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Thread: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    mcchrystal lite is the worst of all options

    either fight to win or bring our boys and girls home

    afghanistan is killing this president, and it's only going to get worse
    Without knowing the overall strategy going forward, it is impossible to say what is the best or worst option.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    In terms of politics, it seems like this is the worst option. Obama and his advisors are smart enough to figure this out. The fact that they know that and are still leaning toward this plan seems to indicate that they think this is the best plan in terms of war strategy, without taking the political issue into consideration. Since they are the ones who are in the best position to make this analysis, I'm confident that it is the best plan.

    I know I shouldn't be surprised when a politician makes a decision based on what they think is right as opposed to what they think will play best in the media, but it's nevertheless pleasant whenever it happens.
    Last edited by RightinNYC; 10-30-09 at 12:51 AM.
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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Without knowing the overall strategy going forward, it is impossible to say what is the best or worst option.
    Without knowing the objective one can't intelligently choose a strategy.

    OBL 11/24/02

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    the general has been mcchrystal clear on what he thinks is winning strategy

    indeed, he said anything short will "likely result in failure"

    mcchrystal's secret assessment, written aug 30 and delivered to the prez, leaked to woodward by unknown insiders and published in the post, sept 21, a day after obama blitzed five sunday talks and indicated he was still awaiting a top-to-bottom review and had not yet received requests for reinforcements:

    McChrystal: More Forces or 'Mission Failure' - washingtonpost.com

    pray for our president, our troops and their people, our nation

    and perhaps, if you are like minded, pray even for our foes, that they will find peace and peace of mind

    they too are fathers and sons and mothers and sisters...

    unfortunately, afghanistan is going to kill this presidency

    cliff
    Last edited by The Prof; 10-30-09 at 01:12 AM.

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad View Post
    Without knowing the objective one can't intelligently choose a strategy.
    This is true. And re-evaluating the objective, and the best way to attain that objective is a strength, not a weakness.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    Quote Originally Posted by goldendog View Post
    Tell me what do you think President Obama should do given the current situation?

    Remember you have to totally remove all issues that have to do with Republicans having any responsibilty for what is going on there today.

    Please offer some suggestions and how they might affect our future?

    It sure does seem to me that you are just chawing at the bit and praying that President Obama will be as big up a **** up as Bush...

    You will have to wait and see before you can make that claim with any validity what so ever.
    Maybe so, maybe no.

    Do you remember Obama standing at the podium at the WH last March with Hillary Clinton at his right hand and Bob Gates at his left hand? The occasion was Obama's announcement of a New Plan for the War in Afghanistan. He said he would escalate the war by sending 17,000 additional troops to Afghanistan. He later added another 3-4,000 troops. Those forces are now in Afghanistan. Obama then fired General Kiernan and replaced him with General McChrystal. Now we're told that the Taliban are winning the war. What happened to Obama's New War Plan?

    There are three policy alternatives on Afghanistan: (1) admitting defeat and completely withdrawing, (2) seeking military victory by giving McChrystal what he asked for, or (3) seeking stalemate by following the McChrystal Lite approach.

    If Obama admits defeat and withdraws American forces completely he will save the lives of countless American men and women, but he will pay an incredible political price for surrender.

    If he gives McChrystal what he wants America might theoretically win, but Americans are not prepared to spend the next decade fighting an insurgency in the Hindu Kush. Besides, Obama doesn't have the political support he needs to win his war. The Left will not support him, so he must rely on the Right for support. In other words he must place his war policy in the hands of his political enemies. How long do you think it will be before the Republicans figure out they have an opportunity to cut Obama's throat?

    If Obama goes for McChrystal Lite the war will go on endlessly, and Obama will be beaten to death the same way Bush was. Bush was destroyed by Iraq, and Obama will be destroyed by Afghanistan.

    No matter which approach Obama selects he is in for the political beating of his life. However, if he chooses to withdraw completely and immediately our children will live. Besides, we can't afford Guns and Butter. If he does withdraw Al Qaeda will reestablish bases in Afghanistan. So what? They have bases in Pakistan now.

    Obama is not the problem. Like Bush, Obama is a symptom of the problem. The problem is the corrupt special interest political system we have created. Destroying Bush and the Republicans was like a nail in the system's coffin. Destroying Obama and the Democrats is a step along the same road.

    You say I will have to wait and see. Don't you tired of playing defense? The Iraq War was used to bring down Bush. The Afghanistan War will be used to bring down Obama.

    I've noticed a certain foreboding and sense of despondency among Obama supporters lately. We destroy our presidents. It's simply the nature of the political order that has evolved in America. It's the way Americans roll. I do have suggestions for a new political order in our country, but that is a subject for another thread.

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    In terms of politics, it seems like this is the worst option. Obama and his advisors are smart enough to figure this out. The fact that they know that and are still leaning toward this plan seems to indicate that they think this is the best plan in terms of war strategy, without taking the political issue into consideration. Since they are the ones who are in the best position to make this analysis, I'm confident that it is the best plan.

    I know I shouldn't be surprised when a politician makes a decision based on what they think is right as opposed to what they think will play best in the media, but it's nevertheless pleasant whenever it happens.
    My gut reaction is that the exact opposite of this is true. By increasing the troop levels, but only doing so to a limited extent, it seems to me like they're trying to appease both sides in a sort of compromise.

    Whether it's a sound strategy or not... we'll have to wait and see. Ditto to its political implications, although I think it is a massive assumption that "Obama and his advisors are smart enough to figure this out".

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    the general has been mcchrystal clear on what he thinks is winning strategy

    indeed, the general said anything short will "likely result in failure"

    mcchrystal's secret assessment, written aug 30 and delivered to the prez, leaked to woodward by unknown insiders and published in the post, sept 21, a day after obama blitzed five sunday talks and indicated he was still awaiting a top-to-bottom review and had not yet received requests for reinforcements:

    McChrystal: More Forces or 'Mission Failure' - washingtonpost.com

    pray for our president, our troops and their people, our nation

    and perhaps, if you are like minded, pray even for our foes, that they will find peace and peace of mind

    they too are fathers and sons and mothers and sisters...

    unfortunately, afghanistan is going to kill this presidency

    cliff
    It's worth remembering that Pres. Obama has access to more information about what's going on than does Gen. McChrystal. If you look at the most recent revelations about Karzai's brother, you can see that the military and the CIA aren't exactly communicating clearly. While McChrystal is certainly aware of what's happening on the military front, Obama has access to all of that information, as well as to covert intelligence via the CIA and political developments via the state department.

    The war power rests solely with the executive, for good reason.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    My gut reaction is that the exact opposite of this is true. By increasing the troop levels, but only doing so to a limited extent, it seems to me like they're trying to appease both sides in a sort of compromise.


    Whether it's a sound strategy or not... we'll have to wait and see. Ditto to its political implications, although I think it is a massive assumption that "Obama and his advisors are smart enough to figure this out".
    This is of course possible, though I think a troop increase of 25k will tend to evoke enough outrage from both sides as to render it a bad political decision. Whatever you think about Obama's position on various issues, you can't deny that he is surrounded by an incredibly astute crew of political advisors.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    We've been down this path before. In my nightmares I see Gen. McWestmoreland demanding more troops and insisting that anything less than what he demands is tantamount to surrender. So the President will send X-thousand more fine young men and Gen. McWestmoreland will announce that, "There is light at the end of the tunnel"--and that we can WIN (whatever that looks like) if the President will only send a few thousand MORE troops. Then as the number of planes required to airlift the bodies back to Dover AFB is doubled, Gen. McWestmoreland will gravely tell us, "We have turned the corner in Afghanistan." Brilliant officer that he is, he will never realize that the corner we turned takes us the wrong way down a one way street.

    It's always the same dream, Doc, and I wake up with cold sweats. Can you help me?

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    Re: Obama Reportedly Eyeing "McChrystal Lite"

    i don't know how much more a community organizer from chicago and the ivoried halls of harvard law with very little mind for martial matters might know about the military realities in the mountains on the moon than the careerist soldier who's reached the ranks mcchrystal has

    but, that aside, if this "decision" by the president looks anything other than purely political instead of security interested to you...

    well...

    it just doesn't ring true to character, to me

    not the obama i've come to know

    gates has also expressed mcchrystal's selfsame frustrations

    and obama, who endorsed the general in march, is now pointing to karzai's corrupt election as some kind of game changer

    as if the president just learned something on aug 20, three days after calling out his "war of necessity," which we weren't all fully aware of all along

    again, obama's rationalizations echo hollow, to me

    either way, afghanistan is his war now, all obama's problem

    which ever path he opts for had better work

    politics is almost as unforgiving as war

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