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Thread: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Martel View Post
    You see no shifts abroad. You may see Obama is too cowardly to waterboard, but, that's the only change you see. Unless you've another to highlight.
    Too cowardly to waterboard? It was the Bush/Cheney position on torture that morally bankrupted our country with our allies.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Who says no one gets spied on even with warrants?
    If there is a basis to get a warrant, due process has been satisfied.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Martel View Post
    American......I am confused here and especially by aps' post. This was no change in mind, Obama would merely pander to his audience. During the Democratic Campaign, Obama voted right along with Bush for wiretapping, Hillary tried to use it against him. His constituencise simply didn't care that Obama followed Bush on this policy and the story gets even scarier although not appropriate for this thread. This issue he voted yea on as the Left deafened us with their silence proving beyond any doubt they weren't concerned for this issue ion the first place. It was just another Bush bashing effort, now that Bush is gone, the pretend and fake outrage over warrantless wiretapping, in fact, the fake and pretend outrage for the entire Patriot Act has vanished.
    No it hasn't. And it is not fake either. I am still enraged. Bush might be gone, but what is in his place is just as bad.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Too cowardly to waterboard? It was the Bush/Cheney position on torture that morally bankrupted our country with our allies.
    Our allies never did any such thing did they? Which of our allies have unblemished histories?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Too cowardly to waterboard? It was the Bush/Cheney position on torture that morally bankrupted our country with our allies.
    One, waterboarding isn't torture. Two, it was approved by Congress. Three, which allies?
    It was the Austrasians, that hewed on bravely through the thick of the fight, it was they who found and cut down the Saracen King.

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    If there is a basis to get a warrant, due process has been satisfied.
    This has historical precedence...or have Presidents during war never concerned themselves with "basis"?
    It was the Austrasians, that hewed on bravely through the thick of the fight, it was they who found and cut down the Saracen King.

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    The government should be required to get a warrant before engaging in spying on citizens of this country....period. We require that of the police, why should we not require it of the government?

    I don't even think that getting a warrant after the fact is good enough....but Bush/Obama apparently don't believe the Constitution requires that.

    The Constitution requires due process and accountability....and we as citizens should demand that of our government.
    Once more, that is not what this program is about. But thank you for at least being consistently wrong.


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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Let me get this straight.

    You claimed this:

    It was proven that the NSA has gathered and stored every email written by every American. Is that spying?
    And in support, you provided links to claims by an individual who was diagnosed as suffering from psychotic paranoia. Nice.

    And before you claim that this was some sort of cover-up, you should note that all of this happened before he started leaking things to the NYT:

    In April, 2003, shortly after the e-mail message, Tice was ordered to undertake a psychological evaluation, which he believed was retaliatory. The Defense Department psychologist concluded that Tice suffered from psychotic paranoia. "He did this even though he admitted that I did not show any of the normal indications of someone suffering from paranoia," Tice said in a statement to the Inspector General.

    Two months later, in June, 2003, the NSA suspended his security clearances and ordered him to tasks such as maintaining the agency's vehicles, pumping gas, and driving officials around. By April 2005, after 14 months of paid leave, Tice was relegated to unloading furniture at the NSA's warehouses and cleaning them.
    [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russ_Tice]Russ Tice - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

    That's your source.

    Furthermore, even he doesn't go as far as your claim. I'm hoping you understand the difference between "some" and "all," as well as the difference between "examine" and "store."

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    This is BS....and another letdown by Obama....proving once again that those of us on the left were absolutely right that Obama is nothing more than a left-leaning moderate. There are somethings that Obama has done that I agree with, there are others that I vehemently disagree with. This is one of them.

    The government should be required to get a warrant before engaging in spying on citizens of this country....period. We require that of the police, why should we not require it of the government?
    Because the police are operating domestically, while this involves foreign affairs. One is entirely the province of Congress and the states, while the other implicates the President's Article II powers.

    Congress and the courts have explicitly acknowledged that the Constitution allows the executive to engage in foreign surveillance without warrants. That's why we have the FISC. The TSP program is merely an extension of that principle, albeit the one that's gotten the most coverage.

    I don't even think that getting a warrant after the fact is good enough....but Bush/Obama apparently don't believe the Constitution requires that.
    And Congress and the courts agree.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Disney went to law school, he should know.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Obama administration: Toss wiretap lawsuit

    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Martel View Post
    You don't need to know that much though to realize one must exonerate Bush and even apologize to him for taking issue with his policy here to begin with. It obviously wasn't a passion coming from the American Left but rather a cheap and disgusting manner in which to attack the President.

    I mean, Bush's numbers suffered because of this specific issue, the Left in Congress actually proceeded with impeachment proceedings, they continued to call the Patriot Act unconstitutional and an interference into basic American rights.

    Now that Obama votes for it as early as July 2008, now that he extends the other Patriot Act policies.....is there even ONE Democrat calling for impeachment? Does this issue affect Obama's poll numbers or policy decisions.....even one iota?

    How can this President continue the same exact policies after he chomped on about hope and change? Where is the American Left's outrage vanished to concerning this issue? Why isn't Obama accused of spying on Americans, why isn't Obama accused of illegal roving wiretaps, why aren't charges attempted against Obama when he accesses company records of private corporations?

    Because...the Left's outrage and selective accusation machine was making all the hay to begin with. This isn't an issue that upsets Americans, if it was, they'd be upset now. They're not. It's just another case of selective outrage shown by traitorous Democrats in the middle of a war. Now that their circus clown is in...trust me...you'll hear no more from Congress about wiretapping nor the entire Patriot Act.
    What can one say to such a brilliant commentary but.....

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