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Thread: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    What difference does an agenda make? They have VISUAL EVIDENCE; an agenda can't alter the nature of that evidence, so unless you have some specific criticisms about their videos your supposition amounts to nothing more than a lame attempt to deflect the issue.

    It looks like you also missed my point. I pointed out earlier that, because these "journalists" have a clear political agenda, it's reasonable to wonder how many offices they had to visit before they got what they wanted, and that they aren't telling us (or showing the videos) of the number of times they visited offices and were told to get lost.

    The videos show that the organization has some knuckleheads working for them, but it's dangerous (and often dishonest) to generalize the bad behavior of a few to an entire group of people.

    I think it's reasonable to withold judgment unless the "journalists" reveal how many offices they visited, and show us all the videos they took - in their entirety and unedited.

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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdzeye View Post
    It looks like you also missed my point. I pointed out earlier that, because these "journalists" have a clear political agenda, it's reasonable to wonder how many offices they had to visit before they got what they wanted, and that they aren't telling us (or showing the videos) of the number of times they visited offices and were told to get lost.

    The videos show that the organization has some knuckleheads working for them, but it's dangerous (and often dishonest) to generalize the bad behavior of a few to an entire group of people.

    I think it's reasonable to withold judgment unless the "journalists" reveal how many offices they visited, and show us all the videos they took - in their entirety and unedited.
    They were offering to facilitate a child prostitution ring; it happened in several offices across several regions; it's obviously not an anomaly.

    Moreover, referring to these vile, rotten assholes as "knuckleheads" is a profound understatement. It seems like you are trying to downplay the seriousness of this issue.

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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdzeye View Post
    It looks like you also missed my point. I pointed out earlier that, because these "journalists" have a clear political agenda, it's reasonable to wonder how many offices they had to visit before they got what they wanted, and that they aren't telling us (or showing the videos) of the number of times they visited offices and were told to get lost.

    The videos show that the organization has some knuckleheads working for them, but it's dangerous (and often dishonest) to generalize the bad behavior of a few to an entire group of people.

    I think it's reasonable to withold judgment unless the "journalists" reveal how many offices they visited, and show us all the videos they took - in their entirety and unedited.
    How many videos would this journalist have to show before you or anyone defending them would agree that this is a huge issue? They've just released the fifth one! Are you kidding? This is okay considering the billions in tax dollars they receive? How many times does it have to happen before some folks ( I don't single out dems because some are just as outraged ) will admit that this is wrong on every level! If you have a valid argument for what ACORN has done, let's hear it but don't put your head in the sand because you think this journalist has a "political agenda". That's a total cop-out.

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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    10,000 ACORN offices require 10,000 associated videos prior to a trend being believable.
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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    And you know what I have to say to that, don't ya, sweetie?

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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    They were offering to facilitate a child prostitution ring; it happened in several offices across several regions; it's obviously not an anomaly.

    Moreover, referring to these vile, rotten assholes as "knuckleheads" is a profound understatement. It seems like you are trying to downplay the seriousness of this issue.
    "Several" is a vague term. How many is "several?" And how many offices did they have to visit before they got the "several" salacious videos they were looking for? How many offices told them to get lost that they aren't telling us about?

    Every organization has bad apples, but it doesn't mean that the organization itself is corrupt. It seems like ACORN can be accused of poor staff oversight and training, but if you want to use a broad brush because of a few bad apples, you'd better have better evidence than some videos that have no doubt been edited by people who have a clear agenda.

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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Pitwolfy View Post
    How many videos would this journalist have to show before you or anyone defending them would agree that this is a huge issue? They've just released the fifth one! Are you kidding? This is okay considering the billions in tax dollars they receive? How many times does it have to happen before some folks ( I don't single out dems because some are just as outraged ) will admit that this is wrong on every level! If you have a valid argument for what ACORN has done, let's hear it but don't put your head in the sand because you think this journalist has a "political agenda". That's a total cop-out.

    Please show us the posts where people have said that what certain ACORN people did was okey dokey.

    What I'm hearing is people saying, yeah, that's bad, but you haven't proven a trend. I don't see how you can define that as "defending."

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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdzeye View Post
    Then we're in agreement that the reporters had an agenda. This raises questions for me as to whether their agenda was to find at least one bad apple (or five), and report only on those, without bothering to tell us how many offices they had to visit. If it was six, then one could say that there's a different pattern, but a statistician would tell you that the sample size is too small to draw any conclusions - yet. If the number was 50, with five "hits," then one could argue that the organization has some bad apples, but whether that reflects the organization's policies is debatable.

    I'd like to know the exact number of offices the reporters visited and tried their hooker-pimp routine, as well as the unedited videos of all their visits.

    I suspect that because the reporters had an agenda - to discredit a certain liberal activist group - that they are not telling us the entire story.
    Quote Originally Posted by Birdzeye View Post
    "Several" is a vague term. How many is "several?" And how many offices did they have to visit before they got the "several" salacious videos they were looking for? How many offices told them to get lost that they aren't telling us about?

    Every organization has bad apples, but it doesn't mean that the organization itself is corrupt. It seems like ACORN can be accused of poor staff oversight and training, but if you want to use a broad brush because of a few bad apples, you'd better have better evidence than some videos that have no doubt been edited by people who have a clear agenda.
    Are you deliberately ignoring the posts where your question was addressed?

    They didn't visit 50 offices. It wasn't even close. ACORN originally claimed that they were turned away from "dozens," but after further questioning, revised their statement to say they were turned away from "several." I haven't seen either side offer more specific information than that.

    Nevertheless, that is enough information for us to conclude that these filmmakers had an objectively outstanding rate of "success."
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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdzeye View Post
    "Several" is a vague term. How many is "several?"
    Five...so far. In my opinion, one is too many.

    And how many offices did they have to visit before they got the "several" salacious videos they were looking for? How many offices told them to get lost that they aren't telling us about?
    As NYC pointed out, these questions have already been addressed; it seems you just don't like the answers.

    Every organization has bad apples...
    Once again, I object to this BS terminology. These people aren't "bad apples" or "knuckleheads." They're vile individuals who are willing to exploit children. Your insistence on treating them like common trouble-makers undermines the seriousness of this issue and brings into doubt your objectivity.

    ...but it doesn't mean that the organization itself is corrupt. It seems like ACORN can be accused of poor staff oversight and training, but if you want to use a broad brush because of a few bad apples, you'd better have better evidence than some videos that have no doubt been edited by people who have a clear agenda.
    Do you have any specific criticisms of their editing techniques, or just more vague accusations with no basis in fact? If it's the former then, by all means, share them with us; if itís the latter, please cease and desist in your lame attempt to undermine the credibility of these videos.

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    Re: New Acorn Video Scandal Emerges- Employee Asks For Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Are you deliberately ignoring the posts where your question was addressed?

    They didn't visit 50 offices. It wasn't even close. ACORN originally claimed that they were turned away from "dozens," but after further questioning, revised their statement to say they were turned away from "several." I haven't seen either side offer more specific information than that.

    Nevertheless, that is enough information for us to conclude that these filmmakers had an objectively outstanding rate of "success."
    And that is exactly what I'm asking for, more "specific" information, not just vague terms like "several" and "dozens." If that information is not available, then how can you say that my questions have been answered here?

    Apparently saying that what those people did was horrible isn't enough for some people on the right. I believe it is, and I'm aware that some of those folks want to hear that and then respond with, "Aha! Then you DO agree that ACORN is rotten to the core, right?!?" I agree with the first part, but unless these journalists tell us how many offices they visited with their hooker-pimp charade and how many turned them away, and show us all their unedited videos, then I'd say that the jury's still out as to whether the entire organization is rotten to the core.

    I'm sure you'll make sure to let me know when you have some more "specific" information, at least if it is convenient to your argument.

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