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Series of Blasts in Baghdad Kill 58, Injure 300

bub

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BAGHDAD — Iraqi police and medical officials say that a series of explosions have struck Baghdad, killing at least 58 people and wounding nearly 300 others.

The attacks in the Iraqi capital started shortly after 10 a.m. on Wednesday, striking near first near the finance ministry in northern Baghdad and then minutes later, near the foreign ministry next to the heavily fortified Green Zone.

The officials say the deadliest blast was a car bomb explosion near the foreign ministry, which killed dozens and wounded hundreds. The officials say the toll is expected to climb.

Series of Blasts in Baghdad Kill 58, Injure 300 - Iraq | War | Map - FOXNews.com

I believed the war was won since 2003!!

Mission-accomplished.jpg
 
Weeeeeeeeeeee, Bush is the devil.

Not the Islamic assholes killing randomly in Iraq who can not, will not, just consent to the democratic process Bush made happen.

Bush has had more faith in the Iraqi people than any Islamic fudemantalist has ever had.
 
Weeeeeeeeeeee, Bush is the devil.

Not the Islamic assholes killing randomly in Iraq who can not, will not, just consent to the democratic process Bush made happen.

Bush has had more faith in the Iraqi people than any Islamic fudemantalist has ever had.

It shows that you can bomb a country during 5 years, kill its dictator, kill thousands of terrorists and do whatever you want, you can't impose democracy on people who have never had any experience with democracy.

The day they want a democracy, they'll make their own revolution.
 
Was the very first thing you thought, when you heard of this, "cool! I'm going to post that pic of Bush again!!!"?
 
Was the very first thing you thought, when you heard of this, "cool! I'm going to post that pic of Bush again!!!"?

I hesitated with this one

osama-mission-accomplished-01.jpg
 
It shows that you can bomb a country during 5 years, kill its dictator, kill thousands of terrorists and do whatever you want, you can't impose democracy on people who have never had any experience with democracy.

The day they want a democracy, they'll make their own revolution.

Ever heard of the Oklahoma City bombing? Go home Bub, you're talking out of your ass.
 

Well, glad you've got such amazing class and tact as to use the death of 50 people to simply spout out yet another "Bush said mission accomplished!" line. Classy Bub.

But yes, huge voter turnout for the "imposed" democracy that's on them can be ignored...lone acts of a minority of people killing themselves in hopes of intimidating people away from such thing is DEFINITELY a better indication of what the country really wants. And we all know that when you're not in the middle of a war that there's zero chance that any kind of death or explosion can happen...I mean, that'd be terrorism right? I mean, Israel whose not at war is a peaceful happy go lucky place of lollipops and rainbows because there couldn't possibly be terrorist attacks while not at war. And 9/11 didn't actually happen in the world according to bub because the U.S. had long ended any war it was in and of course we can't have people doing a terrorist attack during non-war time.
 
Well, glad you've got such amazing class and tact as to use the death of 50 people to simply spout out yet another "Bush said mission accomplished!" line. Classy Bub.

But yes, huge voter turnout for the "imposed" democracy that's on them can be ignored...lone acts of a minority of people killing themselves in hopes of intimidating people away from such thing is DEFINITELY a better indication of what the country really wants. And we all know that when you're not in the middle of a war that there's zero chance that any kind of death or explosion can happen...I mean, that'd be terrorism right? I mean, Israel whose not at war is a peaceful happy go lucky place of lollipops and rainbows because there couldn't possibly be terrorist attacks while not at war. And 9/11 didn't actually happen in the world according to bub because the U.S. had long ended any war it was in and of course we can't have people doing a terrorist attack during non-war time.

Hey if you're unhappy because I post a story that shows that Iraq is as chaotic as 5 years ago, go create a rule about that

Yeah ok it was not extremely classy to post that picture of Bush, but my point was simply to show that many people believe that the war in Iraq is being won while it's obivously not the case
 
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Hey if you're unhappy because I post a story that shows that Iraq is as chaotic as 5 years ago, go create a rule about that

Wow, passive aggressive much?

No, I think it was classless and tactless, and a rather ****ty job at stirring any actual discussion on the matter. I didn't think it should be against the rules. I think Miikey's posts hurt my brain to read but I'm not running off to suggest rules against them. Some posts are just idiotic and crappy.

Your story wasn't an issue, I didn't speak negatively about the story. the story was good. I spoke to your commentary on the story, which crappy.

Yeah ok it was not extremely classy to post that picture of Bush, but my point was simply to show that many people believe that the war in Iraq is being won while it's obivously not the case

Your point was a poor one.

A terrorist attack in a fledgling nation does not prove the war is not won, that strains credibility, logic, and fact. Is Israel currently at war with anyone? Not to my knowledge, yet there's terrorist attacks often. Was the U.S. at war with someone during the U.S.S. Cole or 9/11?

Well, wait, I heard the Taliban may've got some financing from people in Britian....and we previously were at war with Britian.....**** folks, sorry, my bad, we're no longer Americans, apparently based on the World according to Bub we're still fighting the Revolutionary War. Damn, so much for thinking I was an American all these years.

Yeah, sorry Bub, your logic is horrible there and just doesn't stand up to reason and that was only one of the issues with your inane post.

Next was you trying to capitalize on 5 year old quote that had been acknowledged was too early to have been stated. Woo! Congratulations! You told us something we knew 4 years ago, that the "Mission Accomplished" statement was too early. Wow, how astute of you. Great job. We would've all missed that.

However, currently, the Presidents statements there would be correct. We are out of the period of major combat operation. There majority of the country is far more at rest then it was during the height of the war, the amount of attacks happening are lower, and far more of the country is controlled. It is much closer to a "police action" at the moment than any kind of "war" at the moment. So while yes, the President's statement was premature...something known by most long before your great revelation...your attempt to use it in this context is rather poor since now we are most assuredly outside of the period of "major combat operation".

Your third rather erronious notion was droning on that this somehow "shows" that the attempt in Iraq was a failure and that the people don't want an "imposed" democracy. However, repeated heavy election turnout, such as in February where voter turnout was beyond expectations with little violence seems to counter this notion that its simply "imposed" on them, that they don't want it, and a single idiot blowing himself up somehow proves that it can't work.

No, Bub, what it shows is that some fringe lunatics can become so deluded and manipulated by those above them to blow themselves up to kill their countrymen, or in many cases non-countrymen, in hopes of intimidating them away from something they want.

Glad you apparently gleeful at seeing such actions taking place.
 
It shows that you can bomb a country during 5 years, kill its dictator, kill thousands of terrorists and do whatever you want, you can't impose democracy on people who have never had any experience with democracy.

The day they want a democracy, they'll make their own revolution.


The idea that democracy can be imposed is a form of racist and imperialist condescension.

Democracy is a process, it has no pre conceived ideology, it only works if the people involved participate; democracy can not be imposed because it is the will of the people of that place, culture and time.

That so many on the Left no longer believe other people should decide their own destiny as we do, well, this is a form of imperialism the Left is complacent in, yet so self righteously blind they can not recognize.
 
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It shows that you can bomb a country during 5 years, kill its dictator, kill thousands of terrorists and do whatever you want, you can't impose democracy on people who have never had any experience with democracy.

The day they want a democracy, they'll make their own revolution.




You forgot, "tell the enemy we are leaving in 18 months", then ignore Iraq.....
 
Your point was a poor one.

A terrorist attack in a fledgling nation does not prove the war is not won, that strains credibility, logic, and fact. Is Israel currently at war with anyone? Not to my knowledge, yet there's terrorist attacks often. Was the U.S. at war with someone during the U.S.S. Cole or 9/11?

Well, wait, I heard the Taliban may've got some financing from people in Britian....and we previously were at war with Britian.....**** folks, sorry, my bad, we're no longer Americans, apparently based on the World according to Bub we're still fighting the Revolutionary War. Damn, so much for thinking I was an American all these years.

Yeah, sorry Bub, your logic is horrible there and just doesn't stand up to reason and that was only one of the issues with your inane post.

It depends on what you call "victory"! The objectives of this war weren't very clear, so
- if the goal was to remove Saddam Hussein, then yes, it's a victory
- if the goal was to make the USA safer, yes, now we're sure that Iraq doesn't have WMD's, but the invasion made Iran build its own WMD's
- if the goal was to replace a dictatorship by a democracy, yes, there have been elections, but I'm not sure Iraq will stay democratic a long time after the US troop withdraw
- if the goal was to pacify Iraq, then I don't think it's a victory, since there are massive terrorist attacks nearly every month




Next was you trying to capitalize on 5 year old quote that had been acknowledged was too early to have been stated. Woo! Congratulations! You told us something we knew 4 years ago, that the "Mission Accomplished" statement was too early. Wow, how astute of you. Great job. We would've all missed that.

However, currently, the Presidents statements there would be correct. We are out of the period of major combat operation. There majority of the country is far more at rest then it was during the height of the war, the amount of attacks happening are lower, and far more of the country is controlled. It is much closer to a "police action" at the moment than any kind of "war" at the moment. So while yes, the President's statement was premature...something known by most long before your great revelation...your attempt to use it in this context is rather poor since now we are most assuredly outside of the period of "major combat operation".

Did you know that 98% of the casualties in the Iraq war have occured after the end of the "height of the war"?



Your third rather erronious notion was droning on that this somehow "shows" that the attempt in Iraq was a failure and that the people don't want an "imposed" democracy. However, repeated heavy election turnout, such as in February where voter turnout was beyond expectations with little violence seems to counter this notion that its simply "imposed" on them, that they don't want it, and a single idiot blowing himself up somehow proves that it can't work.

No, Bub, what it shows is that some fringe lunatics can become so deluded and manipulated by those above them to blow themselves up to kill their countrymen, or in many cases non-countrymen, in hopes of intimidating them away from something they want.

Do you really think I'm the only one saying that democracy won't work in Iraq? Do you know that there are many factors favorizing democracy, and that none of them is present in Iraq?

As for the attacks, you're talking about this attack as if it was a single and isolated event that is not so important, while according to some sources there are over 100 victims and that these attacks occur regularly? Of course there are less attacks than in 2007, but do you think things will calm down when the US troops withdraw?!
 
Democracy is a process, it has no pre conceived ideology, it only works if the people involved participate; democracy can not be imposed because it is the will of the people of that place, culture and time.

Yes and the people of that culture have never had prior experience with a real democracy so it's not gonna work

+ the people of this place are divided, so it's not gonna work neither

+ the people of that place rely upon oil, they do not have any middle class, so it's not gonna work




That so many on the Left no longer believe other people should decide their own destiny as we do, well, this is a form of imperialism the Left is complacent in, yet so self righteously blind they can not recognize.

what are you talking about? That does not make any sense
 
Quite the argument going here. I think the escalation in violence is unfortunate. However, all knew that there would be pains when the U.S. troops began pulling-out. Many assert that Iraq can not stand on its own, but I look at it like a kid learning to ride a bike. If you never let go of the seat, the child will never learn to ride on his/her own. Same in Iraq. If the government does not learn to control it's own territory, it never will. I am not saying the U.S. should totally give-up on Iraq, but just as the parent, be there in case the child is severely injured, so we should be for our fledgling democracy.
 
It shows that you can bomb a country during 5 years, kill its dictator, kill thousands of terrorists and do whatever you want, you can't impose democracy on people who have never had any experience with democracy.

The day they want a democracy, they'll make their own revolution.
Good day for your side, eh? :roll:


.
 
Good day for your side, eh? :roll:


.

And where exactly did I say that I was against the idea of democracy in Iraq? I just said it's not likely to happen.
 
And where exactly did I say that I was against the idea of democracy in Iraq? I just said it's not likely to happen.

You argument is a strong one. The culture of the Middle East is one that strongly runs counter to "Western-style democracy," in every way. It is a tribal culture and very, very patriarchal, and that is why nothing but monarchs and tyrants have been successful there. The factionalism is a major roadblock to the success of Iraq, and that is one reason I agreed with Biden back in 2004, when he argued that Iraq should be made into a federal model with states for each of the sects. That would have allowed for a unified Iraq, while helping ease some of the tensions between factions. The only hope that I have, is that once the troops are out, Iraqi's will no longer be able to blame the U.S. for the attacks in their country and will then see they must stand-up for themselves, just as many in Pakistan have done against the Taliban.
 
And where exactly did I say that I was against the idea of democracy in Iraq? I just said it's not likely to happen.
You sounded pretty giddy about the bombings. Your post sounded like a bunch of people being killed is of little consequence if it proves you were right all along.


.
 
You sounded pretty giddy about the bombings. Your post sounded like a bunch of people being killed is of little consequence if it proves you were right all along.


.

Ah sorry, didn't want to sound like that
 
Sssshhhhhhhhh, it's health care. We've successfully forgotten about Iraq so that we're not reminded that somehow we're still there and that it's still ****ed.
 
Sssshhhhhhhhh, it's health care. We've successfully forgotten about Iraq so that we're not reminded that somehow we're still there and that it's still ****ed.

yeah no one talks about Iraq anymore! 2 years ago this forum was full of people talking about that war
 
Sssshhhhhhhhh, it's health care. We've successfully forgotten about Iraq so that we're not reminded that somehow we're still there and that it's still ****ed.
What's the point here?
 
The debate seems to have died down when conservatives started to claim that the war was won. Most folks of any political stripe are pretty comfortable with honoring our commitment to the Iraqi government to leave at this point.

Until there is some noticeable sense of unease around that timeline (originally created by the Bush admin), I don't see much of a debate for most people.
 
It's a good thing we pulled our forces out of the towns when we did. The sooner we can evac the theater, the sooner the violence can accelerate. Leaving is such a great idea at this point. Hell, the sooner we leave, the quicker things will fall completely to pieces and the sooner we can go back and start all over again.
 
What's the point here?

The point is that we've used the healthcare "debate" to forget things like the wars which are going on, the secret prisons which still exist, the use of torture which still goes on, the spying and warrantless taps which still goes on. Trying to forget all this crap is still going on so we don't debate it. Forget all the nasty stuff the government is doing, the power it's taking, the lives its costing, the money its wasting. Just get distracted by the healthcare debate which is going nowhere but in circles and don't look over to the Middle East where we're still there, still fighting, still haven't gotten to a conclusion. Just forget about it, move along...nothing to see here.

It's more of a point, in short, that say bringing up Timothy McVeigh.
 
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