Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 44

Thread: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

  1. #11
    Dispenser of Negativity
    Cold Highway's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Newburgh, New York and World 8: Dark Land
    Last Seen
    12-24-12 @ 11:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    9,596
    Blog Entries
    7

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    Hate crimes do more harm than good.
    Jackboots always come in matched pairs, a left boot and a right boot.

  2. #12
    Liberal Fascist For Life!


    Redress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:53 AM
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    93,328
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    You're a pro-homosexual bigot, are you not?
    Yes, but I am not trying to set up homosexuals as a privileged class. Further, my opposition is to hate crime laws, not gay rights.

    And the "pro-homosexual bigot" line is something I was called that I stole since it amuses me.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  3. #13
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Last Seen
    12-26-10 @ 06:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    8,083

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    It does not do this though, at least not to my mind. Assault is a crime, and if that crime is ignored, it will still be ignored. Thankfully, I don't think that is much of a problem these days.
    Hate crime laws mostly ensure a standard sentence. If a person is found guilty of an assault against a homosexual, then the hate crime law ensures that a minimum sentence is carried out. Judicial rulings can sometimes be biased in favor of the criminal in conservative areas where the jury, DA, or even the judge can be homophobic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    While most cops might be conservative, most cops are cops first.
    That has not been my experience with police officers anywhere. Gays can be targets for harassment by the police, and when they go to the police to report crimes they are sometimes ignored or even ridiculed as having deserved it. I thankfully have not experienced this but I have friends who have... and that's in Toronto or Vancouver, both of which are considered far more liberal than most American places.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Assault and murder are still crimes, no matter who the victim, and this is what I think most cops think about, the crime.
    If the person is found innocent then it won't matter who they allegedly attacked. If they are found guilty and the victim is a homosexual, then the hate crime law ensures that the justice system can't minimize the sentence out of homophobia.

    I think for now this kind of law is needed while society transitions into accepting homosexuality. Eventually the laws should be struck down. And no, society does not accept homosexuals universally. I won't even cater to that perception. Even as a white collar professional, I still can't go into a random bar with my boyfriend without getting attitude from people.

    The justice system is even further behind the public attitude as the majority of its roles are still filled by people from the baby boomer era.

  4. #14
    King Of The Dog Pound
    Black Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    South Florida
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    34,516

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Congress extends hate crime protections to gays - Yahoo! News

    I was surprised to not see a post on this yet. It is an easy target, and for good reason. First, hate crime laws should go away, not be expanded...and as any one who knows my posts knows I am well in favor of gay rights, but this is just wrong.

    Further, to add this to a defense spending bill is the kind of things we as democrats should oppose. It is and was wrong when republicans did it, it is wrong when we do it. If you can't pass a bill, you can't pass it. Using workarounds to get something through is just wrong.
    You are one smart woman for a liberal. Are you sure you are not more of an independent with a lean to the right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  5. #15
    Liberal Fascist For Life!


    Redress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:53 AM
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    93,328
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    You are one smart woman for a liberal. Are you sure you are not more of an independent with a lean to the right?
    Nah, I am fairly far to the left actually, and you would be surprised at how many of us have the same basic ideas. "The left" represents a really broad collection of political ideas, which is why those who refer to liberals with blanket statements are almost always far too simplistic in their portrayals...but that is a topic for another thread.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  6. #16
    Girthless
    RightinNYC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    New York, NY
    Last Seen
    01-23-11 @ 11:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    25,894

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    This is a bad idea, for the reasons we discussed the last time this came up:

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    The concept of "hate crime" is idiotic and unworkable. The underlying problem is that they can be applied to almost anything. Check out this article for an example:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/03/ny...No&oref=slogin

    The perpetrators here used a gay chatroom to find their victim not because they had any specific animus toward gays, but because they thought he would be easier to overpower. Despite the fact that there was no evidence of “hate,” they were convicted under a hate crime law.

    Under the recent "hate crime" laws passed by the House, if a hoodlum chose to rob a woman because he believed she would be easier to overpower than a man, he has committed a “hate crime.” If he chose to attack a man on crutches because he couldn’t chase after him, he has committed a “hate crime.”

    Nobody is saying that these acts aren’t immoral and illegal, but they are already criminalized under our existing statutes. The addition of “hate crime” laws merely serve to give prosecutors additional leverage to hold over the head of criminal defendants and to make civil rights advocates feel as if they've won a battle.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    Hate crime laws mostly ensure a standard sentence. If a person is found guilty of an assault against a homosexual, then the hate crime law ensures that a minimum sentence is carried out. Judicial rulings can sometimes be biased in favor of the criminal in conservative areas where the jury, DA, or even the judge can be homophobic.
    The existence of the law does not force the prosecutor to bring the charge, nor does it force the jury to convict. The only way it could possibly have the effect you're seeking is if the judge is a terrible bigot and the hate crime law imposes a mandatory minimum higher than the judge would otherwise have imposed. Due to the vast authority sentencing judges have and the fact that this would only apply in federal courts, this is an absolute non-issue. These are federal judges - not some backwoods town justice in Alabama.

    That has not been my experience with police officers anywhere. Gays can be targets for harassment by the police, and when they go to the police to report crimes they are sometimes ignored or even ridiculed as having deserved it. I thankfully have not experienced this but I have friends who have... and that's in Toronto or Vancouver, both of which are considered far more liberal than most American places.
    The police officers have absolutely no involvement in deciding whether or not to bring the charges, so whether they're bigoted or not has no impact on the eventual outcome of the case.

    If the person is found innocent then it won't matter who they allegedly attacked.
    Except the fact that this comes with heaver penalties may induce otherwise innocent people (innocent of the hate crime, at least) to plea to a lesser charge.

    If they are found guilty and the victim is a homosexual, then the hate crime law ensures that the justice system can't minimize the sentence out of homophobia.
    And again, this is absolutely not an issue with federal judges to the degree that we need a wholesale revision of the laws and a significant increase in prosecutorial power.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

  7. #17
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Last Seen
    08-29-17 @ 09:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    16,575

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    First, hate crime laws should go away, not be expanded...and as any one who knows my posts knows I am well in favor of gay rights, but this is just wrong.
    I agree hate crime laws should go away, but as long as they are here adding gays to the list was a natural progression.

  8. #18
    free market communist
    Gardener's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Last Seen
    09-30-17 @ 12:27 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    26,661

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Using workarounds to get something through is just wrong.
    I had to read this three times before I realized you said WORKarounds.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

  9. #19
    Professor
    Phoenix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    South Carolina
    Last Seen
    04-27-17 @ 10:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    1,782

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    White man kills a White man .......... Was it Love?
    From the ashes.

  10. #20
    Bus Driver to Hell
    Thorgasm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:57 PM
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    68,198

    Re: Congress extends hate crime protections to gays

    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix View Post
    White man kills a White man .......... Was it Love?
    Exactly....

    A crime is a crime.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •