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Thread: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

  1. #371
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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Fighting wars to prevent crazies and madmen from controlling most of the world oil supply and reserves is something that from time to time may be necessary in a world that abhors allowing crazies and madmen to prey and/or control the freedom loving, hard working, and industrious.

    What right do we have to kill over others oil? Especially when we do not need it. All we have to do is get off our asses and utilize what we already know about solar and wind power. I don't know which is the biggest impediment to our survival, our ignorance or our gluttony without regard to sustainability.

    As for your conservation efforts, those are commendable. In my household the use of energy, private transportation, and non biodegradable products is also less than half the average citizen but this is for aesthetic and practical reasons and has absolutely nothing to do with 'saving the planet' or 'being a good citizen of the world' or whatever.

    I never said anything about saving the planet. As Carlin said, the planet will be fine, its the people that are ****ed!

    I have no illusions that I am significantly reducing my carbon footprint given what a small part of my participation in society that energy use and transportation is.

    If all of us reduce our energy needs and increase development of renewable sources than we make Mideast wars unnecessary.


    And as I think the honest science is overwhelming, if not conclusive, that reducing our carbon footprint is futile in affecting climate change, I see no valid reason to take away choices, options, opportunities, and freedoms from anybody on the theory that it will make a difference re global warming. And I especially see no reason to doom whole groups of people to more generations of crushing poverty should we deny them ability to exploit their natural resources as we have already done.

    The current plan on the table by CBO estimates will cost consumers 44 cents a day. I am prepared to risk that on the chance that the concurrence of scientists from 180 countries are right.


    How small and shallow would I feel if was too cheap to spring for 44 cents a day and doomed the chances for future life on the planet?


    We do not want to unnecessarily allow poisons and toxins to pollute our soil, air, and water and I vigorously support reasonable laws and regulation to prevent that as much as possible. I support reasonable laws and regulations that preserve the aesthetic beauty of our planet and preserve the wonderful creatures living on it. And practicing reasonable conservation and thrift is commendable for almost all reasons.

    Most of all I support common sense in all things whether it is in trying and convicting a terrorist intent on hurting or destroying us or in dealing with inevitable issues of climate change and other natural phenomenon. If you take political correctness, partisanship, and ignorance out of it, we generally make pretty good decisions about most things.

    That remains to be seen.

    Let's don't harm our economy and freedoms by allowing opportunists to spike our kool-ade with junk science or by allowing opportunists to corrupt the judicial system by giving enemy combatants all the civil rights provided to U.S. citizens.

    If the scientists are wrong, our air is little cleaner and we are more self reliant when it comes to energy.

    If you are wrong and we do nothing, you doom our planet to a questionable future.

    I try to avoid bad bets! I will err on the side of continued life on the planet, thank you very much.
    Last edited by Catawba; 12-01-09 at 07:36 PM.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  2. #372
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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Our 8 years of war on terror has only increased terrorism world wide. Surprisingly, killing innocent civilians and invading countries that never attacked only increases the enemies numbers.

    Who would have thought it? LOL!
    The "enemy" have made themselves the "enemy" when they declared war on the U.S. and attacked the U. S. - what part of this do you not get?

    Our going over there went directly at them and then flushed them to us there - like suckers they came and we are finishing them off over there - it sure beats doing nothing, like Clinton did - funny, even though he did nothing after their attacks (first bombing of World Trade Centers, USS Cole, a few of our embassies and whathaveyou), they still attacked us on 9/11 - it obviously does not pay to not do anything - so we are doing all we can to make sure it doesn't happen again - sorry if you don't agree with this - but it is what it is - trust what it is is right - and trust that the job of clobbering those who have declared war against us will get done - whine all you want in the process, but it will change not one thing.

  3. #373
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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post

    If the scientists are wrong, our air is little cleaner and we are more self reliant when it comes to energy.

    If you are wrong and we do nothing, you doom our planet to a questionable future.

    I try to avoid bad bets! I will err on the side of continued life on the planet, thank you very much.
    Except we're all broke and can't afford food and the economy is in shambles, so we'll be broke for a long time to come.

    What will have been accomplished, exactly?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  4. #374
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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Jones View Post
    The "enemy" have made themselves the "enemy" when they declared war on the U.S. and attacked the U. S. - what part of this do you not get?

    The part where we killed 100,000 civilians in Iraq that preceded and helped bring on the 9/11 attack.

    Our going over there went directly at them and then flushed them to us there - like suckers they came and we are finishing them off over there - it sure beats doing nothing, like Clinton did - funny, even though he did nothing after their attacks (first bombing of World Trade Centers, USS Cole, a few of our embassies and whathaveyou), they still attacked us on 9/11 - it obviously does not pay to not do anything - so we are doing all we can to make sure it doesn't happen again.
    But that is the thing, we are not. According to the Rand Report to the Pentagon, the war on terror has been a failure. As I mentioned before, killing innocent civilians does nothing for decreasing the recruitment effort of the enemy.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Except we're all broke and can't afford food and the economy is in shambles, so we'll be broke for a long time to come.

    What will have been accomplished, exactly?
    I happen to think that if you add the real cost of the Middle East wars to continuing our dependence on oil, we are shipping an unnecessary amount of money for energy that we can produce ourselves with greater economy, not to mention the greater ethics of not sacrificing blood for oil.

    Even if if that were not the case, nothing is a higher priority than our environment, for without one that supports life, all the money in the world will be of no consequence.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  6. #376
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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    But that is the thing, we are not. According to the Rand Report to the Pentagon, the war on terror has been a failure. As I mentioned before, killing innocent civilians does nothing for decreasing the recruitment effort of the enemy.
    How about posting where it said that my left wing friend?
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    support the troops? then we are going to need a tax hike on the rich to pay for all the disabled vets who will be coming back from afghanistan.

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Yeah I've seen the cowboy approach. They kill 3,000 civilians and we kill 100,000 civilians, we'll show them huh? And that allows them to recruit more terrorists than they had before our 8 years of "war on terror!"

    Good plan!
    That is pure horse****.......Our troops go out of their way to protect civilian life to a point that they risk their own lives........Why do you lefties hate our military.....I will never understand that.............
    "God Bless Our Troops in Harms Way."

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    murtha and kerry are decorated war heroes. what are you?

    we SAY we don't target civilians.

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    How about posting where it said that my left wing friend?
    Certainly, my right wing friend -


    "The Rand Corporation, a conservative think-tank originally started by the U.S. Air Force, has produced a new report entitled, "How Terrorist Groups End - Lessons for Countering al Qaida." This study is important, for it reaches conclusions which may be surprising to the Bush Administration and to both presidential candidates. To wit, the study concludes that the "war on terrorism" has been a failure, and that the efforts against terrorism should not be characterized as a "war" at all."

    "Rand concludes, after studying 648 terrorist groups between 1968 and 2006, that military operations against such groups are among the least effective means of success, achieving the desired effect in only 7% of the cases. As Rand explains, "[a]gainst most terrorist groups . . . military force is usually too blunt an instrument." Moreover, "[t]he use of substantial U.S. military power against terror groups also runs a significant risk of turning the local population against the government by killing civilians."
    Dan Kovalik: Rand Corp -- War On Terrorism Is A Failure
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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