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Thread: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    Anyone still want to argue that this wasn't religiously motivated and that he wasn't a jihadist?

    Did it cross your mind that it might have been motivated by the US "crusade" and the fact your country is currently occupying two Muslim states and is threatening the third one?

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    That's fine, and that's probably why I have a higher %, as I was thinking about the % that think things like killing civilians is a legitmate means to their ends (which would obviously be much much smaller than those simply not opposed to it).

    Of that 1%, if 1% are of a mind to attack the US, and a mere 1% of that 1% succeed, that's 1000 attacks.

    And so, while the huge majority of the Muslims in the world might not ever even cosnider it, the threat is still very real.

    And if you think that 1% of the total seems to large.... Nader pulled ~3% in the 2000 election
    You're saying that throughout the world, there are 1,000 muslims who will attack the US? I don't think anyone would disagree with that.

    Where that analysis runs into problems is when people (not saying you) try to use calculations like that to support their arguments that we should put muslims in internment camps, expel all non-second generation Americans from the military, etc.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Patrick View Post
    Who cares what his motivation was? Does it change the fact that he's a nutjob and killed several innocent people? Obviously, his behavior doesn't bespeak of the majority of peaceful Muslims across the world. Rather than blaming Islam, perhaps we should...i don't know...blame the guy who was shooting people?
    Quote Originally Posted by Arch Enemy View Post
    He's def. got a great case of Jihadist mentality in him, but I don't see the main stream Islamic notation that you claim is in the rhetoric; he wouldn't fit in with 99% of the Muslim population.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    K, and what do we do about it? This is one guy doing insane things maybe...maybe based on religion, we don't really know at this time. What is proper recourse for one of our soldiers going crazy and shooting up an army base? Do we invade a country? Which one? Do we outlaw Islam? What's the proper course of action should this event be as you think it to be?
    Good God people, the guy just points out that everyone who put their head in the sand and pretended that there was any chance at all that this had nothing to do with Islamic extremism was wrong, and you ignore him and shout him down with observations that most Muslims aren't terrorists even though the guy never claimed that all or even most Muslims are terrorists. Talk about a strawman.

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Caught a guy trying to blow up a building in Dallas, plus other sleeper cells in the northeast. This particularly guy pulled off his jihad at Fort Hood.

    Something tells me we're in for about 150 more of these in the next few years.

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    You're saying that throughout the world, there are 1,000 muslims who will attack the US? I don't think anyone would disagree with that.
    Actually no -- that 1000 is if the 1% of the 1% of the 1% succeed.

    Where that analysis runs into problems is when people (not saying you) try to use calculations like that to support their arguments that we should put muslims in internment camps, expel all non-second generation Americans from the military, etc.
    I'd agree with this. It does, however, recduce the argument that Muslin extremism isnt a legitmate threat beause 'so few' Muslims are willing to commit acts of terrorism to achieve their goals.

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Caught a guy trying to blow up a building in Dallas, plus other sleeper cells in the northeast. This particularly guy pulled off his jihad at Fort Hood.

    Something tells me we're in for about 150 more of these in the next few years.
    And you're basing this on...?

    The fact that you're referring to the next 3 years in particular indicates that you think this is somehow related to Obama. Can you elaborate on that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Actually no -- that 1000 is if the 1% of the 1% of the 1% succeed.
    My apologies, that's what I meant to say. Again, I don't think anyone would disagree with this. There were approximately 3k terrorist attacks in Iraq back in 05, so I'd even say the number is higher.

    I'd agree with this. It does, however, recduce the argument that Muslin extremism isnt a legitmate threat beause 'so few' Muslims are willing to commit acts of terrorism to achieve their goals.
    I don't see how it does. Nobody is arguing that Islamic extremism is not a legitimate threat. What people are arguing is that it's foolish to paint all Muslims with the brush of Islamic extremism, which is what several people have been doing.

    Furthermore, the fact that there are a large number (in absolute terms) of Muslims outside the US who commit acts of terrorism to achieve their goals doesn't have much to do with the fact that there are very few Muslims in the US who commit acts of terrorism to achieve their goals.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Patrick View Post
    Do you even know what the word "jihad" means?
    Holy war. Anyone telling you different is perpetrating al-Taqiya.

    You don't fight an internal struggle against the infidel.

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Which is the reason why I'm hesitant to believe these claims without further information.
    You mean like his internet postings?

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Let's set aside the obvious issues with relying on hearsay (and hearsay within hearsay) and turn to a related question.
    These statements are backed up by multiple sources, and the mans own internet postings.

    And this isn't hearsay, the man isn't saying that he heard from someone that he said this, he said he heard him say this, that is eyewitness testimony not hearsay evidence.

    What are your thoughts on hate crime legislation?
    I agree with it in regards to sentencing enhancements for actions which are already crimes.

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    Re: Fort Hood shooting: Nidal Malik Hasan 'said Muslims should rise up'

    Quote Originally Posted by Elena View Post
    Did it cross your mind that it might have been motivated by the US "crusade" and the fact your country is currently occupying two Muslim states and is threatening the third one?
    You mean the response to Islamist imperialist expansionism?

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