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Thread: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

  1. #131
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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    IGN: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror



    But there's more, Activision confirmed this.

    IGN Advertisement



    Well there it is, I wonder how much "outrage" this is going to produce. There's a scene in Modern Warfare 2 where you play on the terrorists side and shoot up civilians apparently in a very bloody and realistic manner (though I wonder if it could be a realistic as Condemned....that game was creepy real). For me, it's not going to change my purchase. I thought Modern Warfare 1 was a great FPS and I look forward to 2 coming out. It has some cool multiplayer stuff. But I also don't see a big deal with this either. Australia is pissed off over it, but it's just a game. And it is a game centered around fighting terrorists, so whatever. I think any involvement by the government on this front would only be nanny state.

    I do not think the game is that big of a deal. I do not see how this is any different than grand theft auto or any other game where you get to shoot up civilians.How many of us have played that game and positioned the main character on top of a roof building and started shooting everyone on street level or took that character into a mall with a chain gun and shot everyone or just had the character run over people with a car or used the all cars go boom cheat code to blow up all the cars?
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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    No, Infinity Ward is deserving of the criticism they are slowly receiving, but I enjoy the game itself and will play the multiplayer in the future.

    I bought the game last night, and even though I have not finished it, a good friend of mine has. When I saw him doing it, yes, I was disturbed, but thought that well, this probably has some good uses.

    That started changing later on in the game, where both when I saw it with him playing it, and myself playing it, I thought the company missed the mark on many levels.

    It is different from Grand Theft Auto-not in concept, but in execution. For all of the attention gamers place upon textures, physics engines, game music, story line, etc. etc. I find it absolutely fascinating that a good portion of these people seemingly cannot see the differences between the two games. One is certainly more cartoony than the other, the other places a great deal of attention towards a horror scene, everything from people running in terror, to the cops trying to save people's lives-defending them to the death, dragging their loved ones who are bleeding to death, people dragging themselves to safety. If one were to try to shoot the terrorists, even by accident, as I have, I was gunned down far quicker than the sequences where I am shooting at 100 people in that marketplace. Is it so incomprehensible that I can accomplish gunning down a mere 4 people from behind? Is it incomprehensible they do not give us a choice to try to affect the outcome of the situation with the same result occurring in the end?

    It's all there, where as in Grand Theft Auto, it is not. This was a cinematic sequence, and would have been better compared to a film-not a game like Grand Theft Auto. If a film carried this sequence, and it was clearly meant to trigger an emotional response, I would expect them to carry that theme to other portions of the film. If they do not, I criticize the notion that it was art, or I criticize the notion it was art executed skillfully. I have always likened Call of Duty to an interactive film rather than a game due to their rigidity, and thus I approach their choices in the same way.

    Furthermore, the response of the gaming community is downright pathetic. At the moment, there is very little criticism or even acknowledgment of the justification for being offended by the sequence, but rather, either complete relativism or actively engaging in desiring to do more to the civilians.

    The game shows the disturbing sequences of murdering innocent civilians, how an American operative gets blame for the event, and retribution ensues. But we are treated to a more glossed over retribution, where even though it is somewhat dirty and destructive, innocent American citizens are surprisingly missing from the story, whereas in other places of the world, there they are, displayed running away being caught up in the violence (but, needless to say, little attention is set to protecting the civilians from destruction-not really punishing the gamer). American life is disrupted, but no effort is really made to display the virtue of protecting civilian lives with military means. No evacuations gone awry, no American citizens running for their lives while our men try to save them from death. The theme of the innocent civilians is not really carried out in the rest of the game.

    The argument of video games as art has a problem with this game, because while it was designed to give someone an emotional response about the horrors of terrorism, that effort of art was not really carried over into the other portions of the game.

    The argument of "it's just a game" is harder to argue against, for its utter fascination with moral relativism, in which the debater has no real ground to argue against other to say it is horrifying that one could be so relativistic, and thus, to the other side, is an argument filled with sensationalism and of no merit.

    Thus it shall be written that the gaming community will both say that the game is of no concern by virtue of it being a game, and will defend the choice as artistic merit, only to defend the gaming community when it is seen as beneficial. Certainly the video game industry has been unfairly attacked for decades by the masses, but this game and its community are equally demonstrative of the moral depravity of the gaming community. Simply put, Infinity Ward made a bad decision with that sequence, and on various levels I find it hard to defend them on their choice.

    Again, I like the game, I am glad I bought it, but I cannot be a fanboy.
    Last edited by Fiddytree; 11-11-09 at 11:33 PM.
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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    We can stamp on the head of old women and children, cut the throats of randomers in the street, cause massive damage to buildings in games...but a realistic, current-affairs-related game scenario gets so much heat? YEEEEEAH. I mean, as long as it's the other side.
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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    The gaming magazine I order just review it. Said that the terrorist level just felt tacky and intentionally put in to create publicity. They reviewed the console version and gave it a 8.9 score for the single player and the little bit of multiplayer they had time to play and said that the plot in single player makes no real sense. They'll review the multiplayer and PC version more indepth in the next issue and give scores for them then. I'll wait and see what they have to see and look around to see how the multi will work out, not keeping any hopes up for PC though. I keep having this annoying little voice in the back of my head that keeps saying: "Hey, Infinity Ward, 1995 called. It wants its innovation back."
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  5. #135
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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    No, Infinity Ward is deserving of the criticism they are slowly receiving, but I enjoy the game itself and will play the multiplayer in the future.

    I bought the game last night, and even though I have not finished it, a good friend of mine has. When I saw him doing it, yes, I was disturbed, but thought that well, this probably has some good uses.

    That started changing later on in the game, where both when I saw it with him playing it, and myself playing it, I thought the company missed the mark on many levels.

    It is different from Grand Theft Auto-not in concept, but in execution. For all of the attention gamers place upon textures, physics engines, game music, story line, etc. etc. I find it absolutely fascinating that a good portion of these people seemingly cannot see the differences between the two games. One is certainly more cartoony than the other, the other places a great deal of attention towards a horror scene, everything from people running in terror, to the cops trying to save people's lives-defending them to the death, dragging their loved ones who are bleeding to death, people dragging themselves to safety. If one were to try to shoot the terrorists, even by accident, as I have, I was gunned down far quicker than the sequences where I am shooting at 100 people in that marketplace. Is it so incomprehensible that I can accomplish gunning down a mere 4 people from behind? Is it incomprehensible they do not give us a choice to try to affect the outcome of the situation with the same result occurring in the end?

    It's all there, where as in Grand Theft Auto, it is not. This was a cinematic sequence, and would have been better compared to a film-not a game like Grand Theft Auto. If a film carried this sequence, and it was clearly meant to trigger an emotional response, I would expect them to carry that theme to other portions of the film. If they do not, I criticize the notion that it was art, or I criticize the notion it was art executed skillfully. I have always likened Call of Duty to an interactive film rather than a game due to their rigidity, and thus I approach their choices in the same way.

    Furthermore, the response of the gaming community is downright pathetic. At the moment, there is very little criticism or even acknowledgment of the justification for being offended by the sequence, but rather, either complete relativism or actively engaging in desiring to do more to the civilians.

    The game shows the disturbing sequences of murdering innocent civilians, how an American operative gets blame for the event, and retribution ensues. But we are treated to a more glossed over retribution, where even though it is somewhat dirty and destructive, innocent American citizens are surprisingly missing from the story, whereas in other places of the world, there they are, displayed running away being caught up in the violence (but, needless to say, little attention is set to protecting the civilians from destruction-not really punishing the gamer). American life is disrupted, but no effort is really made to display the virtue of protecting civilian lives with military means. No evacuations gone awry, no American citizens running for their lives while our men try to save them from death. The theme of the innocent civilians is not really carried out in the rest of the game.

    The argument of video games as art has a problem with this game, because while it was designed to give someone an emotional response about the horrors of terrorism, that effort of art was not really carried over into the other portions of the game.

    The argument of "it's just a game" is harder to argue against, for its utter fascination with moral relativism, in which the debater has no real ground to argue against other to say it is horrifying that one could be so relativistic, and thus, to the other side, is an argument filled with sensationalism and of no merit.

    Thus it shall be written that the gaming community will both say that the game is of no concern by virtue of it being a game, and will defend the choice as artistic merit, only to defend the gaming community when it is seen as beneficial. Certainly the video game industry has been unfairly attacked for decades by the masses, but this game and its community are equally demonstrative of the moral depravity of the gaming community. Simply put, Infinity Ward made a bad decision with that sequence, and on various levels I find it hard to defend them on their choice.

    Again, I like the game, I am glad I bought it, but I cannot be a fanboy.
    I haven't bought the game. I probably won't. 5 hour single player game isn't worth 60 bucks IMO. I don't know if you can call games an "art form". They definitely rely heavily upon art, but it's an entertainment outlet. As for the terrorism thing, it's just a game. I really don't know what you want. Sure it's realistic, it was meant to be realistic. What sort of moral choices exist in a video game? Other than are you going light side or dark side. I mean, I've played Knights of the Old Republic. I went dark side. I had to make some really mean choices to get some darkside points. Some of them made me feel a little bad. That's the point. But people weren't bitching about video games actively encouraging the worship of the Sith.

    It's always something with people. When Mortal Kombat II came out, it showed blood. And man was there a tizzy. Where were our morals, how could we allow this, blah blah blah. Video games show sex, GTA came under fire a lot for things like this and many games have aspects which allude to sex as well (God of War II had a button matching game associated with it). People got upset, there was too much sex in our violence. Doom caused Columbine, shooters make you violent, blah blah blah. It's all been done before, and all this crap coming out about this one level; it's like bitching about blood in Mortal Kombat II. Sure you can, but you're a raving lunatic for doing so. Realism isn't limited to just this game either. Condemned I and II...horribly realistic. And let me tell you, when you smack someone upside the head with a lead pipe in that game (which oddly you do a lot), it's very realistic in rumble from the controller, to blood splatter on the screen, to the sounds of metal rebounding off bone. Manhunt...that game was BRUTAL. Manhunt 2 was banned in Australia and UK till a more censored version came out. I didn't hear people bitching about it.

    No...all of a sudden, it's terrorists and now we're over the line. Now it's indefensible. Not all the **** before it, but what we have now, that's it; we've crossed a line. Never before in a game where you realistically mowed down innocents or left people to suffer on purpose has there been a game when you were the terrorist doing these acts. I mean, it's one thing to be a dark lord of the Sith doing immoral things. But now it's terrorism and now we're over the line and now we should feel bad about it and now we don't have morals or whatever crap is being thrown out.

    No matter how much bitching occurs, all the made up reasons to think we should be offended by this or that; there's still blood in Mortal Kombat II.
    Last edited by Ikari; 11-12-09 at 12:27 PM.
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  6. #136
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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    There is the merit of the masses for being horrified with terrorist activities more so than other violence (Star Wars included), because it is so vividly familiar in the minds of many. You just have to deal with that, and the company had to deal with that and accept the responsibility for how it chose to approach the issue. Most people do not want to see what we have seen (though they have a higher tolerance once it is purely film rather than interactive media) in this game, and there is good reason for it. We can all say, please do not buy the game or skip the scene, that is certainly a valid argument, and always will be. Nevertheless, Infinity Ward is not free from such criticism.

    The biggest problem I have with it is in consistency. The company takes itself seriously, takes the game seriously, and tries to pawn itself off as giving due respect to the men and women in uniform (even releasing their games on the same day-Veterans Day). Video games become artform when they attach more of a meaning to the product than pure entertainment value. Gamers for one reason or another, have this odd ability to forgo any argument about video game's art when it might make them look bad, but constantly yammer about how it is an artform and how no one can acknowledge it in the mainstream (whether it be an amazing sci-fi plot, thought provoking politics, thought provoking outlook on war, etc etc) when it could stand to benefit them. Once the game is controversial, the message of the game is removed, and the entertainment value promoted. When the game is not controversial, the message of the game and entertainment value are promoted-usually with the dramatic promotion of "and the story line! My god! Breathtaking! This should be a movie! Should be a book!".

    They did not act with the same responsibility they essentially brag about constantly.

    I can deal with crazy, random acts of violence, but what they did was intentional and to me it comes off as falsified pride in their product. I am also fed up with the gaming community for becoming the same knee-jerk assholes they despised.
    Last edited by Fiddytree; 11-12-09 at 05:54 PM.
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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    So a level where you are a Terrorist that has an actual relation to the plot gets all this commotion whereas you could play multiplayer as Germans in WWII killing Allied troops in CoD 2/3, and Russian nationalists in CoD 4 and no one got upset about that? we're really getting worked up over killing fictitious, NPCs in a story?


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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    People did get worked up about that, but not as much. There is also a difference between troops battling troops and men gunning down innocent civilians in an airport.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    People did get worked up about that, but not as much. There is also a difference between troops battling troops and men gunning down innocent civilians in an airport.
    Eh...Sounds like we're holding polygons to a double standard.

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    Re: Modern Warfare 2 Opens with Terror

    Yes, but that is the nature of ideas.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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