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Thread: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    So? What are they suppose to do, roll over and play dead now for four years? I don't remember the Dems doing that after 1994. I don't remember the Dems doing that when Bush won twice. So what is your point? Compromise to the Democrats is Republicans giving in.
    No as has been shown with this president Compromise is giving a little for the other side as was done with the stimulus bill and thus far is being done with this bill with them trying to take out the public option. Thus far the republicans have shown no desire to compromise. Again what is the point of the democrats giving in when the republicans refuse to vote for a bill even after their changes are made? What exactly do they stand to gain?

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    Halfway? There is no halfway.
    The republicans seem to forget they lost the election.
    So did the Dems in 2000 2002 2004.
    Did they roll over and give GWB everything he wanted?

    Compromise is both sides giving...
    Comprimise is giving someone something they -can- vote for.
    Why would a Repubkican, as a Republican, vote for this bill?

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    So did the Dems in 2000 2002 2004.
    Did they roll over and give GWB everything he wanted?
    Are you asking this question with a straight face?


    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Comprimise is giving someone something they -can- vote for.
    Why would a Repubkican, as a Republican, vote for this bill?
    So if the republicans wont vote for a bill even with their own provisions added why should the democrats even try to compromise. So you're saying most of the stuff republicans offer up isn't anything they'd vote for.
    Last edited by PogueMoran; 09-14-09 at 01:54 PM.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    No as has been shown with this president Compromise is giving a little for the other side as was done with the stimulus bill and thus far is being done with this bill with them trying to take out the public option. Thus far the republicans have shown no desire to compromise. Again what is the point of the democrats giving in when the republicans refuse to vote for a bill even after their changes are made? What exactly do they stand to gain?
    It goes against the principle of smaller government.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    Are you asking this question with a straight face?
    I'll take your answer, please.

    So if the republicans wont vote for a bill even with their own provisions added why should the democrats even try to compromise.
    There's more to it than what was put into the bill -- there's also what is taken out, or in this case, not taken out. You cannot expect the GOP to vote for something that they cannot, as the GOP, vote for, even if you include some things they WILL vote for.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    It goes against the principle of smaller government.
    Where was this principle of smaller government when patriot act 1 and 2 were passed when the department of homeland security was created? Was it conveniently misplaced did they store it in one of al gore's social security "lockboxes"

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    I'll take your answer, please.


    There's more to it than what was put into the bill -- there's also what is taken out, or in this case, not taken out. You cannot expect the GOP to vote for something that they cannot, as the GOP, vote for, even if you include some things they WILL vote for.
    Off the top of my head the bush tax cuts which were rammed through with the budget reconciliation process. So in other words theres no sense of compromising the republicans only want their bill passed regardless of what the democrats put in for them or take out. Demint made it quite clear they dont want health reform to pass just as they didnt back in the 90s because it would hurt the republican party

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    Off the top of my head the bush tax cuts which were rammed through with the budget reconciliation process. So in other words theres no sense of compromising the republicans only want their bill passed regardless of what the democrats put in for them or take out. Demint made it quite clear they dont want health reform to pass just as they didnt back in the 90s because it would hurt the republican party
    Reconciliation was used by the Republicans for Bush tax cuts in '01 and '03, extending capital gains and dividends tax cuts in '05, spending cuts in '05, and they argued for using it for opening up ANWR to drilling in '05, but I don't remember what happened with that bill.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    Off the top of my head the bush tax cuts which were rammed through with the budget reconciliation process.
    Irrelevant to the point.
    I said:
    [the dems lost] in 2000 2002 2004.
    I then asked:
    Did they roll over and give GWB everything he wanted?
    Did the Dems roll over and give GWB the tax cuts?
    Did the GOP argue that 'we won, give us what we want'?

    So in other words...
    You really need to stop creating strawmen by putting words in my mouth.

    The issue here is comprimise.

    You're arguing that the Dems have tried to comprimise by adding some things the GOP wants included -- and as far as that goes, you have some degree of credibility. What you fail to recognize, willfully or otherwise, is that, in order for the GOP, being the GOP, to support the bill, the bill has to NOT have things in it that the GOP CANNOT support. When the Dems start talking about the removal of those things, then the issue of comprimise and the GOPs supposed unwiliingness to do so, will be open for discussion.

    That is, you cannot expect a party to vote for something that goes against its core political positions; you then cannot refuse to address the difference in that position and argue that you tried to comprimise because you added a few things that said party might like.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 09-14-09 at 02:27 PM.

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    Re: Obama Criticizes Republicans for Blocking Health Care Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    ....So Republicans aren't trying to block the Health Care bill?
    Trying and doing are two different things, but, to answer your red herring question, yes, the spineless GOP is actually trying something of merit.
    Last edited by Ethereal; 09-14-09 at 02:27 PM.

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