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Obama reaffirms will end "Don't ask Don't tell"

Heya, reefe, nice to meetcha and welcome to DP! :2wave:

I don't remember the answer for your first question, but if you ask down in the 'Come in and say Hi' forum, or the 'Feedback/Suggestions' forum someone will come along and help you.

As to your second question, you can check in your User CP, or the newest post list down at the bottom, but I like to look in the 'Today's Posts' link in the 'Quick Links' dropdown menu below and to the left of your name in the upper right corner.

Hi Jackalope,

Thanks for your reply. I said hello in the 'Come in and say Hi' forum and asked my questions. I since found out how to turn off those annoying emails (in 'Edit Options') and so I now that's good.

I see know that a reply auto-subscribes me and the User CP shows Subscribed Threads with new posts. Learning my way around.

Thanks!
 
Just because someone can say hey I'm gay it is foolish?

What if some straight soldier collected barbi dolls?

Straight soldiers don't walk into the barracks and yell, "I'm straight!". Is this about giving gay soldiers the same rights, or just shoving a PC agenda down people's throats? It would sound better if the latter didn't appear to be true.
 
And, if they were all male, or all female, they would be even better.

Speculation that I disagree with.


It's the military's job to protect this country, not change the culture. The military is no place for a social experiment. You're probably right, it won't have a negative effect, but I don't think it's worth it, if you're wrong.

The culture in the country has changed, it's time for the military to catch up. It is no experiment, it has happened. When I went to high school, there where zero openly gay people, now the same high school has a fair number.
 
Straight soldiers don't walk into the barracks and yell, "I'm straight!". Is this about giving gay soldiers the same rights, or just shoving a PC agenda down people's throats? It would sound better if the latter didn't appear to be true.

According to the research I posted a link to, looking at the experiences of military personnel in countries that allow openly gay people to serve, most gays are still not open about it, and those that are are mostly pretty circumspect about the whole thing.
 
Speculation that I disagree with.

It's not speculation. History has proven it to be so. Some of the toughest units in the Soviet Army during WW2, were all female units.




The culture in the country has changed, it's time for the military to catch up. It is no experiment, it has happened. When I went to high school, there where zero openly gay people, now the same high school has a fair number.

This ain't high school. This is the armed forces. If you're wrong, people can die. It's not worth it just to push some Libbos wet dream of straight soldiers being forced to accept gay soldiers living in their barracks, because that's what it's really all about.
 
It's not speculation. History has proven it to be so. Some of the toughest units in the Soviet Army during WW2, were all female units.

Certain units may be better, but overall, I doubt it will make a difference.



This ain't high school. This is the armed forces. If you're wrong, people can die. It's not worth it just to push some Libbos wet dream of straight soldiers being forced to accept gay soldiers living in their barracks, because that's what it's really all about.

Gay soldiers already are living in the barracks, and for the most part, it is working out just fine.
 
Certain units may be better, but overall, I doubt it will make a difference.

History tells a different story.





Gay soldiers already are living in the barracks, and for the most part, it is working out just fine.

Great, then let's leave DADT in place. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
 
Straight soldiers don't walk into the barracks and yell, "I'm straight!". Is this about giving gay soldiers the same rights, or just shoving a PC agenda down people's throats? It would sound better if the latter didn't appear to be true.

It is about equal rights. Gays whom do make valuable contributions to the armed services have an extra rule tacxked on them simply for being gay even if they follow all the other rules. There is no reason for this extra rule.
 
It is about equal rights. Gays whom do make valuable contributions to the armed services have an extra rule tacxked on them simply for being gay even if they follow all the other rules. There is no reason for this extra rule.

The same rule applies to straight soldiers.
 
More data: http://www.urban.org/UploadedPDF/411069_GayLesbianMilitary.pdf

Estimates suggest that more than 36,000 gay men and lesbians are serving in active duty,
representing 2.5 percent of active duty personnel. When the guard and reserve are
included, nearly 65,000 men and women in uniform are likely gay or lesbian, accounting
for 2.8 percent of military personnel.

Nearly one million gay and lesbian Americans are veterans. The states with the largest
population of gay and lesbian veterans include California, Florida, Texas, New
York, and Georgia. Among metropolitan areas, Los Angeles, Washington, DC, San
Diego, Chicago, and New York have the highest populations of gay and lesbian
veterans.
 
I've seen it enforced.

Some one charged strictly under sodomy rules, or as part of a prosecution of some greater case? I have never heard of a strait soldier charged with just sodomy, it always was added to other charges.
 
Great, then let's leave DADT in place. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

It is broke. We have lost valuable human resources simply because people were found out to be gay even though they followed all the rules straight people are expected to follow.
 
It is broke. We have lost valuable human resources simply because people were found out to be gay even though they followed all the rules straight people are expected to follow.

Policy on gays seen hurting military - The Boston Globe

New military statistics show that many soldiers with the same skills as former service members the Pentagon is now recalling to active duty in the war on terror have been discharged from the military over the last five years under the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy that prohibits gays from serving openly.

The military data show that in some areas where there are critical shortfalls, such as intelligence, military police, and infantry skills, the Clinton-era policy that allows the dismissal of gays whose sexual orientation is disclosed has deprived the military of some of the same skills it is now seeking by returning members of the Individual Ready Reserve to service.
 
Some one charged strictly under sodomy rules, or as part of a prosecution of some greater case? I have never heard of a strait soldier charged with just sodomy, it always was added to other charges.

DADT doesn't have anything to do with sodomy. It is what it says, "Don't ask, don't tell". As an NCO, I've enforced DADT, when straight soldiers advertised their sexual preferrence.

As far as straight soldiers being charged with sodomy, I've heard of that several times. A female captain at Fort Carson was convicted of sodomy when she got busted giving her husband a hummer in the PX parking lot. A soldier in my battalion got slapped with sodomy when he ****ed his daughter in that ass.
 
It is broke. We have lost valuable human resources simply because people were found out to be gay even though they followed all the rules straight people are expected to follow.

It's only broke, because some folks aren't able to play the game.
 
DADT doesn't have anything to do with sodomy. It is what it says, "Don't ask, don't tell". As an NCO, I've enforced DADT, when straight soldiers advertised their sexual preferrence.

As far as straight soldiers being charged with sodomy, I've heard of that several times. A female captain at Fort Carson was convicted of sodomy when she got busted giving her husband a hummer in the PX parking lot. A soldier in my battalion got slapped with sodomy when he ****ed his daughter in that ass.

And you charged them under what? What was the charge?

Did that last soldier you mention accidentally fall down any stairs, or is it a kinder gentler military now than when I was in, when he certainly would have fallen down stairs, probably repeatedly.
 
And you charged them under what? What was the charge?

Sodomy. What did I just say?

Did that last soldier you mention accidentally fall down any stairs, or is it a kinder gentler military now than when I was in, when he certainly would have fallen down stairs, probably repeatedly.

That last soldier died in the Mannhiem Stockade. He never returned to the his unit. They knew better than to do that.
 
It's the military's job to protect this country, not change the culture. The military is no place for a social experiment. You're probably right, it won't have a negative effect, but I don't think it's worth it, if you're wrong.

Ok, I really disagree with you here. The Army is the perfect place to conduct a social change. Success, and it will be a success, will change the attitudes of many who will go back home and help influence the attitudes of others who were not enlisted. As Redress (I think?) pointed out, the integration of black and white soldiers was a social change that the Army led. It was completely successful, as I am sure you are aware - you have leaders rise from the ranks of all races. The same would be true of gays. Getting the job done has always dominated the culture of respect in the Army.

Now, I am not saying there won't be negative effects. One of the most critical will be NCOs who aren't ready to accept the change. But in the end it will be successful. I have full faith.
 
DADT doesn't have anything to do with sodomy. It is what it says, "Don't ask, don't tell". As an NCO, I've enforced DADT, when straight soldiers advertised their sexual preferrence.

Oh I have to call BS on this. A straight person can not be discharged for simply saying I'm straight a gay soldier can be discharged for simply saying I'm gay. There must be more to your story.
 
Ok, I really disagree with you here. The Army is the perfect place to conduct a social change. Success, and it will be a success, will change the attitudes of many who will go back home and help influence the attitudes of others who were not enlisted. As Redress (I think?) pointed out, the integration of black and white soldiers was a social change that the Army led. It was completely successful, as I am sure you are aware - you have leaders rise from the ranks of all races. The same would be true of gays. Getting the job done has always dominated the culture of respect in the Army.

Now, I am not saying there won't be negative effects. One of the most critical will be NCOs who aren't ready to accept the change. But in the end it will be successful. I have full faith.


No matter how many soldiers die because of it? Sorry, but I don't agree that it's worth it.
 
Oh I have to call BS on this. A straight person can not be discharged for simply saying I'm straight a gay soldier can be discharged for simply saying I'm gay. There must be more to your story.

Not exactly, but if a straight soldier goes around telling female soldiers that he's straight, not only can he be charged with violating DADT, but he can be charged with sexual harrassment, which could lead to a charge of conduct unbecoming, which would result in being dishonorably discharged. Failure to adjust to military life, what-have-you.
 
No matter how many soldiers die because of it? Sorry, but I don't agree that it's worth it.

Well, once again the integration of black and white soldiers resulted in murder, often of the black soldier. Still the Army got through it and now we are truly integrated and have been for decades.
 
Not exactly, but if a straight soldier goes around telling female soldiers that he's straight, not only can he be charged with violating DADT, but he can be charged with sexual harrassment, which could lead to a charge of conduct unbecoming, which would result in being dishonorably discharged. Failure to adjust to military life, what-have-you.

What!? Surely it takes more than that?
 
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