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Thread: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    Quote Originally Posted by Mira View Post
    By the way, there are also many Armenians who have Sabourjian as their last name. Almost all Armenian names end with "ian" or "yan" .
    Not in Iran.
    Ahmadinejad is most likely to indeed be a Jew who has converted to Islam.
    It explains quite a lot about him and his actions.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Not in Iran.
    Ahmadinejad is most likely to indeed be a Jew who has converted to Islam.
    It explains quite a lot about him and his actions.
    I'm reminded of how so many men who bash gay people turn out to be repressed homosexuals.
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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    Quote Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
    That's probably not a sufficient basis to claim anything in the absence of other more serious offenses, since there are history skeptics who challenge the veracity of recording mechanisms of various previous events, for example. While I've never seen any evidence that he falls into this camp, I have seen evidence that his "holocaust denial" is in fact opposition to that legacy's exploitation by Israeli officials to justify their present activity, or at least, his perception that such exploitation occurs.
    The holocaust is an historic event that is well-documented and has billions of evidence pieces to support it.
    History skeptics, or better, history revisionists, are historians who seek to question controversial history pieces.
    Since Ahmadinejad is not questioning the holocaust, but obviously denies it, and since the holocaust is indeed a fact, those who question the holocaust do not partake in history revisionism, and those who deny the holocaust are denying that the world is round and are quite likely to have an agenda, an anti-semite agenda.

    Furthermore, Ahmadinejad's denial of the holocaust is not where this ends, he has also a rich past of claiming that the Jewish people rule the world, a claim only used before by the Nazis of Nazi Germany, and a claim that tends to come from a deep mentality of anti-semitism.
    No, I don't think so, especially since his noted opposition to governmental policy has often been seized upon for his detractors to attempt to supplement their claims of his Jew-hatred.
    And you are entitled to your own opinion.
    I do believe however that Ahmadinejad is probably the most anti-Jewish state leader in the modern world, and is conversion from Judaism to Islam while never talking about his past proves quite a lot.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Since Ahmadinejad is not questioning the holocaust, but obviously denies it, and since the holocaust is indeed a fact, those who question the holocaust do not partake in history revisionism, and those who deny the holocaust are denying that the world is round and are quite likely to have an agenda, an anti-semite agenda.
    That's quite incorrect, and is in fact based on what have proven to be disingenuous allegations. We have in our sights a political figure who dislikes what he perceives as the exploitation of the holocaust by Israeli governmental figures to justify their present actions, and at best, is anti-Jewish only to the extent that Jews are a stereotyped target of his preconceived dislike of Israeli actions, as we know some regard world Jewry as synonymous with Israeli political regimes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Furthermore, Ahmadinejad's denial of the holocaust is not where this ends, he has also a rich past of claiming that the Jewish people rule the world, a claim only used before by the Nazis of Nazi Germany, and a claim that tends to come from a deep mentality of anti-semitism.
    There's no basis for such a figure to comment, "We love everyone in the world - Jews, Christians, Muslims, non-Muslims, non-Jews, non-Christians... We are against occupation, aggression, killings and displacing people - otherwise we have no problem with ordinary people." If you'd been exposed to any legitimate Jew hatred, you'd know that such a person would not permit his ideological sentiments to be diluted to such a degree as to publicly claim to "love" Jews.

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    And you are entitled to your own opinion.
    I do believe however that Ahmadinejad is probably the most anti-Jewish state leader in the modern world, and is conversion from Judaism to Islam while never talking about his past proves quite a lot.
    The most anti-Jewish state leaders in the world are among those who conduct unwarranted aggression against others while claiming to represent world Jewry, inviting increased discrimination and hostility toward that group even though the majority have little to no involvement with the political regime responsible for such deeds. This is almost the equivalent of a false-flag operation.

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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    Quote Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
    I can't say that I've ever heard him make such attacks...
    Holocaust denial is an attack on the Jewish people. To deny the magnitude of that historic genocide is to deny the harm that genocide inflicted on the Jewish people. The evidence for the Holocaust is irrefutable.

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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    Holocaust denial is an attack on the Jewish people. To deny the magnitude of that historic genocide is to deny the harm that genocide inflicted on the Jewish people. The evidence for the Holocaust is irrefutable.
    As I noted, there are history skeptics who challenge the legitimacy of every variety of historical record, to say nothing of the fact that mere Holocaust denial has no necessary connection with the advocacy of discriminatory public policy against the Jewish people (though a correlation of course usually exists), but the most relevant fact is that allegations of his "Holocaust denial" appear to be absurdly overstated.

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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    As a point of fact, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has termed the Holocaust a "lie." His argument is not that Israel is exploiting the Holocaust to further its interests. His claim is that the Holocaust itself is a lie. That is Holocaust denial.

    From the September 18, 2009 report by Reuters:

    "The pretext (Holocaust) for the creation of the Zionist regime (Israel) is false ... It is a lie based on an unprovable and mythical claim," he told worshippers at Tehran University at the end of an annual anti-Israel "Qods (Jerusalem) Day" rally."

    Claiming that the Holocaust "is a lie based on an unprovable and mythical claim" is Holocaust denial.

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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    Holocaust denial is an attack on the Jewish people. .
    As so is the sophistry of those who whip up a wordy merrengue of obfuscating bull pucky that attempts to deny the intent of the Holocaust deniers.
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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    Quote Originally Posted by Agnapostate View Post
    That's quite incorrect, and is in fact based on what have proven to be disingenuous allegations.
    When one brings the word 'proven' into debate, he is also required to bring the source that proves the claim.
    We have in our sights a political figure who dislikes what he perceives as the exploitation of the holocaust by Israeli governmental figures to justify their present actions, and at best, is anti-Jewish only to the extent that Jews are a stereotyped target of his preconceived dislike of Israeli actions, as we know some regard world Jewry as synonymous with Israeli political regimes.
    Very wrong.
    If Ahmadinejad had mere issues with the holocaust's result in the world's relationship with the Jewish people, he wouldn't choose to deny the holocaust itself.
    Furthermore, even if his issue is simply with the result of the holocaust on the relationships between the world and the Jewish people, it implies on a deep mentality of anti-semitism as he has no reason to fight this result.
    There's no basis for such a figure to comment, "We love everyone in the world - Jews, Christians, Muslims, non-Muslims, non-Jews, non-Christians... We are against occupation, aggression, killings and displacing people - otherwise we have no problem with ordinary people." If you'd been exposed to any legitimate Jew hatred, you'd know that such a person would not permit his ideological sentiments to be diluted to such a degree as to publicly claim to "love" Jews.
    Indeed, one couldn't expect an anti-semite to simply come out to the world and tell them he hates Jews.
    Anti-semites are not incapable of claiming that they have no problem with Jews, and are able to hide their true feelings.
    We are able to assume from their actions though that they do have those feelings towards the Jewish people, through holocaust denial and the representation of the Jews as the rulers and controllers of the world.
    The most anti-Jewish state leaders in the world are among those who conduct unwarranted aggression against others while claiming to represent world Jewry, inviting increased discrimination and hostility toward that group even though the majority have little to no involvement with the political regime responsible for such deeds. This is almost the equivalent of a false-flag operation.
    The relationship between the Jewish people and Israel is the same as the relationship between the Dutch people and the Netherlands.
    Israel is indeed the representative of the world Jewry, as every person who is ethnically Jewish came from this land.
    It is not a representative of the world Jewry in the way that a Democracy is the representative of its citizens, as not all of the world's Jews are citizens of Israel.
    It is however the cultural representative and the origin of the world Jewry and there is nothing wrong in stating that.
    After all, the Dutch have indeed came from the Netherlands, and if one is coming to this world with a Dutch blood and in a place that is not The Netherlands, he may receive citizenship there as a result of his heritage.

    I would also like to add that Israel's actions are not aggressive, as it never goes to a war unless attacked, and saying otherwise is trying to re-shape reality.
    But that is quite off-topic and was only a reply to your claim.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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    Re: Ahmadinejad revealed to have Jewish past

    I take it this gives him a natural right to live in the Holy Land?
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