• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

Changing to gay isn't the same as choosing to be gay.

She realized she was gay. She didn't sit down and say "you know, life is boring, I think I'll go gay." That's ridiculous.

'Family Ties' Mom Meredith Baxter Joins Group of Later-in-Life Lesbians

A 'Family Ties' Mom Meredith Baxter Reveals She's a Lesbian - ABC News

woman changes from straight to gay after 3 marriages

"I am a lesbian and it was a later-in-life recognition," Baxter said on NBC's "Today" show. "Some people would say, well, you're living a lie and, you know, the truth is -- not at all. This has only been for the past seven years."

Baxter, 62 and thrice divorced, came out following the National Enquirer's November report that she was spotted "traveling with a female friend" on a Caribbean cruise sponsored by lesbian travel company Sweet.
 
That's exactly how I feel about it. And I think we are at a moment in time that is ripe for a crushing defeat to true bigotry on all fronts. Not only are gays not attacked like they used to be but we are a courted political and marketing force now. Our dollar and our votes are looked at as important. We have a black president in the white house and our society is struggling toward pluralism and cultural integration.

Forces of intolerance and groups that clearly lobby for inequality are only being funded by religious zealots and fundamental nutjobs who have shown themselves to be more interested in their agenda rather than the morality they claim drives the agenda. All over the country, groups like Focus on the Family, NARTH, and other family values organizations are losing all credibility as their leaders are exposing themselves, in the best cases, as fallible human beings and, in the worst cases, as fraudulent charlatans. The zealous devotion that holds them together is being frayed by realism and the acceptance that eventually they are going to lose anyway.

I don't think this fight is going to last another decade. Maybe 15 years at most and we will have full marriage for everyone in this country. I also believe in another 50 years most bigotry and intolerance will be thought of as being sooooo last century.

But I can be something of an optimist at times so take what I say with a grain of salt.

Agreed Jall, but I hope it happens soon with the marriage thing. I'm not sure about bigotry though. Ignorant people will always be fearful of the "other."
 
Changing to gay isn't the same as choosing to be gay.

She realized she was gay. She didn't sit down and say "you know, life is boring, I think I'll go gay." That's ridiculous.

Yeah after 3 marriages and a half dozens kids she found out she was gay.........:rofl
 
'Family Ties' Mom Meredith Baxter Joins Group of Later-in-Life Lesbians

A 'Family Ties' Mom Meredith Baxter Reveals She's a Lesbian - ABC News

woman changes from straight to gay after 3 marriages

"I am a lesbian and it was a later-in-life recognition," Baxter said on NBC's "Today" show. "Some people would say, well, you're living a lie and, you know, the truth is -- not at all. This has only been for the past seven years."

Baxter, 62 and thrice divorced, came out following the National Enquirer's November report that she was spotted "traveling with a female friend" on a Caribbean cruise sponsored by lesbian travel company Sweet.

Perhaps she's bisexual and doesn't quite know what to call it. Some people are attracted to both sexes.
 
Agreed Jall, but I hope it happens soon with the marriage thing. I'm not sure about bigotry though. Ignorant people will always be fearful of the "other."

You ****ing lefties crack me up, and we on the right are suppose to be the intolerant ones.............Yeah right.......:roll:
 
'Family Ties' Mom Meredith Baxter Joins Group of Later-in-Life Lesbians

A 'Family Ties' Mom Meredith Baxter Reveals She's a Lesbian - ABC News

woman changes from straight to gay after 3 marriages

"I am a lesbian and it was a later-in-life recognition," Baxter said on NBC's "Today" show. "Some people would say, well, you're living a lie and, you know, the truth is -- not at all. This has only been for the past seven years."

Baxter, 62 and thrice divorced, came out following the National Enquirer's November report that she was spotted "traveling with a female friend" on a Caribbean cruise sponsored by lesbian travel company Sweet.

Hey look Navy, looking at her own words, she did not change, she finally recognized what she was..........Maybe, just maybe we have a bit of insight now as to why her 3 marriages failed......I am willing to bet she knows more about her situation than you........and she did not say she changed, but recognized..........this is a less than subtle difference..........
 
Homosexuality is a fetish. a kink. Whether genetic or learned, or whatever, it gets someone off and that's why they partake in it. :D And in the case of Ms. Baxter some people 'realize' it later than others. And ****, perhaps 3 failed marriages wasn't because she was 'lesbian' but because she just wasn't the marriage type or her husbands weren't either.
 
Last edited:
You can of course document that claim, true?

You can actually document this phenomenon yourself. Ask people who engage in homosexual activity why they partake. It's my belief true enough, and one I've drawn from looking at both sides of the debate on what homosexuality is. So documentation, there is little, but inferences drawn there are a lot. :D

Sorry if my opinion is ****ty.
 
You can actually document this phenomenon yourself. Ask people who engage in homosexual activity why they partake. It's my belief true enough, and one I've drawn from looking at both sides of the debate on what homosexuality is. So documentation, there is little, but inferences drawn there are a lot. :D

Sorry if my opinion is ****ty.

So it's your guess, that you stated as a fact. I am going to guess you are 100 % wrong.
 
So it's your guess, that you stated as a fact. I am going to guess you are 100 % wrong.

Well it makes sense and it lends itself to a lot less arguing about asinine **** that isn't proven one way or the other. But hey, thanks for the confidence.
 
Yeah after 3 marriages and a half dozens kids she found out she was gay.........:rofl

We don't exactly live in a society where being gay is as acceptable as you would like to think. Plus, not everyone realizes this stuff right away. During her interview on the Today show she said that she had problems in all of her past hetero relationships and she had always thought she was just bad at picking men, but then realized that the problem was her. She's happier than she's ever been in her current relationship. Is it really that far fetched? Then again, I wouldn't expect someone like you to understand or empathize with someone in that situation.
 
Last edited:
Well it makes sense and it lends itself to a lot less arguing about asinine **** that isn't proven one way or the other. But hey, thanks for the confidence.

No, it makes no sense. Let me ask you a question: when a gay person is not engaged in sex, do they stop being gay until the next time they have sex? See how ludicrous the kink/fetish argument is?
 
No, it makes no sense. Let me ask you a question: when a gay person is not engaged in sex, do they stop being gay until the next time they have sex? See how ludicrous the kink/fetish argument is?

Well does a person that is into BDSM stop being into it when they're not having sex? No, they just don't have sex 24/7, that's all. homosexuality is a sexual thing. It doesn't define a person anymore than their favorite food.
 
Well does a person that is into BDSM stop being into it when they're not having sex? No, they just don't have sex 24/7, that's all. homosexuality is a sexual thing. It doesn't define a person anymore than their favorite food.

I am not sure if that is true. It is quite possible to identify young children who are more likely to become gay. CC I think it was linked to a study showing male children who where more effeminate where more likely to grow up to be gay.
 
I am not sure if that is true. It is quite possible to identify young children who are more likely to become gay. CC I think it was linked to a study showing male children who where more effeminate where more likely to grow up to be gay.

Ok, and? Predicting if someone will enjoy homosexual activity is not an exact science, as I know plenty of effeminate guys who tear the poonani up, and plenty of masculine guys who love penis more than they love oxygen (the reason the study may not have shown this is because a lot of masculine gay men don't openly show it for a multitude of reasons, especially when they are younger or have reason to remain closeted.)

Why does 'homosexual' have to be associated with effeminacy? That's part of a societal stigma that has blurred the lines.
 
Hey look Navy, looking at her own words, she did not change, she finally recognized what she was..........Maybe, just maybe we have a bit of insight now as to why her 3 marriages failed......I am willing to bet she knows more about her situation than you........and she did not say she changed, but recognized..........this is a less than subtle difference..........

she figured it out at age 62, 3 marriage and 6 kids...............She sure as hell must have enjoyed her life as a straight woman.........:2wave:
 
she figured it out at age 62, 3 marriage and 6 kids...............She sure as hell must have enjoyed her life as a straight woman.........:2wave:

I'm sensing the irony here that is Navy has latent homosexual desires and will one day get dirty with another man. Truth time: What is your homosexual fantasy/scenario? And if you say "I don't have one" you're a liar and an even bigger closet practitioner of homosexuality than I originally thought.

I'll even go first.

I'd go homosexual for Johnny Depp. My girlfriend is even in agreement.
 
Ok, and? Predicting if someone will enjoy homosexual activity is not an exact science, as I know plenty of effeminate guys who tear the poonani up, and plenty of masculine guys who love penis more than they love oxygen (the reason the study may not have shown this is because a lot of masculine gay men don't openly show it for a multitude of reasons, especially when they are younger or have reason to remain closeted.)

Why does 'homosexual' have to be associated with effeminacy? That's part of a societal stigma that has blurred the lines.

You are putting too much into something not so complicated. At young ages, children have no sexual identity, and yet it is possible with some reliability to identify which are likely to become gay. Being gay transcends the act of sex, sex is only the most outward aspect of it.
 
she figured it out at age 62, 3 marriage and 6 kids...............She sure as hell must have enjoyed her life as a straight woman.........:2wave:

There is a word for your comments here Navy: assumptions. You are making guesses with incomplete data, and at odds with the report from the person with firsthand knowledge. Not a good move.
 
You are putting too much into something not so complicated.

Actually, I'm looking at this from a relatively simple point of view as opposed to the people who can go back and forth between things such as genetics vs learned behavior, etc.

At young ages, children have no sexual identity, and yet it is possible with some reliability to identify which are likely to become gay.

Is it a significantly accurate number? How many times are those effeminate children that are thought to 'grow up to be homosexual' turn out to be hetero. And then factor in how many masculine males turn out to be 'gay'. I still want to see why effeminacy is any way to judge homosexuality and why is it even associated? Oh wait, because it's a societal stigma. Homosexuals rage from super masculine to ultra effeminate, Men and women.

Being gay transcends the act of sex, sex is only the most outward aspect of it.

Being GAY might, but being homosexual doesn't transcend sex. What I'm saying is most sexual kinks have a "lifestyle" that go along with them, homosexuality is no exception to this, and thus the gay "lifestyle" can be a product of a number of things:

1. Stereotyping and Roles (the 'woman' in a homosexual relationships often acts effeminate, but not always)
2. Attention whoring (Gay Pride! We're here, We're Queer, Get used to it!),
3. Forced closet lives.

I'm sure there are more factors to why they live the lifestyles, these are just three I can think of off the top of my head.
 
Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

Well then, old people and people that cannot have children shouldn't be allowed to marry according to your archaic logic.

Sorry but the whole, marriage is for creating children is not a valid reason to exclude a couple from marriage.




"Well, it's pretty simple. Marriage is a social, religious and legal institution that is constructed around the natural and exclusive sexual relationship between one adult male and one adult female. The obvious benefit of this sexual exclusivity that is grounded in social norms, religious convention and common law is primarily to the children created by this union. Since gays cannot produce children, a homosexual relationship, exclusive or not, serves no purpose for which the definition of marriage ought to be changed."




How does old people not being able to procreate justify changing the existing definition of marriage?

It's still one man marrying one woman.

Exclude?

Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

At the top of the list are close relatives, minors, third parties, the insane, those in a persistent vegetative state, etc.

What logical reason could you give for not including persons of the same sex on the list?
 
Last edited:
Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

How does old people not being able to procreate justify changing the existing definition of marriage?

If you would have followed the thread, when I commented, the argument was given that since a homosexual couple cannot reproduce, they shouldn't be allowed to marry. That is not a valid reason, especially since a lesbian couple actually CAN reproduce through artificial insemination.

Please do try and keep up.
 
That claim.

You are confused.

The claim was made that people are born gay,

Remember, I'm not the one who made the claim. I simply demanded evidence which no one could provide.

Yes there was a fruit fly theory which was exposed for the fraud that it is then a twin gay study in which not only was it never even 50% of the time accurate, it was even less when the twins did not grow up together.

You cannot prove a genetic link in even a low number like 60% so how can you claim that people are born gay?

Please, answer the original question.
 
Back
Top Bottom