• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

It's amazing that I have to explain this, because most people understand it without explanation, but "So?" generally means "this doesn't mean anything in terms of the point." Most people have that figured out by first grade, if not before. :roll:



I "assumed" nothing other than what he said, which is that he has the votes.

Now, assuming that he has the votes, why don't they just go pass the bill?

What does bashing Republicans for trying to "block" it accomplish?

You have answered neither of those questions. Claiming you have is either dishonesty or knuckle-dragging droolery.



Sorry, you have no point.

Your question was, Democrats have the votes to pass the bill so why is Pres Obama criticizing Republicans who are trying to kill reform because they believe it's good politics.


Democrats WILL pass the bill.
And ..... Republicans who are trying to kill reform because they believe it's good politics deserve to be criticized.
 
What do you mean by you all? I haven't stated anything about the bill but rather Republicans lack of compromise while expecting the democrats to acquiesce.




And pogue once again starts in with his obfuscation of irrellevancy...


Perhaps if you took a stand, people wouldn't have to guess...:roll:
 
And pogue once again starts in with his obfuscation of irrellevancy...


Perhaps if you took a stand, people wouldn't have to guess...:roll:

I just know how much it gets on your nerves rev :lol: I was in a discussion with someone about compromising. Nothing irrellevant its where the topic went for a while.
 
Sorry, you have no point.

Your question was, Democrats have the votes to pass the bill so why is Pres Obama criticizing Republicans who are trying to kill reform because they believe it's good politics.

No.

The original question was, the votes are there to pass the bill, so what's the problem he's addressing?

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...ocking-health-care-bill-5.html#post1058253262

Want to take an actual crack at it? You never have.


But I'll also ask again -- what does it accomplish to whine about Republicans trying to "block" the bill when he says they CAN'T stop the bill?

Answer: it's political theater, nothing more. Got a better answer? Let's see it. Be specific.
 
I will reply to this one. The problem is that while yes, the republicans have presented bills to committee, they have not promoted those bills, or anything other than saying "no". If you write a long post on a topic in a word processor on your computer, and file it away on your hard disc without telling any one about it, you are not promoting that post. This is very much like what the republicans have done. The only way I could find out what republicans do want for health care reform is to read some overlong bill that is lacking in details. That is not effective presentation.
This is just a further explanation as to how you moved the goalpost.

You didnt ask "where have the Rebublicans promoted their bill" or "where is the GOP's effective presentation of their plan", you asked:

Where are republicans saying what they would vote for?
Where are republicans saying what they do want?

The links I provided describe exactly that, and it is impossible to argue otherwise.
 
I will reply to this one. The problem is that while yes, the republicans have presented bills to committee, they have not promoted those bills, or anything other than saying "no". If you write a long post on a topic in a word processor on your computer, and file it away on your hard disc without telling any one about it, you are not promoting that post. This is very much like what the republicans have done. The only way I could find out what republicans do want for health care reform is to read some overlong bill that is lacking in details. That is not effective presentation.

There's nothing they CAN do.

I see you responded to that one, but the reason for this is in my other post.

To stop the health care reform bill that includes the public option which they and their constituents dislike so much they only have to get a few dems to agree with them.

To push their views and actually promote it and get it past they'd have to get a majority of Democrats to agree with them to both get it to pass and have enough to prevent the likely veto that could occur.

One is a hard task, but relatively achievable.

The other is akin to playing 1 on 5 basketball, near impossible.

Elected representitives are just like the rest of us. They need to sleep and eat. They live in a world where there's only 24 hours in a given day and only 7 days in a given week. They can only spend so much time doing certain things.

If they spent all their time CURRENTLY trying to push bills that had .00001% chance of actually passing instead of focusing on stopping something that currently the overwhelming majority of their voters dislike and don't want then they are severely wasting their time, and severly wasting the time and money of those that voted for them.

They'd be serving their constituents a hair better than if they were just banging their head against a wall if they did that, because it's a completely fruitless endevour.

Now, if this bill dies and something comes up WITHOUT a public option, and in such a way that their constituents could accept some form of compromise on other issues, then that's the time to truly be pushing ahead saying "Lets try this idea, lets try this one". But right now its more important to kill A PUBLIC OPTION than it is to push for Health Care Reform, because its more likely and thus a better use of their time for it to happen that way. That does not mean they're against Reform, or don't have ideas, or wouldn't compromise, but it means there's a far greater issue for them and their consitutents at play now that makes it not worth wasting time trying to push the impossible.
 
No.

The original question was, the votes are there to pass the bill, so what's the problem he's addressing?

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...ocking-health-care-bill-5.html#post1058253262

Want to take an actual crack at it? You never have.


But I'll also ask again -- what does it accomplish to whine about Republicans trying to "block" the bill when he says they CAN'T stop the bill?

Answer: it's political theater, nothing more. Got a better answer? Let's see it. Be specific.



Sorry, that little sidestep didn't work. The 'problem' was the thread topic - Obama criticizing obstructionist Republicans.


Unless you didn't remember the topic of the thread? That's happened before .....


Or, unless you didn't understand the sentence that Obama said? Cuz I could believe that too. He outlined obstructionism for the sake of politics as deserving criticism.
 
Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill - Political News - FOXNews.com


WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama said he is confident Congress will pass "a good health care bill," as months of rancor over reforming the nation's health care system seemed to be easing Sunday, with the White House playing down an immediate role for a government insurance option.

At the same time, Obama was critical of Republican opponents who he said were trying to block an overhaul of the nation's heath care system for political gain.

"I believe that we will have enough votes to pass not just any health care bill, but a good health care bill that helps the American people, reduces costs, actually over the long-term controls our deficit. I'm confident that we've got that," Obama said in an interview broadcast Sunday on CBS' "60 Minutes. "There are those in the Republican party who think the best thing to do is just to kill reform. That that will be good politics."

Hmmm someone in the White House needs to inform Mr. Obama it's just not some folks in the Republican party who want this thing to be killed off. The last time I looked allot of "AMERICANS" from all sides of the Political Spectrum want this thing to be killed off. but hey typical Demogod attacks blame it on the Republicans and if that doesn't work then go after the So-Called Right Wing Folks never mind the actually truth out there. Once again Mr. Obama is lieing threw his Teeth and he knows it.

The problem is they want to BLOCK it. You say it yourself! The right refuses to work with BOTH sides. The right has great ideas and the feels a public OPTION is necessary for those who are still left out.

The Republicans are trying to block a bill that they should be helping to create. I criticize that as well.
 
There's nothing they CAN do.

I see you responded to that one, but the reason for this is in my other post.

To stop the health care reform bill that includes the public option which they and their constituents dislike so much they only have to get a few dems to agree with them.

To push their views and actually promote it and get it past they'd have to get a majority of Democrats to agree with them to both get it to pass and have enough to prevent the likely veto that could occur.

One is a hard task, but relatively achievable.

The other is akin to playing 1 on 5 basketball, near impossible.

Elected representitives are just like the rest of us. They need to sleep and eat. They live in a world where there's only 24 hours in a given day and only 7 days in a given week. They can only spend so much time doing certain things.

If they spent all their time CURRENTLY trying to push bills that had .00001% chance of actually passing instead of focusing on stopping something that currently the overwhelming majority of their voters dislike and don't want then they are severely wasting their time, and severly wasting the time and money of those that voted for them.

They'd be serving their constituents a hair better than if they were just banging their head against a wall if they did that, because it's a completely fruitless endevour.

Now, if this bill dies and something comes up WITHOUT a public option, and in such a way that their constituents could accept some form of compromise on other issues, then that's the time to truly be pushing ahead saying "Lets try this idea, lets try this one". But right now its more important to kill A PUBLIC OPTION than it is to push for Health Care Reform, because its more likely and thus a better use of their time for it to happen that way. That does not mean they're against Reform, or don't have ideas, or wouldn't compromise, but it means there's a far greater issue for them and their consitutents at play now that makes it not worth wasting time trying to push the impossible.

I think we are kinda talking about two different things. The action is not in congress, it's before the American people. Right now the battle is for "hearts and minds". There are two ways to fight this battle: you can either complain about the other guys stance, or present your own better stance. In front of the people, the republicans have chosen the former. Yes, it is the easier path, but it leaves them open to the criticism of being "the party of no".

The question also arises that if republicans want health care reform, why don't we have it? Would they have been unable to pass it when they had the executive and legislative? Over the last 3 presidents, only one has not worked for health care, and you can guess what party he was in. All the protestations that republicans actually are for health care ring hollow in the face of facts.
 
Sorry, that little sidestep didn't work. The 'problem' was the thread topic - Obama criticizing obstructionist Republicans.


Unless you didn't remember the topic of the thread? That's happened before .....

There's no sidestep; you responded directly to my question. You didn't actually answer it, but you responded to it. I'd suggest that now complaining that it's off-topic simply makes it appear as though you're avoiding it.

(Which, mostly likely, is true.)

If you think it's off-topic, report it, ignore it, or say that it's off-topic at the time. But after this lengthy exchange, now it's suddenly the tack you want to take? Not credible in the least.


Or, unless you didn't understand the sentence that Obama said? Cuz I could believe that too. He outlined obstructionism for the sake of politics as deserving criticism.

Yes, which is hypocritical of him, because he's talking about "obstructionism" which HE SAYS can't actually "obstruct" anything -- which means he's doing it for the "sake of politics" himself. Thus, he deserves the same criticism for the same reason.
 
The problem is they want to BLOCK it. You say it yourself! The right refuses to work with BOTH sides. The right has great ideas and the feels a public OPTION is necessary for those who are still left out.

The Republicans are trying to block a bill that they should be helping to create. I criticize that as well.
I dont understand why people think that Republicans would or could cave in on the issue of the Public Option.

I alos don't understand why the Dems, if they have the votes that The Obama says they have, don't just pass the thing instead of harping on the GOP?
 
I think we are kinda talking about two different things. The action is not in congress, it's before the American people. Right now the battle is for "hearts and minds".
The dems have the votes, or so The Obama says.
Why not vote and pass it?

The question also arises that if republicans want health care reform, why don't we have it?
Good question -- see above.
 
I dont understand why people think that Republicans would or could cave in on the issue of the Public Option.

I alos don't understand why the Dems, if they have the votes that The Obama says they have, don't just pass the thing instead of harping on the GOP?

Because this is not the Bush Administration and Obama's administration encourages bipartisanship. I know - hard to comprehend.
 
There's no sidestep; you responded directly to my question. You didn't actually answer it, but you responded to it. I'd suggest that now complaining that it's off-topic simply makes it appear as though you're avoiding it.

(Which, mostly likely, is true.)

If you think it's off-topic, report it, ignore it, or say that it's off-topic at the time. But after this lengthy exchange, now it's suddenly the tack you want to take? Not credible in the least.




Yes, which is hypocritical of him, because he's talking about "obstructionism" which HE SAYS can't actually "obstruct" anything -- which means he's doing it for the "sake of politics" himself. Thus, he deserves the same criticism for the same reason.


Uh, see, you DID know what the problem was. And, you think the one has something to do with the other. :lol:
 
Because this is not the Bush Administration and Obama's administration encourages bipartisanship. I know - hard to comprehend.

Yes.

"Vote for my agenda, damn you!"
 
Because this is not the Bush Administration and Obama's administration encourages bipartisanship.
I know - hard to comprehend.
If that were true, The Obama wold offer a bill that the GOP could support.
Given that He hasnt and that He won't, your response is incorrect.

Want to try again, or is that your final answer?
 
Uh, see, you DID know what the problem was. And, you think the one has something to do with the other. :lol:

You're going to have to parse out this babbling a bit more.

What is the problem that you claim I know, and what does it not (?) have "something to do with"?

If it's that simple, why can't you just answer the question in simple terms? Lay it out.
 
If that were true, The Obama wold offer a bill that the GOP could support.
Given that He hasnt and that He won't, your response is incorrect.

Want to try again, or is that your final answer?

And the GOP will only support their own model because apparently providing an affordable option that our near monopolistic health care system can't is fascism.
 
Close!
Vote for MY agenda, you partisan hacks!

Apparently "if you can make this bill better, I'd love to hear about it!" is what passes for "bipartisanship." Doesn't matter that the opposition thinks it's ill-conceived from the ground up; no, a suggestion box to tweak Obama's agenda on a few minor points -- that's bipartisanship.
 
And the GOP will only support their own model because apparently providing an affordable option that our near monopolistic health care system can't is fascism.
So you agree that The REAL reason this hasn't gone up for a vote doesnt have anything to do with The Obama's desire for bi-partisanship GOP support, as such a desire in demonstrably non-existent.

So, what is it then?
 
Apparently "if you can make this bill better, I'd love to hear about it!" is what passes for "bipartisanship." Doesn't matter that the opposition thinks it's ill-conceived from the ground up; no, a suggestion box to tweak Obama's agenda on a few minor points -- that's bipartisanship.
"Take this bill, or shove it"
-The Obama

How much kool-aid you have to drink before you no longer see that there is absolutely NO desire for bi-partisanship from The Obama, the Dems or the left, and stop wondering why, exactly, that is?
 
I dont understand why people think that Republicans would or could cave in on the issue of the Public Option.

I alos don't understand why the Dems, if they have the votes that The Obama says they have, don't just pass the thing instead of harping on the GOP?

Hmm in one post you talk about them not wanting to be bipartisan and in the next imply that they are by trying to get the gop on board
 
So you agree that The REAL reason this hasn't gone up for a vote doesnt have anything to do with The Obama's desire for bi-partisanship GOP support, as such a desire in demonstrably non-existent.

So, what is it then?

A public option is NON-DEBATABLE according to the right. It can't even be discussed. Still. Because...it's fascism or socialism or whatever your word of the day is. So they block it. THank you for all your hard work.

Would Obama be a saint to you folks if he never proposed anything and just attented events and waved a lot?
 
If that were true, The Obama wold offer a bill that the GOP could support.
Given that He hasnt and that He won't, your response is incorrect.

Want to try again, or is that your final answer?

So in other words give the GOP what they want regardless of who is president or who controls congress. The GOP being the minority should be trying to work towards a compromise not asking for everything they want or taking their toys off the playground.
 
Back
Top Bottom