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Thread: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

  1. #211
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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    No one is saying that. I think people pretty much have agree that honor killings are "wrong" and this situation is pretty heinous. Is there something more you are looking for?


    You are making an assumption here, for even as you or I might find them heinous, unless a person actually posts such an opinion, we do not really know for certain. That is the problem with apologia -- in fact, such a tendency pretty much defines the very term -- in that when people dig in their heels and immediately defend at all costs, they are tacitly defending the practice right along with everything else.

    When a person resorts to sophistry trying to diminish or deny its prevelence, and then goes about the practice of trying to link it to something either much less prevelent or inherently destructive, and all the time not offering any actual condemnation of he practice itself - -they are indeed supporting it.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    You are making an assumption here, for even as you or I might find them heinous, unless a person actually posts such an opinion, we do not really know for certain. That is the problem with apologia -- in fact, such a tendency pretty much defines the very term -- in that when people dig in their heels and immediately defend at all costs, they are tacitly defending the practice right along with everything else.

    When a person resorts to sophistry trying to diminish or deny its prevelence, and then goes about the practice of trying to link it to something either much less prevelent or inherently destructive, and all the time not offering any actual condemnation of he practice itself - -they are indeed supporting it.
    Who is denying it?
    Who is condoning it on these forums?


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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    This situation reminds me of the girls who've fled from abuse by their polygamist families in Utah, Arizona and Colorado.

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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    You are making an assumption here, for even as you or I might find them heinous, unless a person actually posts such an opinion, we do not really know for certain. That is the problem with apologia -- in fact, such a tendency pretty much defines the very term -- in that when people dig in their heels and immediately defend at all costs, they are tacitly defending the practice right along with everything else.

    When a person resorts to sophistry trying to diminish or deny its prevelence, and then goes about the practice of trying to link it to something either much less prevelent or inherently destructive, and all the time not offering any actual condemnation of he practice itself - -they are indeed supporting it.
    We are ALL against honour killings no matter where no matter under which circumstances and no matter by whom. Anyone who thinks otherwise should not have the right to breathe.

    The problem though, is that the father has not been proven guilty of threatening his daughter with death yet.

    So, are you saying that anything which presumes heinous acts by Muslims should be believed without questions asked?

    I have reasons to have doubts, when I watch this.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_W2SUn1ZNU0"]YouTube - Without My Daughter (Part 1 of 6)[/ame]

    Do watch the 6 episodes of the documentary before replying.
    "True wisdom is less presuming than folly. The wise man doubteth often, and changeth his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubteth not; he knoweth all things but his own ignorance." -- Akhenaton
    To understand does not mean to support or to excuse

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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    Quote Originally Posted by Mira View Post
    The problem though, is that the father has not been proven guilty of threatening his daughter with death yet.
    Yep, we are still innocent before guilty.

    Was there a history of her being beaten? I seem to have forgotten.
    If she wasn't, then what grounds can she be taken away from parents?
    In UK there must be some form of history before SS can remove them.


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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    Yep, we are still innocent before guilty.

    Was there a history of her being beaten? I seem to have forgotten.
    If she wasn't, then what grounds can she be taken away from parents?
    In UK there must be some form of history before SS can remove them.
    I didn't see any articles talking about her being beaten in the past, she never mentions any beating in the videos that I saw of her speaking either. Again, I could have missed that part.Anyway, if she has no traces of violence on her body, that cannot be proven either.

    In any case, no matter what, if the girl says that she will be killed, even if there is the slightest doubt, the girl should NOT be returned to her family, especially that the practice of honour killings is a reality.
    "True wisdom is less presuming than folly. The wise man doubteth often, and changeth his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubteth not; he knoweth all things but his own ignorance." -- Akhenaton
    To understand does not mean to support or to excuse

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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    Quote Originally Posted by SgtRock View Post
    I said "Islamic text" the Qu'ran is only part of the Islamic text. But if you insist.

    Quran 4:90 "If they turn back from Islam, becoming renegades, seize them and kill them wherever you find them".

    Quran 4:115 If anyone contradicts or opposes the Messenger after guidance has been conveyed to him, and follows a path other than the way, We shall burn him in Hell!

    Sahih Bukahari Volume 9, Book 84, Number 57
    Some Zanadiqa (atheists) were brought to 'Ali and he burnt them. The news of this event, reached Ibn 'Abbas who said, "If I had been in his place, I would not have burnt them, as Allah's Apostle forbade it, saying, 'Do not punish anybody with Allah's punishment (fire).' I would have killed them according to the statement of Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"
    I have the Koran right here in English and in Arabic

    The Unbelievers

    Say: Unbelievers, I do not serve what you worship, nor do you serve what I worship. I shall never serve what you worship, nor will you ever serve what I worship. You have your own religion and I have mine.

    In Arabic, Lakom Dinukum wa li Dini.

    nuf' said
    Last edited by Mira; 08-24-09 at 02:16 PM.
    "True wisdom is less presuming than folly. The wise man doubteth often, and changeth his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubteth not; he knoweth all things but his own ignorance." -- Akhenaton
    To understand does not mean to support or to excuse

  8. #218
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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    Quote Originally Posted by Mira View Post
    I have the Koran right here in English and in Arabic

    The Unbelievers

    Say: Unbelievers, I do not serve what you worship, nor do you serve what I worship. I shall never serve what you worship, nor will you ever serve what I worship. You have your own religion and I have mine.

    In Arabic, Lakom Rabbokom wa li Rabbi.

    nuf' said
    So im right. SgtRock was just spreading the propaganda.
    "If religious instruction were not allowed until the child had attained the age of reason, we would be living in quite a different world" - Christopher Hitchens
    > Good to be back, but I'm only visiting for a few weeks. <

  9. #219
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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    Quote Originally Posted by kaya'08 View Post
    So im right. SgtRock was just spreading the propaganda.
    A whole group of people here are spreading propaganda. They are certainly doing the same on several other forums as well. They are on a mission.
    "True wisdom is less presuming than folly. The wise man doubteth often, and changeth his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubteth not; he knoweth all things but his own ignorance." -- Akhenaton
    To understand does not mean to support or to excuse

  10. #220
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    Re: Teen Fears Honor Killing by Muslim Father

    For those who use the Internet as the untimate proof, READ !

    "True wisdom is less presuming than folly. The wise man doubteth often, and changeth his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubteth not; he knoweth all things but his own ignorance." -- Akhenaton
    To understand does not mean to support or to excuse

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