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Thread: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

  1. #51
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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post
    Problem is with the failed logic of those that think criticizing 'those in the Republican party who think that the best thing to do is just to kill reform' ipso facto means that Pres Obama does not have the votes to pass a good bill.


    That would be a big problem. With logic on the part of the one putting it forward. Not with Pres Obama's statements.





    From the OP:


    "I believe that we will have enough votes to pass not just any health care bill, but a good health care bill that helps the American people, reduces costs, actually over the long-term controls our deficit. I'm confident that we've got that," Obama said in an interview broadcast Sunday on CBS' "60 Minutes. "There are those in the Republican party who think the best thing to do is just to kill reform. That that will be good politics."
    So?

    If they have the votes to pass the bill, why are they whining about Republicans at all? Why not just pass the damn thing and be done with it?

    Me, I think HE thinks bashing Republicans over it is "good politics."
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    Multiple tax cuts not just the first one. Yeah the GOP did say that.
    Prove it.
    And, you didnt answer the question -- did the Dems just roll over and give the tax cuts to him, or did they not?

    When Bush was reelected by a thin majority he claimed a mandate.
    Claiming a mandate =/= "We won, give us what we want".

    Plenty of times the GOP was asking for up and down votes on confirmation and legislation.
    Asking for a up/down vote =/= "We won, give us what we want".

    So, if these are the total of your responses, its clear you cannot support the idea that the Dems rolled over for GWB and that GWB bullied them into it by reminding them that they lost the election.

    Thus rendering moot YOUR point that:
    The republicans seem to forget they lost the election.
    That's not compromise that's called capitulation.
    Which is exactly what you expect of the GOP.

    Except when its convenient right? They seem to have no problem dropping principles when they hold the keys.
    Ah... you cannot refute the point, so you try to change the subject.
    I'll take that as your concession of the issue.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    And, if they succeed, we will be forever better for it.


    Translation:
    No, I cannot really back it up -- but its still a fact!

    .
    The basic idea that the government exists to protect yrou rights, not provide you the means to exercise them?
    That having a right does not mean having the right to have others provide you the means to exercise that right?
    Oh wait -- those ideas ARE beyond you.
    And again, you ignore facts.
    It's time for a revolution in our country. Not a revolution forged with guns and bombs but a revolution forged of compassion and altruism. A revolution that extends a hand to those who don't have and who cannot. A revolution that makes Health Care available to all those in the US.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    ....So Republicans aren't trying to block the Health Care bill?




    Dems have a filibuster proof majority.... so no.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by formerroadie View Post
    And again, you ignore facts.
    You havent presented any facts, only opinion masquerading as such.

    Never mind the fact that you didnt actually address anything I wrote.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Me, I think HE thinks bashing Republicans over it is "good politics."
    And, The Obami, the useful idiots that they are, clearly agree.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    No spin. Demint said what he said and multiple republicans have supported it. He didn't say if we kill this bill he said if we kill health reform. He meant health reform specifically and he made it political not me. They are about killing reform. Back then they even said it would hurt them if health care passed when it was tried in the 90s.
    Could you please link me to whatever quote it is you're refering to? Its not the now infamous Waterloo quote is it?

    "If we're able to stop Obama on this, it will be his Waterloo. It will break him."

    ...

    DeMint said he could "almost guarantee you this thing won't pass before August, and if we can hold it back until we go home for a month's break in August...Senators and Congressmen will come back in September afraid to vote against the American people."
    Demint's Comments

    Its not that comment are you? Cause that seems pretty clearly talking about THIS particular bill.

    "Stop Obama on THIS"

    "THIS thing won't pass"

    Seems to me he's talking SPECIFICALLY about this health care reform plan, not "Health care reform" in general.

    Could you please provide a source to back up your claims?

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Prove it.
    And, you didnt answer the question -- did the Dems just roll over and give the tax cuts to him, or did they not?
    You forget about the line of "elections have consequences" which is what the GOP was saying after they won.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Claiming a mandate =/= "We won, give us what we want".
    More like I won I'm going to do whatever I feel like try to stop me

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Asking for a up/down vote =/= "We won, give us what we want".
    Considering not all things get up and down votes sounds like them wanting the dems to capitulate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    So, if these are the total of your responses, its clear you cannot support the idea that the Dems rolled over for GWB and that GWB bullied them into it by reminding them that they lost the election.
    I see you skipped the other examples I gave you where the dems did roll over on the iraq supplementals, on the torture legislation, on the FISA revisions, Telecom immunity

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Thus rendering moot YOUR point that:
    Yeah if you skip every example given and act like I never gave them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Which is exactly what you expect of the GOP.
    No not even close. I expect if the GOP is going to offer up provisions and they get put in the bill they should actually vote on it otherwise the democrats shouldn't insert their provisions into bills. Again this is about the GOPs refusal to compromise when the Democrats are willing to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Ah... you cannot refute the point, so you try to change the subject.
    I'll take that as your concession of the issue.
    No not changing the subject its related. You brought up principles which the GOP somehow have except when they have the power.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    Dems have a filibuster proof majority.... so no.
    No they don't. You forget Ted Kennedy died no one has replaced his seat. They have 57 democrats. There are 2 independents that caucas with them but Lieberman is a wildcard and never know which way he'll vote. Even if Lieberman voted with them as well as Sanders that makes 59 votes. It takes 60 to defeat a filibuster

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    You forget about the line of "elections have consequences" which is what the GOP was saying after they won.
    Again: you didnt answer the question -- did the Dems just roll over and give the tax cuts to him, or did they not?

    More like I won I'm going to do whatever I feel like try to stop me
    You can characterize it however you want in order to avoid having to admit you;re wrong -- its STILL not what you said.

    And, note that "I won, try to stop me" is NOT the same as "since I won, you have no place to stop me", as you suggested -- in fact, its clearly the opposite.

    Considering not all things get up and down votes sounds like them wanting the dems to capitulate.

    Asking for a straight vote is an expectation of capitulation?


    I see you skipped the other examples I gave you where the dems did roll over on the iraq supplementals, on the torture legislation, on the FISA revisions, Telecom immunity
    Show these things to examples of this -- as it ssems to me that the Dems mustered opposition to each and every one of them.

    Yeah if you skip every example given and act like I never gave them.
    See above.

    And I'll ask again, just because I know you will skip it from adove:
    Did the Dems just roll over and give the tax cuts to him, or did they not?

    No not even close.
    Not, its spot on -- you expect the GOP to accept the one provision they cannot. Thats capitulation, regardless of how many 'gimmies' you offer to them.

    No not changing the subject its related.
    Yes, you are changing the subject; however relqted you think it is, you're still discussing someting other than what I said.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 09-14-09 at 03:39 PM.

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