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Thread: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Hoekstra said he is "absolutely furious" that the house intel committee has been refused an intelligence briefing by the DNI or CIA on Hasan's attempt to reach out to al Qaeda, as first reported by ABC News. [/QUOTE]

    If the authorities are waiting to see if Hasan had direct on tact with Al Qaeda to determine if this was a terrorist attack are just I believe goofy.
    In my mind this was terror whether it was a conspiracy or just a solo act it was terror.

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by EpicDude86 View Post
    With what? Muslims? yes. They do have a problem with this sort of thing.
    No, with incarcerating people without proof of guilt. A criminal justice major should be extremely aware of such issues.

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by Lerxst View Post
    Wow, the so the FBI was watching him for six months or so because he was an Islamist officer in the U.S. military, and now the CIA had been watching him for the same thing. A whole bunch of fellow Army officers had complained several times that he was an anti-American Islamist.

    Yet nobody ever made it a point to go visit this guy?

    Yeah, okay. If that is the case then a nice big portion of our intelligence community, the FBI, and the officer corp of the U.S. Army is an absolute joke...completely incompetent.
    No.

    Not quite.

    That is the cost of political correctness.

    I think Alan Keyes answered it well in the 2000 debate. I remember this moment like it was yesterday because I was disappointed by McCain and Bush... Keyes knocked it out of the park.

    This guy should have been the first black president. He is a straight shooting son-of-a-gun.

    KING: Alan?

    KEYES: I know everybody thinks that this doing some favor to a racial group, but if our police and enforcement people have the experience that a given crime is disproportionately being committed by folks from a given ethnic group, we are now going to pass a law that says you can't notice that?

    I -- I...

    KING: But they haven't done the crime yet.

    KEYES: Excuse me, no, no. All I'm saying is we're going to pass a law and we're going to enforce a law that says that we can't notice the characteristics of individuals who commit crimes and develop profiles to help folks pursue the solving of crimes based on our experience.

    Experience by the way is not prejudice. Prejudice is an opinion you form apart from experience, prior to experience. An opinion formed based on experience is not prejudice. It is judgment. And I think our law enforcement officers ought to be able to...

    KING: You wouldn't mind being stopped by a car if there was a high prevalence of...

    KEYES: You know the person I would blame for that? If there are black folks out there disproportionately committing certain kinds of crime, my parents raised me to know that I represent the race in every thing I do. And I wish that everybody would take that attitude and stop committing crimes and doing things that bring a bad reputation on to people.

    KING: But if you were stopped...

    KEYES: That's what I resent.

    KING: ... if you were stopped you wouldn't be angry?

    KEYES: I just told you who I would be angry at.
    Right on, right on bro.

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    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    I think Political Correctness had a part in no action at all being seemingly taken against him. However, much like I was saying the other day, people are arguing in part because people are pushing too far.

    Becasue Political Correctness may be a factor doesn't mean we need to view all Muslims as potential time bombs of radicalism or ban muslims from serving in the military of think that since we don't know which muslims are radical we must distrust them all. And the problem is many of those pushing the PC issue (not all, but many) are the same that seem to be thanking, implying, tacitly agreeing, or straight up stating the extreme on the other side.

    And even if PC playd a part in it, its much like other instances that the right like to say "its the people, not the views/objects".

    Political Correctness doesn't kill people. People who refuse to do their job for fear of Political Correctness may kill people, but PC doesn't. People Kill People.

    Maybe it was Political Correctness. Maybe it was certain matters of protocal. Maybe it was actually simply the law and the constitution and him not having done anything enough to warrant action by those that could. Maybe it was friends of him not taking him serious. Maybe some people just viewed him as harmless. Maybe a lot of this is getting exposed now because its sensational but in reality makes up a very small percentage of what most people knew about him. Maybe action HAD been taken up to the point that it was legally or structually able to have been.

    But people, again, just want to assume something and zoom in on something not because they care, or they give a damn, but they're trying to play these pathetic political games and jump on anything they can to be able to raise up the flag of whatever token issue they want and to use the deaths of these people...in this case our troops...as exploited pawns in their attempts to make political points over actually caring about the facts or reality of a situation.
    Two points:

    1) This administration didn't seem to mind making everyone aware that there is a threat to this country from ex-military, right wing extremists.

    2) It's already illegal for members of the KKK, The Nazis and street gangs to be members of the armed forces.

    Treating Muslims a little different, because of an obvious threat from within the Muslim community would be any different.

    But, we all know that ain't gonna happen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Two points:

    1) This administration didn't seem to mind making everyone aware that there is a threat to this country from ex-military, right wing extremists.
    And many conservatives raised holy hell about how the government shouldn't be degrading hard working citizens because of a few extremists out in the middle of north Dakota.

    2) It's already illegal for members of the KKK, The Nazis and street gangs to be members of the armed forces.
    Some kind of link for proof that its ILLEGAL for KKK members or Nazi's to get into the military. I can understand if its just general policy that they fail basic background checks, but "illegal"?

    And even then, are you seriously comparing muslims, in general, to KKK member, Nazi's, and the Bloods and Crips?

    The KKK and the Nazi party exist for no other purpose than to push extremely racist views and ideals and promote the degradation of various races; not some of them, that's what the MOVEMENT AS A WHOLE is partially about. Street Gangs on a whole perpetrate crimes. And you're comparing this to a religion who have an extreme minority, even in this country, of their members that actually act out in a way that puts them even close to on par with the KKK and the Nazi's?

    Not to mention the military is an extension of the Executive Branch and as such one could argue the "No Religious Test Clause" of the constitution would come into play. Or shall you act like Truth Detector previously, droning on and on about how great the Constitution is and how liberals are trying to destroy it and the moment it acts against your favor say "its not a suicide pact".

    Treating Muslims a little different, because of an obvious threat from within the Muslim community would be any different.
    Its not an "obvious" threat. The amount of insane Muslims acting out in extreme fashion is a MINUSCULE percentage and you're suggesting to **** on the constitution to punish millions of innocent Muslims because of likely less than 5% of their population in this country's actions.

    This is like saying we need to Bar Christians from being able to enter the Hospitals that have any ability in any way of performing abortions because of an obvious threat from within the Christian Community due to the murder of George Tiller, the Bombing of Clinics, and other crimes against them.

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Some kind of link for proof that its ILLEGAL for KKK members or Nazi's to get into the military. I can understand if its just general policy that they fail basic background checks, but "illegal"?
    DoD regulations prohibit soldiers from being members of extemist orginizations and/or criminal gangs. Hence, it's illegal.

    And even then, are you seriously comparing muslims, in general, to KKK member, Nazi's, and the Bloods and Crips?
    When's the last time that any of those groups pulled something like this? Name one.

    The KKK and the Nazi party exist for no other purpose than to push extremely racist views and ideals and promote the degradation of various races; not some of them, that's what the MOVEMENT AS A WHOLE is partially about. Street Gangs on a whole perpetrate crimes. And you're comparing this to a religion who have an extreme minority, even in this country, of their members that actually act out in a way that puts them even close to on par with the KKK and the Nazi's?
    When you consider how Muslims think of all non-Muslims as infadels and not worthy to live, then Muslims could easily fall into the same category. Ever been to Mosque with other Muslims? Wanna take a guess why it will never happen? That's right, because you're an infadel and you won't be allowed in the place.

    Not to mention the military is an extension of the Executive Branch and as such one could argue the "No Religious Test Clause" of the constitution would come into play. Or shall you act like Truth Detector previously, droning on and on about how great the Constitution is and how liberals are trying to destroy it and the moment it acts against your favor say "its not a suicide pact".
    I bet that didn't hold if a Bushido'ist wanted to join the service during WW2. Bushido was a religion...sorta. Don't forget that part in the oath where it says, "enemies, foreign and domestic". I keep thinking of that, for some reason.

    The Constitution is great. I think it should be used more to protect my right to, "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", than the rights of religious nutjobs to try and kill me. I'm funny like that.


    Its not an "obvious" threat. The amount of insane Muslims acting out in extreme fashion is a MINUSCULE percentage and you're suggesting to **** on the constitution to punish millions of innocent Muslims because of likely less than 5% of their population in this country's actions.
    Yeah, tell that to the families of those 13 dead soldiers. 14, if you count the baby that one woman was carrying. 46 Casualties, minuscule, yeah, ok. Ever been shot before?

    This is like saying we need to Bar Christians from being able to enter the Hospitals that have any ability in any way of performing abortions because of an obvious threat from within the Christian Community due to the murder of George Tiller, the Bombing of Clinics, and other crimes against them.

    If the Libbos had their way, it would happen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    No, with incarcerating people without proof of guilt. A criminal justice major should be extremely aware of such issues.
    Three words for you to answer the original statement:

    USA PATRIOT ACT


    lol I am very aware.

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    No.

    Not quite.

    That is the cost of political correctness.

    I think Alan Keyes answered it well in the 2000 debate. I remember this moment like it was yesterday because I was disappointed by McCain and Bush... Keyes knocked it out of the park.

    This guy should have been the first black president. He is a straight shooting son-of-a-gun.



    Right on, right on bro.

    .
    Profiling saves lives and that's the ****ing truth sir. Keyes made a good point...

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    As has been noted before, the first step in failure belongs within the chain of command, and the fellow officers/soliders that Hassan had interacted with. I saw on ABC news(I believe) that Hassan had attended some official press conference in the past and had spoken out negatively about the US role. This guy was a ****ing Major. While it is a decent paying grade, it's not at all near the top of the list with regards to policy decision, and certainley not a rank that warrants open, public questioning of those policies while in uniform. Even generals that have issue with doctrine and policies laid down by the CinC usually exercise greater restraint in questioning it publically.

    Lucky for us(but unfortunantley for the vicitms families), Hassan was an idiot and went crazy. Had he taken his retirement, or left the US military, he would have had some credibility(particularly with war protestors that eat up what few former military members they can exploit) due to his profession and rank, in speaking his mind about the war, and various things he had espoused unprofessionally while in uniform.

    Its just too bad the people that responded didn't put one round in the head and finish the job. Of course, a military execution could possibly be the better option. If we aren't willing to execute someone in our ranks that had no problems executing his fellow soliders himself, then the Armed forces have lost their way. Particularly when it appears that this wasn't just some heat of the moment, passion killing, but an enemy within.
    "Loyalty only matters when there's a hundred reasons not to be-" Gen. Mattis

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    Re: Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda

    Quote Originally Posted by WI Crippler View Post
    As has been noted before, the first step in failure belongs within the chain of command, and the fellow officers/soliders that Hassan had interacted with. I saw on ABC news(I believe) that Hassan had attended some official press conference in the past and had spoken out negatively about the US role. This guy was a ****ing Major. While it is a decent paying grade, it's not at all near the top of the list with regards to policy decision, and certainley not a rank that warrants open, public questioning of those policies while in uniform. Even generals that have issue with doctrine and policies laid down by the CinC usually exercise greater restraint in questioning it publically.

    Lucky for us(but unfortunantley for the vicitms families), Hassan was an idiot and went crazy. Had he taken his retirement, or left the US military, he would have had some credibility(particularly with war protestors that eat up what few former military members they can exploit) due to his profession and rank, in speaking his mind about the war, and various things he had espoused unprofessionally while in uniform.

    Its just too bad the people that responded didn't put one round in the head and finish the job. Of course, a military execution could possibly be the better option. If we aren't willing to execute someone in our ranks that had no problems executing his fellow soliders himself, then the Armed forces have lost their way. Particularly when it appears that this wasn't just some heat of the moment, passion killing, but an enemy within.

    That's not allowed, regardless of rank.

    Bottom line is, if this guy had been cashiered for that, the cries of descrimination would still be echoeing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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