New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

Laila · Dec 4, 2009

Erod said:
Among extremely young people, I think it played a role, yes.

Please don't use Britain as an example of anything. Your once great nation is irrelevent these days, other than that it will soon be predominantly Muslim. You've allowed your heritage, culture, and religious foundations to be destroyed by liberalism and socialism.

Any proof for that claim?
I would wager media and celebrity culture has caused more people to have oral sex rather than Clinton.
He would put people off having blow jobs thanks.

LOL
Predominantly Muslim ... Your one of those types, I see.

As I said.
Europe has had Gay marriage. Has not damaged/destroyed/devalued marriage for straights.
This is straight up ignorance.

Erod · Dec 4, 2009

jallman said:
Back this up with links or it didn't happen.

So they didn't discuss current events in California in the classroom? We did in Texas every school day of every year.

Erod · Dec 4, 2009

Laila said:
I would wager media and celebrity culture has caused more people to have oral sex rather than Clinton.

Clinton made media celebrity and the presidency one in the same.

Laila · Dec 4, 2009

Erod said:
Clinton made media celebrity and the presidency one in the same.

You ignored:

Europe has had Gay marriage. Has not damaged/destroyed/devalued marriage for straights.

Gay marriage (or rather, I should just call it 'marriage') has had no negative impact in Europe.
If anything, it has re enforced the importance of marriage.

Erod · Dec 4, 2009

Laila said:
Predominantly Muslim ... Your one of those types, I see.

As I said.
Europe has had Gay marriage. Has not damaged/destroyed/devalued marriage for straights.
This is straight up ignorance.

You have a hugely growing issue of radical Islam growing within your borders. Huge. I say this with great sadness, but I fear your country is in for an attack of massive proportions, and relatively soon at that.

As far as ignorance regarding gay marriage, I wonder what Churchill or Thatcher would say. I'd bet you have little regard for either of them; I happen to put both up there with the finest people who ever walked the earth.

Laila · Dec 4, 2009

Erod said:
You have a hugely growing issue of radical Islam growing within your borders. Huge. I say this with great sadness, but I fear your country is in for an attack of massive proportions, and relatively soon at that.

Why don't you let us British deal with what is in our border and worry about your own country. Thanks.

As far as ignorance regarding gay marriage, I wonder what Churchill or Thatcher would say. I'd bet you have little regard for either of them; I happen to put both up there with the finest people who ever walked the earth.

Thatcher is near death and Churchill is dead. I would hardly put weight on what they would say especially if it is discriminatory.

Society evolves and changes. Move with it or get left behind.
You have no proof gay marriage is harmful in anyway

jallman · Dec 4, 2009

Erod said:
So they didn't discuss current events in California in the classroom? We did in Texas every school day of every year.

Links or it didn't happen.

Erod · Dec 4, 2009

Laila said:
Why don't you let us British deal with what is in our border and worry about your own country. Thanks.

Thatcher is near death and Churchill is dead. I would hardly put weight on what they would say especially if it is discriminatory.

Society evolves and changes. Move with it or get left behind.
You have no proof gay marriage is harmful in anyway

First off, please know that I have a genuine appreciation for your country, I really do. I am truly worried about this, and I realize there isn't nothing I can do, but it bothers me greatly. We're all getting comfortable as 9/11 fades into history, which is what makes us ripe for yet another.

To the other point, society changes, but it doesn't necessarily evolve. I don't "move with it" unless it seems worth moving with. Cheating on one's spuose is commonplace these days, as is divorce and having kids out of wedlock, but I'm not joining that crowd either.

I'm just an old boring one-woman-and-three-kids, til-death-do-us-part-kind Christian kind of guy. I'm a dinosaur.

Laila · Dec 4, 2009

Erod said:
First off, please know that I have a genuine appreciation for your country, I really do. I am truly worried about this, and I realize there isn't nothing I can do, but it bothers me greatly. We're all getting comfortable as 9/11 fades into history, which is what makes us ripe for yet another.

To the other point, society changes, but it doesn't necessarily evolve. I don't "move with it" unless it seems worth moving with. Cheating on one's spuose is commonplace these days, as is divorce and having kids out of wedlock, but I'm not joining that crowd either.

I'm just an old boring one-woman-and-three-kids, til-death-do-us-part-kind Christian kind of guy. I'm a dinosaur.

Erm thanks ... I think

Another 9/11? Well I highly doubt that. The terrorists were lucky first time round. I have a feeling US stepped up its airport controls.

Ofc it evolves.
Look at US. A 100 years ago, you had slaves and discriminated against anything not a WASP.
It has adapted and changed as the world changed and attitudes evolved.
I see society progressing as only a positive thing.

I observe this debate that is occuring in US in regards to gay marriage with bemusement. All this whining and crying for nothing. It changes nothing.

I always wonder if those against gay marriage have a **** marriage themselves and whether the worth of it is dependent on gays not getting married.

Erod · Dec 4, 2009

jallman said:
Links or it didn't happen.

Don't think I'd better search that on a work computer. LOL

jallman · Dec 4, 2009

Erod said:
Don't think I'd better search that on a work computer. LOL

Well that I can agree with.

Erod · Dec 4, 2009

Laila said:
Ofc it evolves.
Look at US. A 100 years ago, you had slaves and discriminated against anything not a WASP.

No, we didn't have slaves in 1910, and discrimination was in every country, It still is in most at far greater levels than here. It's certainly prevalent in Great Britain, too, just as much as here and you haven't near the population, territory, or cultural differences we do.

And I resent the slave point because EVERY world power in world history was built with slaves. It's just an ugly truth of history; there was no other way to build a country because the economy didn't exist to both build and recruit a military and build a world power without it. Jeez, there's still slavery in the world. I'm not defending the abomination of slavery, just pointing out the truth of its historical use. Persian, Roman, British, etc, empires were born this way.

How many countries do you know that killed off 750,000 of its own people to get rid of slavery?

hazlnut · Dec 4, 2009

obvious Child said:
Do you actually disagree that some gays feel that way? Note, not all gays, but SOME gays?

IMO, overly militant gays pushing for gay marriage do far more damage towards public opinion then anything the anti-gay marriage crowed can do.

I was only trying to call someone out for posting bigoted, homophobic comments. Apparently (per the red infraction) I'm not allowed to do that any more.

Gay marriage is a civil rights issue. The entire country would be better off if we would embrace values of Love and Tolerance 24/7 instead of just for 1 hour on Sundays.

Christian-right is a bunch of hypocrites and they know absolutely nothing about the Bible. The versions most of them now read have been so distorted and grossly mistranslated, it's sad. NIV, the Living Bible--sorry folks, those are gross rewrites of the Bible.

My Catholic Church is not doing much better, allowing out of touch old men to decide what Jesus would do.

Very sad. New York, a world cultural center, sill trapped by fear and backward puritan thought.

Erod · Dec 4, 2009

hazlnut said:
Gay marriage is a civil rights issue.

This is where you lose me. First of all, "gay marriage" is a contradictory phrase. It's like playing basketball on a football field. The definition of marriage, in the history of history, never considered such a thing. You'd have to call it something else entirely.

I know that's an old point in this controversy, but it's the heart of it still to this day.

winston53660 · Dec 4, 2009

Erod said:
This is where you lose me. First of all, "gay marriage" is a contradictory phrase. It's like playing basketball on a football field. The definition of marriage, in the history of history, never considered such a thing. You'd have to call it something else entirely.

I know that's an old point in this controversy, but it's the heart of it still to this day.

Gay marriage has occured in history. Ill link later.

jallman · Dec 4, 2009

hazlnut said:
Christian-right is a bunch of hypocrites and they know absolutely nothing about the Bible. The versions most of them now read have been so distorted and grossly mistranslated, it's sad. NIV, the Living Bible--sorry folks, those are gross rewrites of the Bible.

I don't know about the Living Bible but the NIV is more accurately translated that the KJV. Just sayin'.

Goobieman · Dec 4, 2009

hazlnut said:
Gay marriage is a civil rights issue.

Can't be - marriage is a privilege graned by the state, and thus, not a right.

The entire country would be better off if we would embrace values of Love and Tolerance 24/7 instead of just for 1 hour on Sundays.

That would mean you'd have to stop insulting those that disagree with you.

NDNdancer · Dec 4, 2009

Those of you who are anti-gay marriage on moral grounds.. i.e. the gay is morally wrong!..... Are you willing to go the gamut? If you truly believe that, then what's the next step? Should we ban homosexual everything? Even to denying them freedom and life as Uganda's prepared to do?

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...rch-leader-brands-anti-gay-bill-genocide.html

The moment you deny people equal rights, you begin that slide down the slippery slope.

Goobieman · Dec 4, 2009

NDNdancer said:
The moment you deny people equal rights, you begin that slide down the slippery slope.

Marriage is a privilege graned by the state, and thus, not a right.

TheNextEra · Dec 4, 2009

Goobieman said:
Marriage is a privilege graned by the state, and thus, not a right.

Yeah that's why states are allowed to have interracial marriage bans. :doh

jallman · Dec 4, 2009

Goobieman said:
Marriage is a privilege graned by the state, and thus, not a right.

That may be true in the most gross oversimplification of the issue, but the fact is that the State is not permitted to grant privileges to some without granting equal privileges to all. The State is not permitted to create a state sanctioned privileged class.

Your assertion is false.

EpicDude86 · Dec 4, 2009

jallman said:
That may be true in the most gross oversimplification of the issue, but the fact is that the State is not permitted to grant privileges to some without granting equal privileges to all. The State is not permitted to create a state sanctioned privileged class.

Your assertion is false.

Actually the state can grant privileges, however these usually have to be 'earned' or 'qualified for' rather than just given. Like tax breaks, drivers licenses, or welfare services, etc.

Dav · Dec 4, 2009

NDNdancer said:
Those of you who are anti-gay marriage on moral grounds.. i.e. the gay is morally wrong!..... Are you willing to go the gamut? If you truly believe that, then what's the next step? Should we ban homosexual everything? Even to denying them freedom and life as Uganda's prepared to do?

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...rch-leader-brands-anti-gay-bill-genocide.html

The moment you deny people equal rights, you begin that slide down the slippery slope.

Not even close to being the same thing.

Marriage laws don't discriminate against gays; they define marriage as being between a man and a woman, as they always have.

jallman · Dec 4, 2009

EpicDude86 said:
Actually the state can grant privileges, however these usually have to be 'earned' or 'qualified for' rather than just given. Like tax breaks, drivers licenses, or welfare services, etc.

True, but they can't extend these privileges to some while having an overarching discriminatory policy against others.

They cannot create a privileged class.

EpicDude86 · Dec 4, 2009

Goobieman said:
Can't be - marriage is a privilege graned by the state, and thus, not a right.

It falls under "Life, Liberty, and Pursuit of Property (Happiness)" and as such should not have to be GIVEN by the state, but rather protected from being taken away without due process or a damn good reason. Buttsecks is not a good reason to deny Homosexuals the right to Same-Sex marriage.

New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

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