Page 1 of 8 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 71

Thread: Sentenced to death on the NHS

  1. #1
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,306

    Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Link

    By Kate Devlin, Medical Correspondent
    Published: 10:00PM BST 02 Sep 2009

    In a letter to The Daily Telegraph, a group of experts who care for the terminally ill claim that some patients are being wrongly judged as close to death.
    Under NHS guidance introduced across England to help doctors and medical staff deal with dying patients, they can then have fluid and drugs withdrawn and many are put on continuous sedation until they pass away.
    But this approach can also mask the signs that their condition is improving, the experts warn.
    As a result the scheme is causing a “national crisis” in patient care, the letter states. It has been signed palliative care experts including Professor Peter Millard, Emeritus Professor of Geriatrics, University of London, Dr Peter Hargreaves, a consultant in Palliative Medicine at St Luke’s cancer centre in Guildford, and four others.
    “Forecasting death is an inexact science,”they say. Patients are being diagnosed as being close to death “without regard to the fact that the diagnosis could be wrong.
    “As a result a national wave of discontent is building up, as family and friends witness the denial of fluids and food to patients."
    Is there any question about the type of healthcare models being considered in the Obama Administration? They talk about Europe like it's a panacea.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  2. #2
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Naperville, IL
    Last Seen
    09-24-12 @ 02:14 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    11,963

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Link


    Is there any question about the type of healthcare models being considered in the Obama Administration? They talk about Europe like it's a panacea.
    Um... yes. To answer your question.

    Apples/Oranges...

  3. #3
    Guru
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Last Seen
    11-03-11 @ 08:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    2,834

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Link


    Is there any question about the type of healthcare models being considered in the Obama Administration? They talk about Europe like it's a panacea.
    How would this be any different with private insurance?

    Again people seem to not understand how the english and canadian health care systems differ and how the proposed system differs from both.

    In England the doctors are both paid by the government and work for the government. In Canada private practitioners are reimbursed by the government through a single payer system. In the US we're talking about a public insurance subsidized by the government and a private insurance which people can buy. The doctors stay private. So again what's the point of posting all these articles about England when no one is proposing a socialized health care system like england

  4. #4
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Naperville, IL
    Last Seen
    09-24-12 @ 02:14 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    11,963

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Quote Originally Posted by PogueMoran View Post
    How would this be any different with private insurance?

    Again people seem to not understand how the english and canadian health care systems differ and how the proposed system differs from both.

    In England the doctors are both paid by the government and work for the government. In Canada private practitioners are reimbursed by the government through a single payer system. In the US we're talking about a public insurance subsidized by the government and a private insurance which people can buy. The doctors stay private. So again what's the point of posting all these articles about England when no one is proposing a socialized health care system like england
    It keeps people fearful and prevents them from being pragmatic and thoughtful in their analysis of the proposed health care reform.

    What is describe in the article is how people die under hospice paid by Medicare. Free of pain and with their dignity.

    Feeding tubes, life support machines have their place. But postponing death when a person has no quality of life is cruel and selfish.

  5. #5
    Sage
    kaya'08's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    British Turk
    Last Seen
    05-12-14 @ 01:14 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    6,363

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Link


    Is there any question about the type of healthcare models being considered in the Obama Administration? They talk about Europe like it's a panacea.
    Actually, our NHS definetly has its flaws, but its the backbone of the country. Its a complete success story in terms of offering healthcare to everybody in the country at no cost. This crisis is one i have not yet heard of, and sounds like it is on a small scale. Otherwise, the NHS has been miracolous at saving lives and offering health care opportunities and jobs across the country. Sometimes it can be tedious to wait for something as simple as a scan...but when you find yourself in need of an Op, us Britons are ever so glad it exists. I dont think we could imagine a UK without it.

    So stop using the NHS's faults as a terror tactic for your own governments plans. I agree, it will be very difficult and very costly in a country as large as America. Obama will likey legislate the American Health Care System in such a way that will be a burden for your middle class American taxpayer in one way or another, you may believe it will reduce quality. But here in Britain, our system is just fine, so leave it alone.
    Last edited by kaya'08; 09-02-09 at 08:58 PM.
    "If religious instruction were not allowed until the child had attained the age of reason, we would be living in quite a different world" - Christopher Hitchens
    > Good to be back, but I'm only visiting for a few weeks. <

  6. #6
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,306

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    No that's bullshiat! There's no such thing as no cost. Are the doctors and nurses working for free? I guess they eat at soup kitchens right?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  7. #7
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,306

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    It keeps people fearful and prevents them from being pragmatic and thoughtful in their analysis of the proposed health care reform.

    What is describe in the article is how people die under hospice paid by Medicare. Free of pain and with their dignity.

    Feeding tubes, life support machines have their place. But postponing death when a person has no quality of life is cruel and selfish.
    We'll remembe that when it's your turn. In your case we might jerk the tube early out of niceness.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    01-30-10 @ 07:12 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    1,618

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    We'll remembe that when it's your turn. In your case we might jerk the tube early out of niceness.
    American, can you explain to us what this issue in the OP has to do with the system argued over in the US?

    After all, the doctors in the UK are not withdrawing food & water because of cost reasons but because of ethical reasons regarding quality of life.

    So given that, what are you trying to tell us?

  9. #9
    Guru
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Last Seen
    11-03-11 @ 08:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    2,834

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    We'll remembe that when it's your turn. In your case we might jerk the tube early out of niceness.
    Yeah and I'm sure when you get to the point in your life where you want out we'll keep fighting to keep you alive terri schiavo style. Regardless of how far gone your body and mind are

  10. #10
    Sage
    kaya'08's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    British Turk
    Last Seen
    05-12-14 @ 01:14 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    6,363

    Re: Sentenced to death on the NHS

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    No that's bullshiat! There's no such thing as no cost. Are the doctors and nurses working for free? I guess they eat at soup kitchens right?
    Was that post for me? I didnt say there was no costs. We pay for the healthcare we recieve through tax. But that comes back to us when we are in need of medical attention. The taxes are reasonable and ensure the best quality health care, and when we need it, we recieve the sufficient attention we need, without having to worry about soaring debts compromising our lifestyle as a result. Healthcare is a service we have the right to. In the long run it works out better to pay an extra tax than pay huge bills when in need of medical attention.

    And in your posting of this article, it is evident you have no clue about our NHS system, hence your attempt at a comparison between the British national health care and the American to-be national healthcare, as they are totally different systems (legistlated and strucutured totally differently).
    "If religious instruction were not allowed until the child had attained the age of reason, we would be living in quite a different world" - Christopher Hitchens
    > Good to be back, but I'm only visiting for a few weeks. <

Page 1 of 8 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •