Page 29 of 38 FirstFirst ... 192728293031 ... LastLast
Results 281 to 290 of 379

Thread: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

  1. #281
    Liberal Fascist For Life!


    Redress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:41 PM
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    93,328
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by GySgt View Post
    Well, by all means...the 9/11 terrorists were just misunderstood and merely freedom fighters themselves. Those Tali-Ban supporters? Merely minding their own business. The unlimited supply of religious fanatics that have joined the fight (on their territory; not ours)? Merely misguided and in need of a good hug.

    How dare we ever have an enemy. I love how people attempt to philosophize the problem away.
    What a ridiculous, over the top flat out lie. How about actually arguing what people are saying, instead of building straw men to get outraged about.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  2. #282
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Albert Di Salvo View Post
    I think you can defend yourself so don't be afraid of me. I'm no one of consequence.

    Having said that I have two questions. First, are you an American citizen? Second, if withdrawal isn't chosen by Obama, would you like to see American forces defeated or victorious?

    I'll understand if you choose not to respond. Thanks.
    Yes, I am an American, are you?

    I would like to see a new strategy as recommended in the Rand Report to the Pentagon. It seems very stupid to continue a war that is counter-productive.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  3. #283
    Cheese
    Aunt Spiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Sasnakra
    Last Seen
    09-10-16 @ 06:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,433

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    What a ridiculous, over the top flat out lie. How about actually arguing what people are saying, instead of building straw men to get outraged about.
    I thought it was sarcasm. ?
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  4. #284
    Sage

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Undisclosed
    Last Seen
    03-18-13 @ 02:59 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    5,544

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Yes, I am an American, are you?

    I would like to see a new strategy as recommended in the Rand Report to the Pentagon. It seems very stupid to continue a war that is counter-productive.
    Am I an American? Which America? There are so many.

    I support a complete and immediate withdrawal, but for very different reasons than you. But, I didn't ask you about a new strategy. I specifically asked about whether you would like to see American troops defeated or victorious if Obama refused to withdraw them.

    The reason I asked the second question is because I'm curious about whether we are citizens of the same America.

  5. #285
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Albert Di Salvo View Post
    Am I an American? Which America? There are so many.

    I support a complete and immediate withdrawal, but for very different reasons than you. But, I didn't ask you about a new strategy. I specifically asked about whether you would like to see American troops defeated or victorious if Obama refused to withdraw them.

    The reason I asked the second question is because I'm curious about whether we are citizens of the same America.
    I am a citizen of the America that has Middle East wars instead of a domestic energy program. Which America are you with?

    You cannot determine success or defeat without the correct strategy. Have you read the report to the Pentagon by the Rand Corp?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  6. #286
    Cheese
    Aunt Spiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Sasnakra
    Last Seen
    09-10-16 @ 06:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,433

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I am a citizen of the America that has Middle East wars instead of a domestic energy program. Which America are you with?

    You cannot determine success or defeat without the correct strategy. Have you read the report to the Pentagon by the Rand Corp?
    Which one?
    The Rand Corporation is always releasing reports on something ... Pick your poison, which one are you referring to specificly
    RAND | Reports & Bookstore | Browse by Category
    Last edited by Aunt Spiker; 11-17-09 at 02:06 AM.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  7. #287
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Which one?
    The Rand Corporation is always releasing reports on something ... Pick your poison, which one are you referring to specificly
    RAND | Reports & Bookstore | Browse by Category
    The one I referenced a few pages back in this thread. The one where they concluded the "war on terror" was a failure.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  8. #288
    Cheese
    Aunt Spiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Sasnakra
    Last Seen
    09-10-16 @ 06:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,433

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    The one I referenced a few pages back in this thread. The one where they concluded the "war on terror" was a failure.
    Thank you - I didn't see it.

    Ok - I read it, it's short and simple. . . but there are a few issues.

    [Terrorist cells that ended or were splintered] They were penetrated and eliminated by local police and intelligence agencies (40 percent) [as opposed to the use of military force], or they reached a peaceful political accommodation with their government (43 percent).

    In 10 percent of cases, terrorist groups ended because they achieved victory. Military force led to the end of terrorist groups in 7 percent of cases. The authors found that militaries tended to be most effective when used against terrorist groups engaged in insurgencies in which the groups were large, well armed, and well organized. But against most terrorist groups, military force was usually too blunt an instrument.

    The analysis also found that

    Religiously motivated terrorist groups took longer to eliminate than other groups but rarely achieved their objectives; no religiously motivated group achieved victory during the period studied [1968 - 2006].

    Size significantly determined a group's fate. Groups exceeding 10,000 members were victorious more than 25 percent of the time, while victory was rare for groups below 1,000 members.

    terrorist groups from upper-income countries are much more likely to be left-wing or nationalist and much less likely to be motivated by religion.

    But military force has not undermined al Qa'ida. As of 2008, al Qa'ida has remained a strong and competent organization. Its goal is intact: to establish a pan-Islamic caliphate in the Middle East by uniting Muslims to fight infidels and overthrow West-friendly regimes. It continues to employ terrorism and has been involved in more terrorist attacks around the world in the years since September 11, 2001, than in prior years, though engaging in no successful attacks of a comparable magnitude to the attacks on New York and Washington.

    Key to this strategy is replacing the war-on-terrorism orientation with the kind of counterterrorism approach that is employed by most governments facing significant terrorist threats today. Calling the efforts a war on terrorism raises public expectations — both in the United States and elsewhere — that there is a battlefield solution. It also tends to legitimize the terrorists' view that they are conducting a jihad (holy war) against the United States and elevates them to the status of holy warriors. Terrorists should be perceived as criminals, not holy warriors.
    So, here they're saying that for the really big groups - military force is advisable. But since military force hasn't worked with A-Q then we should approach them as we would smaller groups (police and government venues).

    And therein lies our problem and goal - to assist, support and rebuild their governments so that can be done. . .That's what we did in Iraq and that's what we should do in Afghanistan, if that's to be our continued focus.
    However, how can one rebuild and support a government when the government and police force is, also, infiltrated by the group (one or many) that we're trying to weed out? Or, if not, then they're so set in their ways they're not open to change and certain levels of help (as it was with Iraq).

    I agree, partially...

    However (the last part) I don't agree with - the "common criminal" VS "terrorist" treatment doesn't fly with me yet.
    *if* our military was *not* involved then perhaps. But so long as they're acting against our soldiers they are soldiers from the opposing force and not just common criminals. (my opinion, anyway). However, I'm aware that it might be a psychological-issue. They are fighting a holy-war and so if they think they're fighting it and they think that we believe it's their holy war, then that miht enourage them and bring them together.

    So, aside that, they can only be combatants or criminals if we remove our military force completely and assist in reforming their countries in other ways.
    Last edited by Aunt Spiker; 11-17-09 at 02:53 AM.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  9. #289
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Thank you - I didn't see it.
    No problem, you are welcome.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  10. #290
    Cheese
    Aunt Spiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Sasnakra
    Last Seen
    09-10-16 @ 06:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,433

    Re: Paratrooper's Mom Begs Obama: 'End It'

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    No problem, you are welcome.
    If we can't even weed gang-activity and crimes of that nature (which we were waging a heaven war against up until our focus shifted) out of our own country I don't see how we're suppose to help the world weed it out of their own corners. The whole focus is very lopsided and has lost it's way - long ago. . . and is just a drain, now.

    I'm sure Obama will bring everyone home and refocus our goals - but he's just taking so long to do it. For some reason he just can't say "ok, enough" ... ??
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

Page 29 of 38 FirstFirst ... 192728293031 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •