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Thread: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

  1. #661
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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Stryker View Post
    Which lesbian donates the semen?

    You still haven't provided a compelling reason for altering the definition of marriage.
    Again, procreation is not a requirement for marriage. Therefore saying gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because they can't procreate with each other is invalid.

    The compelling reason is that rights are being denied to a group of people that:

    #1 it is not illegal to be gay
    #2 it is not illegal to be in a gay relationship between consenting adults (non family)
    #3 It is not illegal for gays to raise children

    Therefore it shouldn't be illegal for them to marry.

    Now if you want to go down the slippery slope on polygamy, I have no problem with that either. Polygamy is more of an administrative problem than anything else.

    You, however, have not presented a compelling reason to disallow gays to marry.

  2. #662
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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Really? So my widowed grandmother who remarried when she was 70 didn't know she had gone through menopause?
    Good point, I don't really think not being able to procreate should be an obstacle to marriage .....
    Last edited by Partisan; 12-10-09 at 01:34 PM.

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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Partisan View Post
    Good point.....
    Thousands and thousands of post-menopausal women get married every year. No chance whatsoever of having kids. Nobody gives it a second thought.

    Clearly marriage isn't just about children.

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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Stryker View Post
    Which lesbian donates the semen?
    Sometimes hetero couples end up with a man who is infertile, and they use a semen donor.

    Should their marriage be annuled?

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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Clearly marriage isn't just about children.
    And they lose that argument because gays can legally raise children.

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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    And they lose that argument because gays can legally raise children.
    Another good point - the state allows a single gay person to have a child, but not marry as a gay couple, then they claim they want to nurture children through marriage?

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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Another good point - the state allows a single gay person to have a child, but not marry as a gay couple, then they claim they want to nurture children through marriage?
    The state doesn't make that claim. Nowhere do you see the state making the claim that marriage is exclusively about raising children.

    The only people making that specious claim are dense neanderthals who think they've come up with a legitimate argument against gay marriage. But upon even the lightest inspection, the argument falls apart as puerile grandstanding that it is.

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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Really? So my widowed grandmother who remarried when she was 70 didn't know she had gone through menopause?
    I believe they were referring to infertility prior to things like menopause.

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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Again, procreation is not a requirement for marriage. Therefore saying gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because they can't procreate with each other is invalid.

    The compelling reason is that rights are being denied to a group of people that:

    #1 it is not illegal to be gay
    #2 it is not illegal to be in a gay relationship between consenting adults (non family)
    #3 It is not illegal for gays to raise children

    Therefore it shouldn't be illegal for them to marry.

    Now if you want to go down the slippery slope on polygamy, I have no problem with that either. Polygamy is more of an administrative problem than anything else.

    You, however, have not presented a compelling reason to disallow gays to marry.
    But its already not allowed in many states. It is your job to convince us that those laws should not be in place and you have yet to provide a compelling reason to do so.

    Nor have you answered the question on how you would limit this new "right" to just one alternative lifestyle or how you would exclude other alternative lifestyles who want the same thing.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

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    Re: Lots of people are legally excluded from marriage.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Again, procreation is not a requirement for marriage. Therefore saying gays shouldn't be allowed to marry because they can't procreate with each other is invalid.

    The compelling reason is that rights are being denied to a group of people that:

    #1 it is not illegal to be gay
    #2 it is not illegal to be in a gay relationship between consenting adults (non family)
    #3 It is not illegal for gays to raise children

    Therefore it shouldn't be illegal for them to marry.

    Now if you want to go down the slippery slope on polygamy, I have no problem with that either. Polygamy is more of an administrative problem than anything else.

    You, however, have not presented a compelling reason to disallow gays to marry.
    In some states acts like anal sex and oral sex, the only thing two homosexual men can perform, are illegal. So if they get married, are we going to just assume it's a non-sexual, love based relationship?

    crappy devil's advocate is crappy.

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