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12 dead, as many as 31 injured in Fort Hood shootings

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relatively small number of Muslims embrace violence and an overwhelming majority do not care or show their reaction one way or another.

Do you understand what motivates people to take up a protest against their own for doing something they don't agree with? Versus taking up protest against outsiders who condemn and attack them?

This nation is a prime example of people who don't give a **** about most things. Our streets should have been filled with protesters for the last eight years or so based upon the actions of our leaders. But those protests were relatively few. And nobody took up arms to stop these horrible events from unraveling. Why?

Because we were galvanized by events and guided by the media...hanging on every word coming out of the White House. We had motivation to fill the streets in support of our nation when we were attacked. But when we were doing the attacking...which much of the world condemned...we really didn't get all that wrapped around the axle.

Do you know what the people in say Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Iraq, Iran, etc. are fed via the media? Do you know what it is they hear and read on a regular basis regarding the west?

Most of the outside world doesn't really give a **** about us, they care about themselves. And they view us as nosy westerners at best, and militaristic war mongers at worst. Do you really think that Muslims around the world are going to be moved to put out the energy necessary to protest the actions of a small number of their kind when we in the west refuse to even be rational or logical in our reaction to the few Muslims causing all the trouble?

The populace of the Middle East has a right to protest against the U.S. We've earned our lumps after what we've done in Iraq and for the historical mess we've made of things there (along with Europe). But the argument that "well they don't do anything about those murderous Islamists, they don't protest against them, therefore they're bad" simply doesn't fly.

Our own intelligence agencies and U.S. military couldn't manage to sniff out a so called radical Islamist who was allegedly preaching jihad in an open forum from within their own ranks.

Islamic terrorist organizations don't put out signage on their headquarters. They hide, they're careful. Because not all Muslims want them there. They don't want to turned into the Americans or to their own nations authorities. So they hide. They don't advertise in the local paper. Keeping in mind they are generally very well armed and at least somewhat trained in how to use their weapons, what do you really expect a bunch of peace loving, unarmed Muslims to do? Line up fifty abreast and charge the Terrorist K-Mart?

Not all Muslims want to die for their cause, especially the peace loving ones. Why don't all mothers and fathers regularly take up arms and kill the gang members who've infested their neighborhood and ruined it with drug sales and gang violence? Why don't the Mexican citizens rise up against the drug cartels who make their streets run red with blood?
 
Not that easy,
Unfortunately, we aren't at the same restaurant .
Second, will you go to "death" by your legs to stop it, while you know that wont affect.
Third, I wont bother talking because I am sure as hell he wont listen, or stop as he is "mentally unstable".

Wasn't a good example though, sorry.

We are at the same restaurant (Chez Earth was a metaphor), dumbass. I'm not leaving this planet and neither are you. And guess what. I have retarded relatives too, and while sometimes they bug people I tell them to knock it off. The point is, some people give other people a bad name and ruin equilibrium for the rest of us.

It was a magnificent example and you can't handle it.
 
Do you understand what motivates people to take up a protest against their own for doing something they don't agree with? Versus taking up protest against outsiders who condemn and attack them?

If you'll read my eleven thousand posts, you'll find I take both sides of many arguments even against my friends. It's not hard. If I can do it, they can do it.
 
We are at the same restaurant (Chez Earth was a metaphor), dumbass. I'm not leaving this planet and neither are you. And guess what. I have retarded relatives too, and while sometimes they bug people I tell them to knock it off. The point is, some people give other people a bad name and ruin equilibrium for the rest of us.

It was a magnificent example and you can't handle it.

Might want to tone done the language, specifically the bolded. Just FYI dude, hate to see ya get busted.
 
I meant race card as in, Bull**** argument based on stereotypes. twas a simile (a comparison using the words like or as).


Most people would if they could,

and...they do.

I know what you meant and it wasn't a bull**** argument. It's a sound and realistic argument.
 
If you'll read my eleven thousand posts, you'll find I take both sides of many arguments even against my friends. It's not hard. If I can do it, they can do it.

There is a major difference in posting on the internet and actually taking to the streets against the Islamists. You don't personally make that kind of commitment so it's very disingenuous of you to compare yourself to them from the safety of your U.S. house. These cells are right there among many of those population bases. We live a different life than people in Iraq, Iran, Jordan, Egypt, Yemen, etc.

And for that matter we have plenty of Muslims on this site who openly criticize radical Islamic militant groups. So by your standard there are in fact Muslims doing at least as much as you are to protest these extremists.
 
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We are at the same restaurant (Chez Earth was a metaphor), dumbass. I'm not leaving this planet and neither are you. And guess what. I have retarded relatives too, and while sometimes they bug people I tell them to knock it off. The point is, some people give other people a bad name and ruin equilibrium for the rest of us.

I know what you're up to, but once I read it it jumped in my mind that "Muslims see whats happening and don't care about it" , how is that if we are a subject to the same risk too .

It was a magnificent example and you can't handle it.

:roflwtf !!!
 
I know what you're up to, but once I read it it jumped in my mind that "Muslims see whats happening and don't care about it" , how is that if we are a subject to the same risk too .



:roflwtf !!!

That's what's suspicious about Muslims... >.>

Is it that hard to take a stand against radicals? I've seen a few great shows where a Muslim will come on and defend his faith and disown the radicals, but on average, it's like you're all just...kinda indifferent...
 
That's what's suspicious about Muslims... >.>

Is it that hard to take a stand against radicals?

When they live in the same town as you and will detonate a sedan full of explosives in front of your house or behead your son for taking that stand...yeah, it's kinda that hard.
 
There is a major difference in posting on the internet and actually taking to the streets against the Islamists. You don't personally make that kind of commitment so it's very disingenuous of you to compare yourself to them from the safety of your U.S. house. These cells are right there among many of those population bases. We live a different life than people in Iraq, Iran, Jordan, Egypt, Yemen, etc.

I've stood toe to toe with some very large, smelly disagreeing parties to defend and denounce things. don't talk to me about being disingenuous. I've had my ass kicked over standing up for something I didn't necessarily believe in too, and while it's not threat of death, I do get off my ass and do things.

And for that matter we have plenty of Muslims on this site who openly criticize radical Islamic militant groups. So by your standard there are in fact Muslims doing at least as much as you are to protest these extremists.

I'm gonna be honest, kinda losing interest in this thread...the basement is calling me, but I see what you're saying, cultural and societal differences and all. I just figured that if the radicals were such a small percentage the least they could do as a whole is denounce them...a radical hunt wouldn't be a bad start either...Good talk! I've learned something.
 
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Muslims allover the world got much bigger worries than hold a big banner and walk with it down the street . Its not their problem if you watch too much TV .

Your right they have bigger worries, like protesting in mass because someone draws a cartoon picture of muhammad.

You are a muslim. Are you angry at the islamic extreamist who fight jihad in Allahs cause?

edit... where did you go Ahmed? why did you not answer my question?
 
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All we ever hear from Muslims and their infadel apologists during times like this are excuses and, "If The United States didn't fill in the blank, this might not have happened". And, that's it!
 
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All we ever hear from Muslims and their infadel apologists during times like this are excuses and, "If The United States didn't fill in the blank, this might not have happened". And, that's it!

Source?

Please?
 
It's in the American Conservative repertoire to group Bin Laden and Islamists in one kettle. It's sheer ignorance that is only fueled by ugly hatred.

There's a damn good reason why Bin Laden isn't in the Middle East.

bin Laden is just one man. There are many islamic extreamist organizations, sunni and shia. They are spread around the globe. Most of them have one thing in common. They believe they are fighting holy war for Allahs cause. And most of them have the long term goal of setting up a worldwide Islamic caliphate. They also know that this could take a very long time. Decades or even centuries. They tend to look at things in the long term.
 
Greater Jihad : To inhibit yourself from forbidden desires .

Lesser Jihad : To fight your enemies inside the battlefield

Battlefield : "A place where the battle is fought", then there must be 2 fighting parties, where the friend/foe are known . That's how all wars in Islam goes .

About that "suicide bombers" I'd read an answer of a famous Sheikh : Bin Othaimin when asked about bomb suicide :

^
^
Sorry for bad translation, but the dictionary didn't help a lot.

I'd read an article of a book called "Self-bombing, between intolerance and depression" that analyze the exact mental state of the suicide . I think that really goes with suicide bomber's mind.

Anyway What Major Nidal did may not consider a suicide, but still forbidden in Islam for many reasons, least of them is betrayal, "how can you shoot them while they protect you".

Thanks for answering my question.

Islam is like the other desert religions, ie., a mixture of compassion and viciousness. So I don't hold the tenets of Islam responsible as the cause of the death of my brothers and sisters at the hands of your co-religionist.

However, that doesn't end the inquiry. The question posed is how can my brothers and sisters avoid death and injury at the hands of some Muslim Americans who kill us in the name of their religion?

Have you paid attention to the news this year. There is a steady drumbeat of planned attacks by Muslim Americans against non-Muslim Americans in the name of Islam. There was a recent shoot out between groups of young Muslim American men and the FBI.

I notice that Hindu Americans, Buddhist Americans, Jain Americans, Jewish Americans, Animist Americans, Christian Americans (except for the abortion murderer), Sikh Americans, Atheist Americans and Agnostic Americans, have not attempted to commit mass murder in the name of their religions or beliefs during the last decade. The attempted mass murderers come from a single community. From this I have concluded that there are some people in that community who are the deadly enemies of my brothers and sisters.

So I say to you how can my brothers and sisters be protected without compromising the US Constitution? Saying that my brothers and sisters must simply absorb the mayhem will not be accepted as a polite response.
 
Your right they have bigger worries, like protesting in mass because someone draws a cartoon picture of muhammad.

You are a muslim. Are you angry at the islamic extreamist who fight jihad in Allahs cause?

What was the percentage of Muslims that protested the cartoon picture?
 
bin Laden is just one man. There are many islamic extreamist organizations, sunni and shia. They are spread around the globe. Most of them have one thing in common. They believe they are fighting holy war for Allahs cause. And most of them have the long term goal of setting up a worldwide Islamic caliphate. They also know that this could take a very long time. Decades or even centuries. They tend to look at things in the long term.

a Shia Caliphate is like saying a British Sultan; it's plausible, but highly unlikely.

Other than that I don't understand the point you are trying to make. Yes, there are Islamic Extremists, and yes they are militants; whether or not they want to create a Caliphate really depends on who you ask, or which organization you are talking about.

Point of Clarification, please.
 
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That's what's suspicious about Muslims... >.>

Is it that hard to take a stand against radicals? I've seen a few great shows where a Muslim will come on and defend his faith and disown the radicals, but on average, it's like you're all just...kinda indifferent...

Hirsi Anaan Ali. How did it work out for her?
 
She, like Ibn Warraq, is an apostate. There are Muslims that condemn other Muslims that engage in unethical actions on both political and specifically theological grounds.
 
a Shia Caliphate is like saying a British Sultan; it's plausible, but highly unlikely.

Other than that I don't understand the point you are trying to make. Yes, there are Islamic Extremists, and yes they are militants; whether or not they want to create a Caliphate really depends on who you ask, or which organization you are talking about.

Point of Clarification, please.

My point is that bin Laden is the least of our worries. We should be more concerned about our free societies being changed slowly through stealth jihad. This includes the slow replacement of our freedoms, laws, and western values with sharia. Its called sharia creep. What is happening in the UK is a perfect example of sharia creep. I don't know about you but I want to remain free. And I do not think we should allow seperate societies with there own laws to exist within our nations. Example in Britan, polygamy is illegal unless you are a muslim.
 
My point is that bin Laden is the least of our worries. We should be more concerned about our free societies being changed slowly through stealth jihad. This includes the slow replacement of our freedoms, laws, and western values with sharia. Its called sharia creep. What is happening in the UK is a perfect example of sharia creep. I don't know about you but I want to remain free. And I do not think we should allow seperate societies with there own laws to exist within our nations. Example in Britan, polygamy is illegal unless you are a muslim.

I think I just **** myself.
 
My point is that bin Laden is the least of our worries. We should be more concerned about our free societies being changed slowly through stealth jihad. This includes the slow replacement of our freedoms, laws, and western values with sharia. Its called sharia creep. What is happening in the UK is a perfect example of sharia creep. I don't know about you but I want to remain free. And I do not think we should allow seperate societies with there own laws to exist within our nations. Example in Britan, polygamy is illegal unless you are a muslim.

Your example is a bit wrong, or misleading. Polygamous marriages cannot be performed in the United Kingdom. If you are a Saudi Arabian and you have multiple wives, you can keep those wives if you decide to move to the United Kingdom.

However, Polygamy in most Middle-Eastern and Muslim societies is considered backwards and weird. Jordanians make fun of the Saudis who come and visit (good beaches in Jordan) because they look like they just came out of a cave. Saudis like to make big scenes, in their traditional garb, and with their wives in single-file line.

Sgt. that should be the least of your worries. Sharia Law isn't coming to a town near you anytime soon.
 
Your example is a bit wrong, or misleading. Polygamous marriages cannot be performed in the United Kingdom. If you are a Saudi Arabian and you have multiple wives, you can keep those wives if you decide to move to the United Kingdom.

However, Polygamy in most Middle-Eastern and Muslim societies is considered backwards and weird. Jordanians make fun of the Saudis who come and visit (good beaches in Jordan) because they look like they just came out of a cave. Saudis like to make big scenes, in their traditional garb, and with their wives in single-file line.

Sgt. that should be the least of your worries. Sharia Law isn't coming to a town near you anytime soon.

Groups like CAIR are doing everything they can to do just that. Through law suits and intimidation. Its a slow process but over time things are changing. People are changing, walking on egg shells so as not to offend. Well maybe Im just old fashioned. I refuse to be sensitive. I will offend those I disagree with. And I will not backdown or surrender my freedom to any filthy jihadist POS.
 
Groups like CAIR are doing everything they can to do just that. Through law suits and intimidation. Its a slow process but over time things are changing. People are changing, walking on egg shells so as not to offend. Well maybe Im just old fashioned. I refuse to be sensitive. I will offend those I disagree with. And I will not backdown or surrender my freedom to any filthy jihadist POS.

Well, my friend, then you must remain in your coma of ignorance. Because you hate them won't make them go away.

The situation in G.B. will change whenever the more conservative party wins the election; that's how G.B. works, within one term the entire outward appearance can change.

I don't know who is telling you these boogey man stories, but there will not be any Sharia Law in the United States any time soon. You should be more worried about the implications of transnationalism, as that's going to be a whole new beast.
 
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