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Thread: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

  1. #261
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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I've already answered that question. See here
    Then you must be outraged by Holder's decision to try Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri before a military tribunal?

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Then you must be outraged by Holder's decision to try Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri before a military tribunal?
    I've already answered that too here.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I've already answered that too here.
    Is that a yes or a no?

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    It does not work on my computer.
    Trust me, it does.

    If you want to quote something, use the button that looks like a little speech bubble. If that doesn't work, you can type [quote ] and [/quote ] without the spaces around each thing you want to quote.

    So there is no one contesting the Justice Dept on a legal basis? That was my point.
    Where did anyone disagree? You have a tendency to change points as the discussion evolves.

    My point was that Obama has established a bifurcated (or trifurcated) system of "justice" for these detainees

    If we have a surfeit of admissible evidence that will guarantee conviction, we try them in the Article III courts.

    If we have a fair amount of evidence, but a significant portion of it is either inadmissible or questionable, we try them in the military tribunals.

    If we have a small amount of evidence, or if all the evidence is inadmissible or questionable, we simply keep them locked up in Gitmo or Bagram.
    You said "Apparently not." I'm still waiting for an explanation as to why it's not.

    Exactly, the executive does not deem them to be enemy combatants as I have referenced twice now.
    Ok.

    HYPO: Let's say that you and I are playing basketball. Every time I bump into you, you call a foul. I don't like that, so I say that I don't want you to call fouls anymore. You agree, and we resume play. The next time I bump into you, you say "improper contact!" When I ask what that means, you say that it means you get two shots.

    When I look at that scenario, it seems pretty obvious to me that you're still calling a foul every time I bump into you. You may see something different.

    I do not agree with Obama on many things. He is far too much of a moderate on some issues. He was just better than the alternative.
    And that's fine. I'm just pointing out that you disagree with him on far more than you think you do.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Well, the choice was up to the Obama administration - to try them before a federal court judge or before a military tribunal.

    We can debate where they should be tried all we want, but the former mayor of NYC, Ed Koch, a Democrat, just got through saying that it was a very unpoluplar move by the Obama administration, and that the people of New York, though mostly Democrat, are going to repudiate against the Dems at the pols come next November.
    Last edited by Tom Jones; 11-19-09 at 05:44 PM.

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    From your link ~ "'Guantanamo's evil twin'

    However, Clara Gutteridge, an investigator of secret prisons and renditions from the human rights organisation, Reprieve, said Bagram is seen as "Guantanamo's lesser-known evil twin".

    That is what you call a legitimate solution?
    You misunderstood my point. You said Gitmo was the only thing the Right did on this subject for eight years. That statement was clearly wrong because you omitted Bagram prison from the equation. My point is that you have made a factual mistake. I then went on to attack Obama as "Bagram Obama" because he is keeping Bagram prison open.

    Your post which responds to mine contains an admission against interest, i.e., that Bagram is Gitmo's evil twin. Who is responsible for people disappearing into the bowels of the overseas American penal system? Barack Obama. Who is your real enemy? Barack Obama. Now that you're properly oriented, go get him pal.

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Is that a yes or a no?
    I already said yes.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Trust me, it does.

    If you want to quote something, use the button that looks like a little speech bubble. If that doesn't work, you can type [quote ] and [/quote ] without the spaces around each thing you want to quote.

    I've tried it on 3 different forums. I highlight the quoted text I want and hit the " button. That works if I want to quote from several different posts but when I do that with one post, I get the whole post without the quote symbols necessary for them to show up as individual paragraphs.

    For your alternative suggestion, it is too much trouble to copy and paste the quote symbols for individual paragraphs. It is much easier to highlight and color.


    Where did anyone disagree? You have a tendency to change points as the discussion evolves.

    My point was that Obama has established a bifurcated (or trifurcated) system of "justice" for these detainees

    And I prefer that to Bush's approach.

    You said "Apparently not." I'm still waiting for an explanation as to why it's not.

    Because the Justice Dept. is proceeding without legal challenge.

    Ok.

    HYPO: Let's say that you and I are playing basketball. Every time I bump into you, you call a foul. I don't like that, so I say that I don't want you to call fouls anymore. You agree, and we resume play. The next time I bump into you, you say "improper contact!" When I ask what that means, you say that it means you get two shots.

    When I look at that scenario, it seems pretty obvious to me that you're still calling a foul every time I bump into you. You may see something different.

    You got me there, I have no idea what point you are trying to make.

    And that's fine. I'm just pointing out that you disagree with him on far more than you think you do.
    How would you know what I think better than I do? I have never said I agree with him on everything.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I already said yes.
    What is the legal basis for your outrage?

    Is everyone on the planet entitled to Constitutional due process?

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    Re: New York trial for alleged 9/11 mastermind

    Quote Originally Posted by Albert Di Salvo View Post
    You misunderstood my point. You said Gitmo was the only thing the Right did on this subject for eight years. That statement was clearly wrong because you omitted Bagram prison from the equation. My point is that you have made a factual mistake.

    I don't consider Bagram a legitimate solution, which was the context my statement was made.

    I then went on to attack Obama as "Bagram Obama" because he is keeping Bagram prison open.

    I agree with that.

    Your post which responds to mine contains an admission against interest, i.e., that Bagram is Gitmo's evil twin. Who is responsible for people disappearing into the bowels of the overseas American penal system? Barack Obama. Who is your real enemy? Barack Obama. Now that you're properly oriented, go get him pal.
    I have and will continue to do so.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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