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Thread: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    A hyper partisan like you will never admit... probably because you agree with, the goals Mr. Waxman seeks, government subsidizing "media outlets".

    That's what his speech says, that's what his goals are, that's what this is about. Saving failing news organizations that cannot compete in fair free markets because their product is no longer, relevant.
    Anyone who agrees with Waxman on anything is a socialist.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Waxman Wants Federal Government to 'Resolve' Newspapers' Problems | NewsBusters.org

    More on what Waxman is REALLY after, not the trivial nonsense OC has been spewing is going on.

    Great! An editorial written in the middle of reporting a news item to look as if they are being nonbiased and not just reporting specific issues that they want to refute.

    But let's use it for a minute:

    Quote Originally Posted by Newsbusters
    Even if editors do not make conscious decision to avoid coverage damaging to their federal financiers, the knowledge that such funding can be withdrawn on a whim is enough to chill free speech. Government money will mean a say--directly or indirectly--in what newspapers cover, how, and how much.
    Take out the word federal and Government for a minute and what does it say about "free speech." (and wrong grammar, by the way--gosh, bloggers are sloppy on quality writing)

    Now read this statement: Money will mean a say--directly or indirectly--in what newspapers or various medias cover, along with how, and how much. Definitely true in almost all areas of media.
    Last edited by Ziggae_6; 12-05-09 at 09:10 AM.

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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Which is a problem that results in a crappy media. Something that Zyphlin eluded to. When profit is the major drive to media, they pander to specific biases to increase revenue resulting in exceedingly unreliable, one sided and otherwise not useful for democratic process.

    Furthermore, everyone here except me seems to ignore how the current tax law is something the media requires for growth. Not to mention the legalistic copyright structure. Would there be media without that? Not in the form we have. Like it or not, the media has always been dependent. But the partisans here pretend it's not because a democrat said something.

    Oh it's not. There is a place for liberal op-ed just like there should be a place for conservative commentary. But let us not also pretend that democrats have some golden key to responsible journalism. Shall we bring up how it was that an American paper could have had a strong case made against it for releasing vital information during a time of war, placing our own men and women at risk? I don't think you want to go there.


    Uh no. Newspapers as an entire industry is responsible for its demise because they failed to change with the times. You are ignoring how newspapers across the country pandering to every political bias are having problems. The only ones that aren't are largely the niche business ones that professionals are willing to pay for. This is why you are a partisan. Rather then address the actual underlying objective business model reality, you pander to anti-liberal notions. Newspapers fail because people get their news from varying sources. Reliance upon one is going the way of the dinosaurs. No one pays for the WSJ for its political opinions. They pay for the business aspects. No one pays for the financial times for its political opinions. They pay for the business insight. No one pays for Investors Business Daily for its political opinions. They pay for the business aspects. The Chicago Tribune has endorsed Republicans for decades. Guess who's on the not going to make it short list?

    WashTimes is on pretty solid footing as far as I know. In any case allow me to tell you why it is that I speak with just a little bit of authority on the issue. While I may be a truck driver, I have been lucky enough to be married to a wonderful woman for the past 22 years, whom has worked for news papers owned by TimesMirror, and Tribune. The Tribune has had problems because it sold to a man that had NO News Paper experience and put in place another man that had NO experience. It has NOTHING to do with my political leaning, other than to say I am against OP ED JOURNALISM.


    Then tell me why Republican and Conservative leaning papers are on the short list of going extinct as well?

    I don't think that is any more true than anything else thrown out there with not a single shred of evidence to back it up.


    Hint: It has nothing to do with bias. It has everything to do with competition of where one gets their media. Why pay for a newspaper when I can get the same news free online? Doesn't matter if you're a Cheney backer or Pelsoi supporter, free is still free.

    Now that much is true. People are getting more from the net, however, Papers are correcting their mistake to give away content for free, and hopefully they will survive. I don't think it is a matter of Government bailing them out though, I think it should be a matter of getting back to basics.


    Left leaning because they disagree with you? Or left leaning on some actual objective criteria? I agree that fully publicly funded is a bad idea because it allows politicians to monkey around with content, but that is hardly the same as allowing 501(c)(3) or changing amortization tables.

    No, left leaning because they are left leaning. Period. They already distort, we don't need them beholden to Obama to get more favorable coverage do we?


    Has that happened with industries we extended additional tax benefits to in the past?

    Or are you as usual talking out of your butt?

    No, I am trying to be civil here, you should try it. Take GM for example and you tell me who runs the show now?

    Hint: It ain't a free market guy.


    The whole reason you are angry is because a Democrat said it. When Republicans engage in tax law changes, you say nothing because they are Republicans.

    that is because when conservatives change the tax law it is usually downward, letting me keep more of my hard earned money. When Liberals change them it is to take more of my money and give it away to non deserving leaches.


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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Oh it's not. There is a place for liberal op-ed just like there should be a place for conservative commentary. But let us not also pretend that democrats have some golden key to responsible journalism. Shall we bring up how it was that an American paper could have had a strong case made against it for releasing vital information during a time of war, placing our own men and women at risk? I don't think you want to go there.





    WashTimes is on pretty solid footing as far as I know. In any case allow me to tell you why it is that I speak with just a little bit of authority on the issue. While I may be a truck driver, I have been lucky enough to be married to a wonderful woman for the past 22 years, whom has worked for news papers owned by TimesMirror, and Tribune. The Tribune has had problems because it sold to a man that had NO News Paper experience and put in place another man that had NO experience. It has NOTHING to do with my political leaning, other than to say I am against OP ED JOURNALISM.





    I don't think that is any more true than anything else thrown out there with not a single shred of evidence to back it up.





    Now that much is true. People are getting more from the net, however, Papers are correcting their mistake to give away content for free, and hopefully they will survive. I don't think it is a matter of Government bailing them out though, I think it should be a matter of getting back to basics.





    No, left leaning because they are left leaning. Period. They already distort, we don't need them beholden to Obama to get more favorable coverage do we?





    No, I am trying to be civil here, you should try it. Take GM for example and you tell me who runs the show now?

    Hint: It ain't a free market guy.





    that is because when conservatives change the tax law it is usually downward, letting me keep more of my hard earned money. When Liberals change them it is to take more of my money and give it away to non deserving leaches.


    j-mac
    I think this country is slowly getting sick and tired of liberalism.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    I think this country is slowly getting sick and tired of liberalism.

    Source?? Other than pulling it out of your assets.

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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    I think this country is slowly getting sick and tired of liberalism.
    Modern Liberalism. I think a return to Classical Liberalism would make everyone a lot happier. Well, except modern liberals.

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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    A hyper partisan like you will never admit... probably because you agree with, the goals Mr. Waxman seeks, government subsidizing "media outlets".

    That's what his speech says, that's what his goals are, that's what this is about. Saving failing news organizations that cannot compete in fair free markets because their product is no longer, relevant.
    Note the failures in this argument.

    1) No addressing how the actual speech lines up with the accusations made by Mr. V
    2) No addressing how the partisan article provided by Mr. V is exceptionally dishonest in characterizing what the speech was actually about
    3) No addressinghow the number of options actually stated in his speech are no different then business as usual
    4) No acknowledgment that similar actions for money losing farms was enacted under Bush
    5) No evidence for his claim that my arguments are inline with Waxman's beliefs
    6) No evidence that Waxman seeks subsidizing media as government outlets

    I can keep going. Mr. V has presented absolutely nothing other his how his "feelings" are true.

    And no, his speech does not state such goals and does not state that the product being sold is unwanted.

    Again, more evidence for my initial claim that someone did not read the article.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggae_6 View Post
    Great! An editorial written in the middle of reporting a news item to look as if they are being nonbiased and not just reporting specific issues that they want to refute.
    Which amusingly placed next to the actual speech shows that the editorial is exceptionally dishonest. When we look at the actual text of the actual speech it in no way lines up with the accusations pushed here by both Mr. V nor the partisan hack job he posted. There's a reason that overly partisan sources are not allowed as breaking news: they tend to be highly inaccurate and highly dishonest.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Oh it's not. There is a place for liberal op-ed just like there should be a place for conservative commentary. But let us not also pretend that democrats have some golden key to responsible journalism. Shall we bring up how it was that an American paper could have had a strong case made against it for releasing vital information during a time of war, placing our own men and women at risk? I don't think you want to go there.
    What on God's Green Earth are you talking about? How the hell does that address anything you quoted? How does that address the issue of tax code as dependent for growth? Can anyone read here?

    WashTimes is on pretty solid footing as far as I know. In any case allow me to tell you why it is that I speak with just a little bit of authority on the issue. While I may be a truck driver, I have been lucky enough to be married to a wonderful woman for the past 22 years, whom has worked for news papers owned by TimesMirror, and Tribune. The Tribune has had problems because it sold to a man that had NO News Paper experience and put in place another man that had NO experience. It has NOTHING to do with my political leaning, other than to say I am against OP ED JOURNALISM.
    Okay...and this addresses my argument how? Simple fact is that newspapers pandering to all sorts of biases across the country are failing for largely the same reason:they give away their product for free.

    I don't think that is any more true than anything else thrown out there with not a single shred of evidence to back it up.
    Your posts would be better if you took the time to educate yourself:
    Liberal bias isn't killing newspapers - The Boston Globe
    Loaded Orygun:: The Dying GOP: Oregon Conservative Magazine Closes

    Timeline of newspaper edition shutdowns | The shutdown list
    Hardly a list of liberal bent papers.


    Heard of something called the Rocky Mountain News? Guess how that firm is doing?

    Now that much is true. People are getting more from the net, however, Papers are correcting their mistake to give away content for free, and hopefully they will survive. I don't think it is a matter of Government bailing them out though, I think it should be a matter of getting back to basics.
    Indeed. The real problem is distribution. I posted a link showing page views and unique visitors to several liberal bent papers that were truly enormous. The product is not the problem. It's the free part.

    No, left leaning because they are left leaning. Period. They already distort, we don't need them beholden to Obama to get more favorable coverage do we?
    Perhaps you need to reread the question.

    No, I am trying to be civil here, you should try it. Take GM for example and you tell me who runs the show now?

    Hint: It ain't a free market guy.
    Hello? Do you know what additional tax benefits are?

    that is because when conservatives change the tax law it is usually downward, letting me keep more of my hard earned money. When Liberals change them it is to take more of my money and give it away to non deserving leaches

    j-mac
    Look! Another person who clearly did not read the article, nor the thread.

    Please reread before posting again.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Govt will need to help shape U.S. media: Waxman

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Note the failures in this argument.

    1) No addressing how the actual speech lines up with the accusations made by Mr. V
    2) No addressing how the partisan article provided by Mr. V is exceptionally dishonest in characterizing what the speech was actually about
    3) No addressinghow the number of options actually stated in his speech are no different then business as usual
    4) No acknowledgment that similar actions for money losing farms was enacted under Bush
    5) No evidence for his claim that my arguments are inline with Waxman's beliefs
    6) No evidence that Waxman seeks subsidizing media as government outlets

    I can keep going. Mr. V has presented absolutely nothing other his how his "feelings" are true.

    And no, his speech does not state such goals and does not state that the product being sold is unwanted.

    Again, more evidence for my initial claim that someone did not read the article.

    So you are contending it's not product but the markets fault that newspapers are failing, and only government intervention will fix it. Got it.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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