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Irish republicans try to blow up Belfast police building

Tucker Case said:
Quite frankly, I don't think this is up to those in the UK or the Republic. It is something that should be decided by the people of Northern Ireland as a whole.

And for those who think this has anything to do with religion, learn about the region. Religion is not a real concern. The religious differences are actually a product of being ethnically Irish or ethnically English. Typically the side which one is prone to supporting (Unionist or Republican) is actually product of ethnicity, not religion.


There were legitimate reasons why many took up arms in the North back 40 years ago, but those reasons just aren't present anymore. There is far less Catholic (read: ethnically Irish) subjugation than there was 40 years ago in the North. Sein Fein is even considered a legitimate political entity now, for the love of God.

There is no reason at all for violence anymore. None whatsoever. Those who use violence in today's Northern Ireland are little more than pigs.

The Catholics now have a voice, and that voice is actually being heard. 40 years ago this was not the case. Today, it is the reality.

The fight was won in the only way it really needed to be one. The people have a choice. Only persistent attempts to degrade things back towards violence by people who want to remove that choice from others can destroy all that has been achieved over the last 11 years.
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I largely agree except protestants in NI are mainly of Scottish decent.
 
Slainte said:
:rolleyes:

Right, because the Unionists wouldn't kick up a fuss about that...

Have you ever considered a career in diplomacy?
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It's the Unionists fault in the first place. They should have left Ireland entirely. :lol:
 
EpicDude86 said:
It's the Unionists fault in the first place. They should have left Ireland entirely. :lol:
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When the Anglo-Irish treaty was signed, Northern Ireland was part of the Free State.

They choose to "opt out" back then and it was a majority vote, because back then, Ulster was heavily a protestant majority.

So at one point, there was a unified Irish Free state. The people chose to return.
 
Tucker Case said:
When the Anglo-Irish treaty was signed, Northern Ireland was part of the Free State.

They choose to "opt out" back then and it was a majority vote, because back then, Ulster was heavily a protestant majority.

So at one point, there was a unified Irish Free state. The people chose to return.
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That's because it wasn't the true Irish in Ulster. It was those remaining loyal to the Crown. Of COURSE they wanted to stay in the U.K.
 
EpicDude86 said:
That's because it wasn't the true Irish in Ulster. It was those remaining loyal to the Crown. Of COURSE they wanted to stay in the U.K.
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The "true Irish" were pretty much content with that arrangement back then. They didn't want those who were loyal to the crown to undermine their fledgling nation.

Romantic Idealism is great for poems and tunes, but it isn't really practical.
 
Tucker Case said:
The "true Irish" were pretty much content with that arrangement back then. They didn't want those who were loyal to the crown to undermine their fledgling nation.

Romantic Idealism is great for poems and tunes, but it isn't really practical.
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Practical shmacktical.
 
EpicDude86 said:
That's because it wasn't the true Irish in Ulster. It was those remaining loyal to the Crown. Of COURSE they wanted to stay in the U.K.
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Yeah i think its fair to say that if you removed one side from any conflict then things would run a lot more smoothly but the fact is that protestants/loyalists have been living in Northern Ireland since before the United States existed. They aren't going anywhere and have a right not to be part of a constitutionally catholic state (see consent of the governed) . This means your left with two options, either you can try and bomb the protestant majority into submission (which would be pretty futile as you wouldn't get much support from the south) or you can seek some kind of accommodation with them.

If you go for the first option things are worse for both sides, you get a stagnant economy, and Catholics are without jobs and opportunities and get killed and imprisoned without trial.

Since opting for the second option Catholics have gained rights due to the power sharing system. Good schools that used to be almost entirely protestant are now approaching 50/50 and the economy is now improving because people know their investments arent going to get blown up (and ironically because tourists come to see the murals ;))

Catholics realized that cooperation worked in their interests and it did. Thats why they voted for it. Even the I.R.A excepted this which is why the current deputy prime minister of Northern Ireland is a former I.R.A commander. Why Americans have the hubris to think they know better then them, despite never having lived though this conflict, i don't know.
 
PeteEU said:
But but they cant be terrorists as they are Christians and not Muslims!!!!

They must be "freedom fighters" then, since Christians cant be terrorists and have never committed such acts..

:roll:






and for those that cant understand sarcasm, yes this was sarcasm ...
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Take your trolling to the basement. Can you show us where anyone here has said only Muslims are terrorists?
 
Red_Dave said:
Try talking to people from Northern Ireland about the conflict. It will appear less romantic pretty quickly;)
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it's the fault of the invaders for staying. They should have gone back to their own island. What is in Ireland that they don't have or can't get easily enough in Britain/Scotland/Wales? Nothing. They've just been stubborn and dug in and now there's no easy way to get them out. That's their problem. Their mistake.
 
Laila said:
Oh bugger off with your republic bull****

N Ireland voted to remain with the Union. Wales and Scotland both joined in treaties.
What ... are you jealous Britain was intelligent enough to create a Union which benefits all?
A few Irish terrorists will not change our mind nor make us give up Northern Ireland. Ever. Unless of course they choose through a referedum to become a independent state which we will ofc support.
Oh and Britain expands into territories outside of the British isles. We have 14 territories under the soverignty of the United Kingdom but not part of it.

Location_of_the_BOTs.png

Course. I hope you similarly support the Palestinian 'freedom fighters'. The Iraqis and Afghans....
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I wonder if the one poor scientist in the UK's Antarctic territory have even thought about turning into an insurgent, and declaring it autonomous.
 
I believe and support Irish nationalism, but i don't believe in the violence (especially at this point in time, now that the IRA has given up it's weaponry).

My quote from Bobby Sands (Our Revenge will be the laughter of our children) is the most durable and excellent weapon against any sort of opposition (especially if they wish not to recognize your nationality). If you have children and you teach your children your way of life, then it's absolutely destroying the very fabric of the opposition.

In the case of the eradication of an entire nationality, living life and raising yours and keeping yours will compete with all odds.
 
Arch Enemy said:
I believe and support Irish nationalism, but i don't believe in the violence (especially at this point in time, now that the IRA has given up it's weaponry).

My quote from Bobby Sands (Our Revenge will be the laughter of our children) is the most durable and excellent weapon against any sort of opposition (especially if they wish not to recognize your nationality). If you have children and you teach your children your way of life, then it's absolutely destroying the very fabric of the opposition.

In the case of the eradication of an entire nationality, living life and raising yours and keeping yours will compete with all odds.
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Dammit, you're right. >:C
 
EpicDude86 said:
it's the fault of the invaders for staying. They should have gone back to their own island. What is in Ireland that they don't have or can't get easily enough in Britain/Scotland/Wales? Nothing. /QUOTE]

Well their homes for one thing. Again these people have lived here for longer then the United States has existed. They have a different culture from the English or the Scottish and constitute a nation with a right to national self determination. You cant just order an entire nation to up sticks and leave, its barbaric. If the Native Americans in the U.S started a bombing campaign would you demand that white Americans go back to *their continent?* Maybe we should demand that all those dam Anglo-Saxons piss off back to Saxony.
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Red_Dave said:
EpicDude86 said:
it's the fault of the invaders for staying. They should have gone back to their own island. What is in Ireland that they don't have or can't get easily enough in Britain/Scotland/Wales? Nothing. /QUOTE]

Well their homes for one thing. Again these people have lived here for longer then the United States has existed. They have a different culture from the English or the Scottish and constitute a nation with a right to national self determination. You cant just order an entire nation to up sticks and leave, its barbaric. If the Native Americans in the U.S started a bombing campaign would you demand that white Americans go back to *their continent?* Maybe we should demand that all those dam Anglo-Saxons piss off back to Saxony.
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Well... you can. It just doesn't make for pretty press.
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Tucker Case said:
You probably won't get an argument from the Irish against that proposal. :lol:

Just sayin'. ;)
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Better still, why don't all the Irish move to the Republic

if we,re in a just sayin mood;)

Paul
 
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So let me get this right..

Because it is Northern Ireland, and Christians, then attempting to blow up the police or anyone is some what okay because the struggle against British oppression is a valid one.. they are after all freedom fighters..

But when it is in Iraq and Muslims and the target is US troops then people fighting oppression and occupation are terrorists when they do the same thing?

No hypocrisy here .. :roll:

If people in Northern Ireland want to live under Irish rule rather than British rule.. MOVE!.. They are both in the EU so nothing is preventing them moving to Ireland.
 
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Well their homes for one thing. Again these people have lived here for longer then the United States has existed. They have a different culture from the English or the Scottish and constitute a nation with a right to national self determination.
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Then there's the fact that they are just as Irish as the Irish to the south.
 
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