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Thread: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

  1. #591
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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    There is no evidence people are created gay. To beleive that is to believe a fallacy.

    There is no genetic study anywhere proving even 60% of only homosexuals (60% because I'm so generous not asking for 90 or 100% certainty) showing them to carry any genetic trait so your statement is flat out false unless you can prove otherwise.

    And we know you can't.
    Source: What causes sexual orientation? Nature or Nurture....?

    Important note: This is what we call providing actual backing for our opinions

    Conflicting quotations -- two from each "side:"

    • "There is no scientific data that substantiates a genetic or biologic basis for same-sex attraction. Anybody can change." Richard Cohen, at the year 2000 PFOX, (Parents and Friends of Ex-Gays) convention.
    • "Homosexuality & heterosexuality are likely to be the result of an interaction of several different factors, including genetics, hormonal & environmental factors. Psychological & social influences alone cannot cause homosexuality." PFLAG Oakland - East Bay.
    • "To date, all information and studies involving genetics have proven homosexuality to be environmental, not genetic." PFOX web site.
    • "Research suggests that the homosexual orientation is in place very early in the life cycle, possibly even before birth. It is found in about ten percent of the population, a figure which is surprisingly constant across cultures, irrespective of the different moral values and standards of a particular culture." Statement on Homosexuality, American Psychological Association, 1994-JUL.
    The page linked contains a wealth of information, and shows basically that it is pretty impossible to state for sure one way or the other whether homosexuality is genetic or environmental. You want us to assume that you are right and that it is strictly environmental, while offering zero evidence. If you really want to play the game, I suggest you start rounding up sources, but I promise you that I can match you source for source, and we will end up with a draw. The causes of homosexuality are not known for sure, and to state that you are right, as a fact, is pure hubris. You may be convinced you are right, but then again, I am pretty confident I am right too, that there are a number of causes of sexual orientation, and the fact there is a variety of causes is why the research is so conflicted.

    By the way, the website I linked to as a whole(ReligiousTolerance.org by the Ontario Consultants on Religious Tolerance) is an awesome website, even if you disagree with the overall concept. They offer a ton of documentation and do a fair job of presenting opposing views. Highly recommended. And, credit where credit is due, I got the link from a CaptainCourtesy post.
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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    Sigh. School is out again I see.
    Moderator's Warning:
    New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage BillStop these kinds of attacks, now.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Yes...."separate but equal" is fine with you right Navy?

    You just don't want "Them" drinking out of your same drinking fountain.
    Oh come on. Navy doesn't show any kind of hatred or desire to suppress the happiness of gays. He simply believes that gay marriage is wrong.

    He and I will disagree on that but never has Navy indicated that gays should be served at different lunch counters or sit at the back of the bus.

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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by EpicDude86 View Post
    It is this dude's belief that you cannot be homosexual so much as partake in homosexual activity, even if it's what you do exclusively. It's a fetish. a kink. Homosexual sex is what gets your rocks off. Nothing more, nothing less and has nothing to do with what kind of Union you are entitled to. That being said, I believe same-gender unions are not based on the kind of SEX you have (you'd be shallow or stupid to get married/union'd out of lust), it's the kind of person you want to be your partner in LIFE. Same-Sex Unions should not get the word MARRIAGE (not yet, just to keep the Hetero folks happy) but they should be able to get said unions, and have the same rights and opportunities that Different-Gender marriages can get.

    Problem solved, everyone go back to your homes, **** or be ****ed with whatever appendage, hole, or inanimate object that your heart desires.
    But ED, the problem won't be solved. The minute it becomes law that Marriage A is for heterosexuals and Marriage B is for homosexuals then you will have the opened the door for the same elements in our society who tried to deny Marriage B before to start challenging the rights inherited by both parties from that contract.

    For instance, preferential treatment for adoption and foster care is given to married couples. So now that you have two marriages, which one gets preference over the other in adoption? Well clearly those from Marriage A category are going to press that their marriage is "a little more equal" than Marriage B because the only reason the two have different names is because of moral disapproval becoming codefied into law.

    If you just give the exact same marriage to both parties, the openings for legal wrangling of one group or the other out of their rights is greatly decreased.

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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Oh come on. Navy doesn't show any kind of hatred or desire to suppress the happiness of gays. He simply believes that gay marriage is wrong.
    I'm sorry but to call AIDS as a "gay disease" as he has does demonstrate hatred at worst, ignorance at best towards gays.

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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    I'm sorry but to call AIDS as a "gay disease" as he has does demonstrate hatred at worst, ignorance at best towards gays.
    There was a time that the medical community called it gay related cancer. And it is much more prevalent in homosxual populations than it is in the straight populations.

    He definitely isn't sugar coating anything but he isn't being dishonest in his observations either. I don't see the hatred there.

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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Source: What causes sexual orientation? Nature or Nurture....?

    Important note: This is what we call providing actual backing for our opinions



    The page linked contains a wealth of information, and shows basically that it is pretty impossible to state for sure one way or the other whether homosexuality is genetic or environmental. You want us to assume that you are right and that it is strictly environmental, while offering zero evidence. If you really want to play the game, I suggest you start rounding up sources, but I promise you that I can match you source for source, and we will end up with a draw. The causes of homosexuality are not known for sure, and to state that you are right, as a fact, is pure hubris. You may be convinced you are right, but then again, I am pretty confident I am right too, that there are a number of causes of sexual orientation, and the fact there is a variety of causes is why the research is so conflicted.

    By the way, the website I linked to as a whole(ReligiousTolerance.org by the Ontario Consultants on Religious Tolerance) is an awesome website, even if you disagree with the overall concept. They offer a ton of documentation and do a fair job of presenting opposing views. Highly recommended. And, credit where credit is due, I got the link from a CaptainCourtesy post.

    You really are amusing. Nothing in any of that list of theories says homosexuality is genetic and the entire site is extremely biased and attacks only one side of people who are against gay marriage, Christianity. It doesn't address any other religion's views even though Islam is far stricter.

    That is the point I was making because some people were trying to equate race to homosexuality which is a false argument since you cannot prove it is genetic. Got it now?

    If you can't answer my simple challenge to you don't bother linking to theoretical arguments.
    Last edited by texmaster; 12-09-09 at 02:18 PM.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    There was a time that the medical community called it gay related cancer.
    But those days are long gone.

    And it is much more prevalent in homosxual populations than it is in the straight populations..
    Is it?

    It may be more prevalent per capita. But there are likely more total HIV cases among heteros, simply because there are so many more heteros. Certainly that's true in Africa. They have millions and millions of cases, but they're not all a bunch of homos over there.

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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    But those days are long gone.



    Is it?

    It may be more prevalent per capita. But there are likely more total HIV cases among heteros, simply because there are so many more heteros. Certainly that's true in Africa. They have millions and millions of cases, but they're not all a bunch of homos over there.
    That's irrelevant. Rate of transmission among homosexual men is far greater than any other demographic. Gay men make up a small portion of the total population but a majority of the actual cases.

    Like I said, he definitely isn't sugar coating it but he isn't being totally dishonest in relating a fair perception.

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    Re: New York State Senate Votes Down Gay Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by texmaster View Post
    You really are amusing. Nothing in any of that list of theories says homosexuality is genetic and the entire site is extremely biased and attacks only one side of people who are against gay marriage, Christianity. It doesn't address any other religion's views even though Islam is far stricter.

    That is the point I was making because some people were trying to equate race to homosexuality which is a false argument since you cannot prove it is genetic. Got it now?

    If you can't answer my simple challenge to you don't bother linking to theoretical arguments.
    I see we're still in deny and lie mode.

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