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Thread: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    I hope the US is involved, as it would mean Obama is serious about regime change. Between terrorist attacks on Republican Guard commanders and Qom clerics opposing the Ayatollah, things may continue to deteriorate for the government of Iran.
    I would have hoped that the U.S govt is sensibile enough not to have been involved . By supporting an openly sectarian organisation that kills shia civillians they would merely be helping to bolster the regimes legitimacy among the Shia. Even from a self interested perspective it would have been a stupid thing to do. Detoriating secuirity situations work brilliantly for authortarian regimes. Look at Stalin.
    Last edited by Red_Dave; 10-18-09 at 07:20 PM.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
    I would recommend adopting a somewhat more skeptical perspective of this matter, since merely assuming that the U.S. administration of the time had some benevolent interest in preventing Soviet intrusion in the region is superficially and unduly optimistic, especially considering Mossadeq's hostility toward all varieties of foreign intervention.

    But I wouldn't use a possessive pronoun to refer to the actions of a political administration that most Americans are genuinely unaware of, as that would imply some degree of culpability for the consequences of that anti-democratic action to people who don't deserve it.
    I never said benevolent interest. But given the times, "Mossadeq's hostility toward all varieties of foreign intervention" was reason enough to replace the regime with our own. We ended up with a compliant regime in our interests for a time.

    Which possessive pronoun? Could you gimme the sentence and highlight the word. I am thinking it is the work "our", but I am not sure. I disagree that it implues culpability, merely that I identify with our government, for good and bad. Hell, I wasn't even born then.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    I would have hoped that the U.S govt is sensibile enough not to have been involved . By supporting an openly sectarian organisation that kills shia civillians they would merely be helping to bolster the regimes legitimacy among the Shia. Even from a self interested perspective it would have been a stupid thing to do. Detoriating secuirity situations work brilliantly for authortarian regimes. Look at Stalin.
    I don't think they were involved, but you never know. But, "Detoriating secuirity situations work brilliantly for authortarian regimes" also work well for pro-democracy forces. The more the government cracks down, the more people will be willing to take action against them.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    I never said benevolent interest. But given the times, "Mossadeq's hostility toward all varieties of foreign intervention" was reason enough to replace the regime with our own. We ended up with a compliant regime in our interests for a time.
    If there's a central problem with your posts, it seems to be a lack of awareness that persons other than Anglo-Saxon U.S. citizens are capable of happiness and suffering.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    I don't think they were involved, but you never know. But, "Detoriating secuirity situations work brilliantly for authortarian regimes" also work well for pro-democracy forces. The more the government cracks down, the more people will be willing to take action against them.
    Yes but obviously the shia are the majority here. If the government cracks down on people who have a habbit of trying to kill shia civillians they are likely to be more sympathetic.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
    If there's a central problem with your posts, it seems to be a lack of awareness that persons other than Anglo-Saxon U.S. citizens are capable of happiness and suffering.
    In you are going to call me a racist, you should get that into the open instead of being oblique. I'm not.

    What in this post:
    I never said benevolent interest. But given the times, "Mossadeq's hostility toward all varieties of foreign intervention" was reason enough to replace the regime with our own. We ended up with a compliant regime in our interests for a time.
    has anything to do with Anglo-Saxons?

    That others are also interested in happiness and have an aversion to suffering is secondary to the needs of my country. I'm delighted when they are congruent.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    Yes but obviously the shia are the majority here. If the government cracks down on people who have a habbit of trying to kill shia civillians they are likely to be more sympathetic.
    It's a conplex situation. The government is also cracking down on Shia.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    So, what? What's your point as it applies to now?
    My point is that we have a very bad track record when it comes to meddling in the affairs of other nations -- bad meaning that, while we may have had good intentions, our actions caused unintended consequences that end up biting us on the as for decades to come.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    In you are going to call me a racist, you should get that into the open instead of being oblique. I'm not.
    Anglo-Saxons aren't a race, so I fail to see how that one would go anywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    What in this post:

    has anything to do with Anglo-Saxons?
    I don't believe I made any specific reference to your posts in this thread so much as your posts on the board in general.

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    That others are also interested in happiness and have an aversion to suffering is secondary to the needs of my country. I'm delighted when they are congruent.
    There's no ethical basis for such jingoism and substantially more suffering caused by jingoistic initiatives than would occur should non-nationalistic perspectives and goals have been considered.

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    Re: Top Revolutionary Guard commanders assassinated

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    My point is that we have a very bad track record when it comes to meddling in the affairs of other nations -- bad meaning that, while we may have had good intentions, our actions caused unintended consequences that end up biting us on the as for decades to come.
    America's enemies love to use that argument to try to prevent us from doing anything overseas at all.

    OBL 11/24/02

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