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Thread: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Sen. John Ensign told The Associated Press on Wednesday that his affair with a friend's wife was a mistake but not as bad as former President Bill Clinton's relationship with a White House intern because he didn't lie about it under oath.
    I thought right wingers disapproved of moral relativism such as this. I guess not, when it's one of their own who's doing it.

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by aps View Post
    Hi. My name is John Ensign. I had an affair with a married woman, but because I didn't commit any illegal act, it's not so bad. Screw you all. (I know I did. )

    He's an asshole, and I hope his constituents vote him out of office.
    I just wanted to add that what it is that pisses me off so much is this "I did something wrong, but someone else did something worse than I did" crap.

    He had sex with a married woman and then had his parents attempt to pay her and her husband off. Yeah, he's a real stand-up guy, isn't he? Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by aps View Post
    Hi. My name is John Ensign. I had an affair with a married woman, but because I didn't commit any illegal act, it's not so bad. Screw you all. (I know I did. )

    He's an asshole, and I hope his constituents vote him out of office.
    I hope his constituents vote him out. I'm conflicted on whether he should step down. There are slight differences to this and Clinton.

    My issue with Clinton was not the affair, but the fact it was a subordinant. I consider this much like a CEO in a company using his position to sleep with secretary. Its professionally inappropriate and a conflict of interests. If a CEO of a company screws around with a mistress I think that's bad image wise for the company, but I wouldn't be calling for the CEO's resignation. If the CEO was banging away on his secretary during work hours in his office, then I would be.

    Similarly, in Clinton's case, it was with a subordinant employee in his position as the President, in his office, during work hours. If he was just banging out Monica, the chick from Starbucks, I'd have been disappointed in our President but not calling out for resignation or investigation.

    That bothered me, greatly. He's was getting a blowjob on Tax Payer dime.

    I was going to say that was different than Ensign and thus I don't mind him not resigning, since the OP just said it was a friend of his wife. However, it appears it was a campaign staffer. This conflicts things for me a bit. In this case, it is a subordinate to him. However, it is one that is not under him in some form in his capacity as Senator. So that situation gets tricky.

    But I guess that is me trying to explain why the Clinton thing is "different" in my eyes than some of the others that have happened. Its partially due to years of being in an organization where those at the top have a good bit of sway and power over those under them, either forcefully or just out of respect, and how important it has been ingrained in us that you do not take advantage of that. I don't care if he's dipping his Slick Willie into a warmer location (Seriously, look and listen to Hillary, its hard to blame him)...I have issues with him doing it in the office of the President with a woman that is his subordinant that is there due to a opening serving on behalf of the American people. I feel the same way if a Republican senator or Governor did it with an employee of the state under them (for example, foley's thing with a page...I have issue with that, because that page is technially a subordinant of him in his capacity as a congressman)

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    My issue with Clinton was not the affair, but the fact it was a subordinant. I consider this much like a CEO in a company using his position to sleep with secretary. Its professionally inappropriate and a conflict of interests. If a CEO of a company screws around with a mistress I think that's bad image wise for the company, but I wouldn't be calling for the CEO's resignation. If the CEO was banging away on his secretary during work hours in his office, then I would be.
    The biggest issue I had with Clinton was that he committed perjury over the matter.

    I thought then and I thought now that if Bill Clinton had stood up in front of everyone and said "yes, Ms Lewinsky gave me a blowjob in the Oval Office" rather than saying "I did not have sex with that woman....Ms Lewinsky", the issue would have been off the front page in a matter of days.

    Instead he lied under oath and attempted to cover the whole thing up. I don't mind a President with an active and freshly slicked willie. I do mind Presidential perjury.

    So far, I have not read where Ensign broke any laws. I'm not certain he even violated any of the Senate ethics' rules, although some of the money transactions between him and his ex mistress do bear scrutiny on that level. There is nothing to suggest that he should resign now or be ousted from the Senate.

    Re-election is a matter for folks in his state. I know I wouldn't vote for him.

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    I hope his constituents vote him out. I'm conflicted on whether he should step down. There are slight differences to this and Clinton.

    My issue with Clinton was not the affair, but the fact it was a subordinant. I consider this much like a CEO in a company using his position to sleep with secretary. Its professionally inappropriate and a conflict of interests. If a CEO of a company screws around with a mistress I think that's bad image wise for the company, but I wouldn't be calling for the CEO's resignation. If the CEO was banging away on his secretary during work hours in his office, then I would be.

    Similarly, in Clinton's case, it was with a subordinant employee in his position as the President, in his office, during work hours. If he was just banging out Monica, the chick from Starbucks, I'd have been disappointed in our President but not calling out for resignation or investigation.

    That bothered me, greatly. He's was getting a blowjob on Tax Payer dime.

    I was going to say that was different than Ensign and thus I don't mind him not resigning, since the OP just said it was a friend of his wife. However, it appears it was a campaign staffer. This conflicts things for me a bit. In this case, it is a subordinate to him. However, it is one that is not under him in some form in his capacity as Senator. So that situation gets tricky.

    But I guess that is me trying to explain why the Clinton thing is "different" in my eyes than some of the others that have happened. Its partially due to years of being in an organization where those at the top have a good bit of sway and power over those under them, either forcefully or just out of respect, and how important it has been ingrained in us that you do not take advantage of that. I don't care if he's dipping his Slick Willie into a warmer location (Seriously, look and listen to Hillary, its hard to blame him)...I have issues with him doing it in the office of the President with a woman that is his subordinant that is there due to a opening serving on behalf of the American people. I feel the same way if a Republican senator or Governor did it with an employee of the state under them (for example, foley's thing with a page...I have issue with that, because that page is technially a subordinant of him in his capacity as a congressman)
    I understand what you're saying. While I think it's normal to compare situation X to situation Y, it tends to show a lack of remorse by the person who committed situation X. He could ahve apologized and moved on. Don't apologize and then say, "But someone else did something worse than I did." Come on. It's like a drunk driver who seriously injures a person and tells the family, "Hey, other drunk drivers have killed their victims."

    Unquestionably what Clinton did was illegal (lying under oath).

    I don't have any opinion right now on whether he should resign. I don't feel strongly either way.

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Oh, no, I agree with you. Ensign walked into a pile of dog doo there and decided ot make it better by smearing it all over his hand.

    I'm just saying from my own point. Even without the perjury I would've been fine with calling for Clinton's resignation (but not pushing for his impeachment). The perjury is the reason I'm fine wtih the push for impeachment. In this case, I don't quite know if my standard for wanting to call for a politician to resign (if he was even in my state) was met.

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Oh, no, I agree with you. Ensign walked into a pile of dog doo there and decided ot make it better by smearing it all over his hand.

    I'm just saying from my own point. Even without the perjury I would've been fine with calling for Clinton's resignation (but not pushing for his impeachment). The perjury is the reason I'm fine wtih the push for impeachment. In this case, I don't quite know if my standard for wanting to call for a politician to resign (if he was even in my state) was met.
    I understand. I don't find Ensign asking for Clinton's resignation and not resigning to be (1) a problem or (2) hypocritical. I think we can all make judgments on people but can see the situation differently when we are put in a similar situation.

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Their own fault. Lefties don't go around preaching morality, right wingers do.
    Of, course, they DO go around saying things like "we'll have the most ethical [White House, Congress, etc.] in history."
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Their own fault. Lefties don't go around preaching morality, right wingers do.




    I love when liberals use selfownage....
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    Re: Ensign: I did nothing "legally" wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Of, course, they DO go around saying things like "we'll have the most ethical [White House, Congress, etc.] in history."
    To different things. Nice attempt to derail the thread.
    PeteEU

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