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Thread: Ahmadinejad vows to avenge bombing [EDIT]

  1. #11
    DEATH TO ANTARCTICA!!!
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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    As you probably read in the other thread Jundallah is responsible. They have a history of attacking civillian targets such as mosques an many of their members have Interpol warrants on them. It would seam "terroist" is quite accurate
    First of all, nobody knows which organization is behind the attack as for present time, do not jump into conclusions.
    Secondly, I was speaking about the act itself and not the organization behind it being a terror organization or not, the act of attacking military targets is called 'Guerrilla Warfare', do you disagree with that claim?
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

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  2. #12
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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Voldemort View Post
    It did say there were 26 other casualties, but obviously that doesn't necessarily mean civilians.
    Indeed, which is why I stated that the reports are not that clear about it.
    They say it happened near the Pakistani border or something, so the first assumption would be that only soldiers were involved, but you can never know.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
    ...Since the U.S. has previously been governed by a political regime responsible for the effective destruction of democracy in Iran through support for the 1953 coup d'etat and support of the dictatorial monarch that was granted effectively undisputed power after this event, it's not surprising that suspicion would be aimed in that direction either.
    You just like to lie all over this forum, don't you?

    Mossadegh had disbanded parliament, and stated his intent to align himself with the USSR against his public's wishes. Yeah, he was a real democrat.

    Just like hamas; you get to vote - but just once.

    But anyway, just like at the other forums, you keep lying to everyone, and I'll keep correcting your nonsense.

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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by rogerredy View Post
    You just like to lie all over this forum, don't you?

    Mossadegh had disbanded parliament, and stated his intent to align himself with the USSR against his public's wishes. Yeah, he was a real democrat.

    Just like hamas; you get to vote - but just once.

    But anyway, just like at the other forums, you keep lying to everyone, and I'll keep correcting your nonsense.
    Actually, I don't recall having had the pleasure of interaction with your illustrious personage before. Aside from the fact that he was a democratic socialist who opposed state capitalism, Mossadeq was an ardent anti-interventionist and was ultimately opposed to the prospect of excessive Soviet influence in the country to the same extent that he was opposed to the prospect of excessive Western influence in the country; it thus seems likely that any sort of temporary alliance he sought with one would be to confront what he regarded as the excessive power of the other at the time. As for the motivation behind his removal, interest in halting Soviet intrusion did indeed exist, but so do declassified CIA documents that indicate that warnings of Soviet intrusions supported by Iran's pro-Soviet Tudah were largely inaccurate and functioned as a smokescreen, as later admitted by Dean Acheson.

    1952 CIA coup in Iran, by ERVAND ABRAHAMIAN

    Throughout the crisis, the “communist danger” was more of a rhetorical device than a real issue — i.e., it was part of the cold-war discourse. The British and American governments knew Mossadeq was as distrustful of the Soviet Union as of the West. In fact, they often complained to each other about his “neutralism.” They knew perfectly well that the so-called “fellow-travelers” were staunch nationalists (after the coup some of them obtained refuge in the United States). They also knew that the Tudeh, even though the largest political organization, was in no position to seize power (F0 371/Persia 1952/ 98597; FO 371/Persia 1953/104573; Declassified Documents/1981/CIA/ Doc 276). Despite 20,000 members and 110,000 sympathizers, the Tudeh was no match for the armed tribes and the 129,000-man military. What is more, the British and Americans had enough inside information to be confident that the party had no plans to initiate armed insurrection. At the beginning of the crisis when the Truman administration was under the impression a compromise was possible, Acheson had stressed the communist danger and warned if Mossadeq was not helped the Tudeh would take over (FO 371/Persia 1051/1530). The Foreign Office had retorted that the Tudeh was no real threat (FO 371/ Persia 1952/98608). But, in August 1953, when the Foreign Office echoed the Eisenhower administration’s claim that the Tudeh was about to take over, Acheson now retorted that there was no such communist danger (Roosevelt, 1979, 88). Acheson was honest enough to admit that the issue of the Tudeh was a smokescreen.
    I would recommend adopting a somewhat more skeptical perspective of this matter, since merely assuming that the U.S. had some benevolent interest in preventing Soviet intrusion in the region is superficially and unduly optimistic, especially considering Mossadeq's hostility toward all varieties of foreign intervention.

    Now, as to the alleged suppression of democracy and seizure of power on Mossadeq's own part, his emergency powers were granted by parliamentary decree, and were not seized or forcefully taken, as your summary succinctly insinuates. Moreover, his powers were often utilized to check monarchical power of dubious constitutionality, and their expansion was certainly far more democratic than the monarchical authorities. Moreover, the Shah did indeed cede some measure of control over the military to Mossadeq in response to protests, so perhaps the "strength" of your arguments would be better applied to Pahlavi, if you believe that transferring power from a monarch to a democratically elected prime minister has the consequence of "dismantling democracy," as some claim and you imply.

    So we need to conclude by acknowledging the reality that the coup is depicted in Iran as a primary example of previous Western meddling in Iranian affairs, and as not only an offense against the relatively secular Mossadeq, but also the highly influential Ayatollah Kashani (despite the latter's conflict with Mossadeq shortly before the coup occurred). It's simply regarded as an offense against every element of legitimate political and religious authority in Iran by meddlesome Western powers.

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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    First of all, nobody knows which organization is behind the attack as for present time, do not jump into conclusions.
    Secondly, I was speaking about the act itself and not the organization behind it being a terror organization or not, the act of attacking military targets is called 'Guerrilla Warfare', do you disagree with that claim?
    fair enough

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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    I fail to realize how a "Terrorist strike" would be considered to be "wonderful news". The idea that something like that should make people joyous reguardless of where it happends it quite twisted.
    Is this where we want to go?

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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
    There's certainly closer relations between U.S. ruling administrations and Jundallah than between U.S. ruling administrations and Mujahideen-e Khalq, so that may in fact increase the probability of CIA involvement. Since the U.S. has previously been governed by a political regime responsible for the effective destruction of democracy in Iran through support for the 1953 coup d'etat and support of the dictatorial monarch that was granted effectively undisputed power after this event, it's not surprising that suspicion would be aimed in that direction either.
    GMAB !!!Are going to be blamed for the 1953 actions of the British forever ?
    “I do not recall the Viet Cong asking me if I was a natural born or Naturalized American before they shot at me, they just shot at all of us “ f107HyperSabr

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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by F107HyperSabr View Post
    GMAB !!!Are going to be blamed for the 1953 actions of the British forever ?
    The CIA support for the action indicated approval by the ruling administration of the time. Whether it's reasonable to suspect the present administration of the same aspirations is debatable, but it's certainly not entirely absurd for suspicion to exist, particularly in Iran.

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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by goldendog View Post
    I fail to realize how a "Terrorist strike" would be considered to be "wonderful news". The idea that something like that should make people joyous reguardless of where it happends it quite twisted.
    Is this where we want to go?
    The way that I see it is that it is that the opposition used terrorism against the government of Iran who are terrorist. That's lie score in my book !!
    “I do not recall the Viet Cong asking me if I was a natural born or Naturalized American before they shot at me, they just shot at all of us “ f107HyperSabr

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    Re: Wonderful news - Terrorists strike iran

    Quote Originally Posted by F107HyperSabr View Post
    The way that I see it is that it is that the opposition used terrorism against the government of Iran who are terrorist. That's lie score in my book !!
    So what's stopping titles like...

    "Wonderful news - terrorists strike Israel.

    "Wonderful news - terrorists strike the United States.

    "Wonderful news - terrorists strike Great Britian.

    Such a title that takes glee in such an act is out of line.
    Who taught people in this country to conduct themselves in such spiteful ways?

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