial. That's nothing to do with comparing it to our court system.
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I think this is the largest sticking point....We are comparing it to our own rules of procedure, and such.


j-mac
 
Interestingly, yesterday, when I was re-reading the article that Arcana posted, I got into an argument with a co-worker on our way home from work because he said, "There's too much evidence against her for her to be innocent." I was playing Ethereal and Kandahar on my way home. ;) That shows how far I have come.
 
aps said:
Kandahar, while I appreciate your believing in Knox's innocence, must you act in this incredibly aggressive manner whenever someone chooses to believe she's guilty or received a fair trial? Look at Ethereal. He provides rational posts in making his arguments about why the facts have been misrepresented. You say, STFU? What is the matter with you?
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I love it when Liberals fight one another........:applaud
 
aps said:
Interestingly, yesterday, when I was re-reading the article that Arcana posted, I got into an argument with a co-worker on our way home from work because he said, "There's too much evidence against her for her to be innocent." I was playing Ethereal and Kandahar on my way home. ;) That shows how far I have come.
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He's obviously in way over his head...:2razz:
 
Rudy Guede got his sentenced reduced from 30 to 16 years on appeal.

BBC News - Kercher killer Rudy Guede has sentence reduced

A man jailed for 30 years for killing UK student Meredith Kercher has had his sentence almost halved on appeal.
Rudy Guede, 23, will now serve 16 years for killing the Leeds University student from Surrey, who was found with her throat slit in Perugia in 2007.
Small-time drug dealer Guede fled to Germany but was arrested on a train and extradited to Italy to stand trial.
Amanda Knox, 22, and her former lover Raffaele Sollecito, 25, were jailed for Miss Kercher's murder last month.
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aps said:
Holy Crap. There is no question that this guy was involved in Kercher's death. His criminal background is appalling. Yet he will serve only 16 years? What a blow to Kercher's family. Jesus. Italy has no morals.
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haven't you been listening to Obama? we must become more like Europe, guess all those that died in the Revolutionary war was for naught

/sarcasm

Can not believe a life is only worth 16 years over there. *crosses Italy off future travel plans*
 
DeeJayH said:
haven't you been listening to Obama? we must become more like Europe, guess all those that died in the Revolutionary war was for naught

/sarcasm

Can not believe a life is only worth 16 years over there. *crosses Italy off future travel plans*
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I crossed off ever going to Aruba after the Natalee Holoway case. There's no respect there for human life. I may have to do the same thing to Italy. Ewwwwwww.

We better see a similar ruling for Amanda Knox.
 
aps said:
I crossed off ever going to Aruba after the Natalee Holoway case. There's no respect there for human life. I may have to do the same thing to Italy. Ewwwwwww.

We better see a similar ruling for Amanda Knox.
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well as a guy, natalee is a good reason for me to GO to Aruba :doh;) LOL
 
DeeJayH said:
haven't you been listening to Obama? we must become more like Europe, guess all those that died in the Revolutionary war was for naught

/sarcasm

Can not believe a life is only worth 16 years over there. *crosses Italy off future travel plans*
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aps said:
I crossed off ever going to Aruba after the Natalee Holoway case. There's no respect there for human life. I may have to do the same thing to Italy. Ewwwwwww.

We better see a similar ruling for Amanda Knox.
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Maybe I should cross off the old US of A off my list too then. After an innocent man who is very dear to someone I love was sent to prison for a crime he did not commit, his name will probably be on the sex offenders list for a few more years AFTER he gets out and his young life is pretty much destroyed along with that of his wife. All for the "crime" of mistakenly downloading kiddie porn on Lime Wire when all he wanted was regular porn. Possession alone was enough to send him to jail for 10 years, even if he never meant to possess any of that stuff.

Please clean up your own backyard before you go pointing fingers elsewhere. You're jailing innocents too and letting real criminals off for good behavior every day.
 
Arcana XV said:
Maybe I should cross off the old US of A off my list too then. After an innocent man who is very dear to someone I love was sent to prison for a crime he did not commit, his name will probably be on the sex offenders list for a few more years AFTER he gets out and his young life is pretty much destroyed along with that of his wife. All for the "crime" of mistakenly downloading kiddie porn on Lime Wire when all he wanted was regular porn. Possession alone was enough to send him to jail for 10 years, even if he never meant to possess any of that stuff.

Please clean up your own backyard before you go pointing fingers elsewhere. You're jailing innocents too and letting real criminals off for good behavior every day.
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Not to mention the whole OJ fiasco. Everything about that trial was a joke.
 
aps said:
I fully support this conviction. I watched the news reports on this trial. They showed Amanda Knox smiling and laughing in the court room. Excuse me? You're on trial for murder and you can't stop smiling? Sorry, but someone who was truly innocent, wouldn't be looking at these charges lightly, IMO. She cried when the verdict was read. Oh brother. I'm not sympathetic.
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Amanda Knox is innocent and victim of corrupted italian "justice".
 
Arcana XV said:
Maybe I should cross off the old US of A off my list too then. After an innocent man who is very dear to someone I love was sent to prison for a crime he did not commit, his name will probably be on the sex offenders list for a few more years AFTER he gets out and his young life is pretty much destroyed along with that of his wife. All for the "crime" of mistakenly downloading kiddie porn on Lime Wire when all he wanted was regular porn. Possession alone was enough to send him to jail for 10 years, even if he never meant to possess any of that stuff.

Please clean up your own backyard before you go pointing fingers elsewhere. You're jailing innocents too and letting real criminals off for good behavior every day.
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actually I believe he will be on a sex offenders list for life unless he can get his conviction overturned. Did your 'supposed friend' (bogus emotional figment) turn in the kiddie porn to the authorities so they could track the source, or did he just jack off to it every day?
 
Arcana XV said:
Maybe I should cross off the old US of A off my list too then. After an innocent man who is very dear to someone I love was sent to prison for a crime he did not commit, his name will probably be on the sex offenders list for a few more years AFTER he gets out and his young life is pretty much destroyed along with that of his wife. All for the "crime" of mistakenly downloading kiddie porn on Lime Wire when all he wanted was regular porn. Possession alone was enough to send him to jail for 10 years, even if he never meant to possess any of that stuff.

Please clean up your own backyard before you go pointing fingers elsewhere. You're jailing innocents too and letting real criminals off for good behavior every day.
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But I don't have a problem with someone crossing off the USA on their list. It could be for any reason. (I hate Hollywood. I hate Americans. I hate OJ Simpson. I hate aps.) Why would you impose what DeeJay and I expressed on yourself? Or go out of your way to criticize us for how we feel? If I don't respect the way a country treats US citizens, that is MY pregorative. You are Arcana, and I am aps. You do what you do, and I do what I do. I'm completely baffled by your pontification.

I agree--what happened to your friend, if the facts are as you say they are, is horrible.
 
aps said:
I agree--what happened to your friend, if the facts are as you say they are, is horrible.
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The real horrible part is that he's not the first and he won't be the last this happens to. Innocent people are being caught in this net all the time. It's come to the point where when I read stories about how the FBI boasts on the news about catching a whole "ring" of child-porn consumers I wonder just how many of them are completely innocent.
 
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