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Thread: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

  1. #141
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    why is oboma even qualified

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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    Quote Originally Posted by 75Greeno View Post
    why is oboma even qualified
    Because he has qualified advisors. You think presidents just willy-nilly decide policy?
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    obama gave a grand gift to the grandees of the kremlin gratis

    got nothing in return

    on arming venezuela, nothing

    on cooperation vs iran, nix

    on guarantees of georgian independence, nada

    the prez has no clue what he's doing, he's child-like, a rookie, a neophyte

    putin, epitome of realpolitik, picks his pocket

  4. #144
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    obama gave a grand gift to the grandees of the kremlin gratis

    got nothing in return
    What are you basing this on?

    I can assure you that whenever Obama (or any president) makes a concession on something, they're doing it to get something in return. The fact that they don't disclose what that thing is doesn't mean we got nothing out of it.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

  5. #145
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Nope, it's pretty much fanatic and irrational.
    Their leaders' speeches, the rigged election that wasn't even planned well and it was obvious that it was rigged, the shooting of protesters in the streets.
    Fanatics and irrational.
    Was that meant to be sarcasm? I see you, like many before you, cannot answer the question. If they are so fanatical, why do they never risk their own power and lives?
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  6. #146
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I don't know about this. I'm loath to declare something untenable for any country, especially for those who have a demonstrable reason to desire something.
    But to seriously threaten America, they'd need thousands of reliable, accurate and with large payloads. China right now doesn't even have that and China's economy is well beyond North Korea and Iran's combined and then squared. Furthermore, both the North Koreans and Iranians have proven themselves to be quite adept smugglers. Why choose the unreliable, expensive way when you can go the surefire cheap method to achieve the same results?

    From my perspective, i would agree that it doesn't make sense. I don't know enough about this to argue why I think it was a good decision, but I have to assume that there was a reason for our refusal. Because it seems so incredibly unlikely that this could ever be used as a defense against the Russians, I have to assume it was something else.
    Incredibly unlikely that the current system will be used against Russia, yes. But again, that's not what the Russians are afraid of. They know right now that our system sucks, which it does. What they are afraid of is what it will become.

    For now.
    True, but projecting 50 years from now, it's hard to predict someone else we'd be targeting.

    On its face, that sounds totally reasonable to me. I just assume there's a reason why we don't do that.
    1) Iran isn't the real target

    or

    2) Getting rights to land was too difficult.

    IMO, Iran was never the real target, North Korea as well. It is far easier for both simply to smuggle in weapons and then use them. Remember, governments are lazy.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  7. #147
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    What are you basing this on?

    I can assure you that whenever Obama (or any president) makes a concession on something, they're doing it to get something in return. The fact that they don't disclose what that thing is doesn't mean we got nothing out of it.
    hi

    i base it on the devastating loser-ness of the headline

    he LOOKS awful

    giving up everything to PUTIN and getting nothing in return

    if he indeed GOT anything, he'd trumpet it

    instead of ADVERTISING to the world that he gave up a GEM for NADA

    that's HIS version of the transaction

    he pulled missile D a day before putin reportedly militarized the border

    Russia general says missile plan not shelved | International | Reuters

    (thanks, harshaw)

    obama pulled missile D, a golden bargaining chip

    while putin arms chavez

    U.S. concerned over Venezuela-Russia arms deal | International | Reuters

    while putin plays expansionist in georgia

    while putin continues to "partner" with iran

    Russia stands firm on Iran arms sale

    putin's one tough sob

    i am far less oriented towards the strategies underlying these things, i talk much more about the POLITICS

    politically, this unilateral surrender on sdi in the region is hugely hurtful to the admin

    until obama comes out with whatever secret payoff he got in return, he is totally open to my accusation

    also, it's completely in keeping with his character to give up something for nothing

    he has dictated conditions to israel while ok'ing nuclear power for iran

    France 24 | Obama says Israel must stop building settlements | France 24

    Obama: Iran Has Right to Nuclear Power | NBC Philadelphia

    obama has been much tougher on the israelis than he's been on hamas, which is pretty far upside down (both politically and strategically)

    he's always giving away gifts gratis, selling for squat american security interests

    it appears to be his agenda

    the politics of it stinks

    he's taking heat from everyone from the ny times to chris matthews

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/18/wo...efenswe&st=cse

    i think i'm talking (characteristically) much more about the politics of it than are most the contributors on this very interesting thread who are more interested in the strategic ramifications (which, good for them)

    thanks for asking, my friend

    cliff

  8. #148
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    hi

    i base it on the devastating loser-ness of the headline

    he LOOKS awful

    giving up everything to PUTIN and getting nothing in return

    if he indeed GOT anything, he'd trumpet it
    Why on earth would he do that?
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    you'd have to ask him

  10. #150
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    Re: Obama scraps Bush-era missile defense for new plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Why on earth would he do that?
    It's obviously because nobody in Obama's administration or in the State department has ever heard of diplomacy. If they don't immediately tell us what they got out of it, it means they didn't get anything and the country just got suckered.

    Seems plausible.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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