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Thread: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post

    Also, the last time I checked, Judaism doesn't require their women to hide in portable tents when out in public,
    Hah! Even tents have ventilation holes

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post


    Proof enough.
    So, a small group of muslims accounts for all of them?! Wow, talk about stereotyping and showing ignorance. You really need to get to know some Muslims in your community instead of spreading hate.
    It's time for a revolution in our country. Not a revolution forged with guns and bombs but a revolution forged of compassion and altruism. A revolution that extends a hand to those who don't have and who cannot. A revolution that makes Health Care available to all those in the US.

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by Toothpicvic View Post
    Swiss voters' clear decision on Sunday to ban the construction of minarets has generated a wide range of emotions, from stunned joy to rueful concern. - swissinfo

    Good job Switzerland:

    Swiss voters' clear decision on Sunday to ban the construction of minarets has generated a wide range of emotions, from stunned joy to rueful concern.

    Supporters of the initiative said the Swiss electorate wanted to put a brake on the Islamicisation of their country, whereas opponents were concerned about the violation of rights, not to mention an international backlash and possible boycott of Swiss products.

    "Forced marriages and other things like cemeteries separating the pure and impure – we don't have that in Switzerland and we don't want to introduce it," said Ulrich Schlüer, co-president of the Initiative Committee to ban minarets.

    Oskar Freysinger, a member of the rightwing Swiss People's Party and a driving force in the campaign, said he was "stunned and dumbfounded" by Sunday's result "since the entire establishment was against us".

    "I would like to say to all the Muslims listening that this will in no way change their right to practise their religion, to pray or to gather [in mosques]," he said. "However, society wants to put a safeguard on the political-legal wing of Islam, for which there is no separation between state and religion."

    The president of the People's Party, Toni Brunner, said voters had clearly rejected the idea of parallel societies and the further expansion of Islam – including radical, political Islam – in Switzerland.

    According to final results, 57.5 per cent of voters and a majority of cantons backed the initiative – up from 34 per cent last month. Turnout was high at around 53 per cent.

    Brunner said people who settled here had to realise that they couldn't turn up to work in a head scarf or get special dispensation from swimming lessons.
    What's this?What's this?

    * People's initiative

    Government reaction

    The government said in a statement it respected the decision.

    For Justice Minister Eveline Widmer-Schlumpf, the outcome reflected fears among the population of Islamic fundamentalist tendencies, "which reject our national traditions and which could disregard our legal order".

    "These concerns have to be taken seriously. The government has always done so and will continue to do so in future. However, we take the view that a ban on the construction of new minarets is not a feasible means of countering extremist tendencies," she said.

    Widmer-Schlumpf underlined that Sunday's vote was only directed against the construction of new minarets. "It is not a rejection of the Muslim community, religion or culture. Of that the government gives its assurance."
    "Switzerland has lost"

    Nevertheless, Saida Keller-Messahli, president of the Forum for an Advanced Islam, said the public's fears had been too great and "hatred had won over reason".

    She said there would now be legal consequences, since the ban violated the freedom of religion.

    The Federation of Islamic Organisations in Switzerland also regretted the result, saying the propaganda of the campaign supporters had succeeded in frightening the majority of voters.

    The federation said it was too soon to judge the negative social and legal consequences – what was important now was to strengthen their public relations and clear up any misunderstandings or prejudices concerning Islam.

    "Switzerland has lost," said Rifa'at Lenzin from the European Project for Interreligious Learning in Zurich, adding that the country was "leading the way" for Islamophobia.

    Lenzin was only partly surprised by the result, "which corresponds to the current mood". She said she was astonished, however, that the "subjective and far-fetched arguments" of the minaret opponents had found such great support.

    She added that the opponents of the initiative had completely underestimated the situation and that the political parties had been asleep, with only the centre-right Radical Party actively campaigning. The public spaces had been dominated by the campaign supporters, she said.
    « Switzerland is heading straight for a battle with Islam. »

    Jacques Neyrinck
    Swiss values

    Reinhard Schulze, a professor of Islamic studies at Bern University, said he was "very surprised" by the acceptance of the initiative.

    He described the result as a "turning point", in that after many years of going in the other direction, voters had once again spoken for an unequal treatment of faiths.

    "The next thing is obviously to look at how this plays with international law," he said, adding that he could already envisage complaints from the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg.

    The Council of Religions, a body comprising Christian churches, Jews and Muslims, said in a statement it regretted the result. People of all faiths must work together even harder, it said, for the respect of rights of freedom, for dialogue with the Muslim community and for integration.

    "These are values that make Switzerland strong," it said.
    Swiss image abroad

    Looking at political reaction, the centre-left Social Democratic Party warned in a statement against the exclusion of Muslims in Switzerland.

    "The yes vote was probably the result of a diffuse fear of a religious minority," it said.

    This fear must be taken seriously, it added, but it must not be misinterpreted as a vote of mistrust against all Muslims living in Switzerland.

    The party said it was also concerned about Switzerland's image abroad, saying that a foreign ministry offensive was clearly necessary, along with stronger integration efforts at all state levels.

    Jacques Neyrinck from the centre-right Christian Democratic Party stressed that Switzerland would be the only country in the world to ban the construction of minarets.

    "Switzerland is heading straight for a battle with Islam," he said, adding that he feared a boycott of Swiss products.
    "Dirty campaign"

    The four minarets already attached to mosques in the country are not affected by the initiative, and the president of the Islamic community in Langenthal, canton Bern, assumed his organisation would be able to add a minaret to their mosque since it had already been approved.

    Mutalip Karaademi said he was disappointed by the strong level of support and the "dirty campaign", describing Muslims and Islamists and terrorists.

    But Langenthal mayor Thomas Rufener, from the People's Party, said he didn't think the minaret would be built "for political reasons".

    Thomas Stephens, swissinfo.ch and agencies
    So, what you're saying is, you're not for freedom of religion?
    It's time for a revolution in our country. Not a revolution forged with guns and bombs but a revolution forged of compassion and altruism. A revolution that extends a hand to those who don't have and who cannot. A revolution that makes Health Care available to all those in the US.

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    And in nations unfortunately dominated by Islam, women are REQUIRED to wear them.

    So much for their freedom of choice, eh?
    Not all nations require it and those that do need to stop. I'm not sure how you can tout some feigned move for freedom when you champion a move by the Swiss government to ban them constructing their own houses of worship in the traditional fashion. I have no issue with the Swiss. They are a socialist government and have the right to do what they are doing but I don't want our government dictating such things here in the US. You show a penchant for a double standard.
    It's time for a revolution in our country. Not a revolution forged with guns and bombs but a revolution forged of compassion and altruism. A revolution that extends a hand to those who don't have and who cannot. A revolution that makes Health Care available to all those in the US.

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Then you probably aren't offended when the Saudis ban bibles and stuff. That's nationalistic too.
    Like switzerland it's their country. Reality check here, not everybody is into multi-culturalism.
    He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire. ~ Winston Churchill

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    Like switzerland it's their country. Reality check here, not everybody is into multi-culturalism.
    So any country should be able to do whatever they want? Hmmm.

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    And in nations unfortunately dominated by Islam, women are REQUIRED to wear them.

    So much for their freedom of choice, eh?
    It's ironic how you spout about "freedom of choice" in a thread about a country that is taking away a choice.

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by Arch Enemy View Post
    And I can give you many more examples of Muslims who are faithful and *gasp* do not participate in Terrorist activities.

    I'm glad you can cite examples. I can cite examples of bad people from every walk of life.

    You wish to dwell in ignorance of the religion, as you make remarks of firstly human problems, and secondly regional problems. There is nothing inherently evil about the Islamic religion... it's just not there.


    There is, however, an embedded premise for ijtihad. Sometimes plurality makes bad people.
    Nothing of what you have said takes away from my argument.

    I focus on the most violent of all religions and the most justification found in any major religion being Islam.

    That is the point.

    You have never proven your point that all religions are equal to Islam in violence and justification for the simple reason that it is a factually inaccurate statement.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post


    You're judging a religion by its book? That's silly. You could look at the Bible and think Christians don't eat shellfish and walk around with long beards sacrificing goats too.
    Again you really need to take some time and study that "book"

    There is more justification for violence in Islam than any other major religion.

    This is why you have more violence committed int he name of Islam than any other major religion.

    That was and is the only point.

    Yeah, those are Muslim terrorists, not Muslims. The vast majority of Muslims are NOT terrorists. In case you didn't notice.
    Which is a moronic argument since I never said all Muslims are terrorists.

    You might have proven that a few Muslims tend to be more aggressive, violent, etc. than people in other religions. That's not the same thing as proving anything about Muslims as a whole. You proved that .0002% are terrorists as opposed to .00000001% of Christians. Good for you. You want a medal or a Logic 101 textbook? (I suggest the latter).
    I'd prefer that you simply accept the reality of the statement and move on.
    Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

    John Adams

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    Re: Swiss voters approve constitutional ban of minarets

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    So any country should be able to do whatever they want? Hmmm.
    It's not up to me, or you for that matter, to dictate what other cultures/nations are allowed to do.
    He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire. ~ Winston Churchill

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