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Thread: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

  1. #71
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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    You're not supposed to point out that conservatives and republicans have stated alternatives. Then, when you do point that out, they'll complain how they've not tried to pass any legitimate legislation on it since this started while completely ignoring the fact that doing so would be a futile waste of time since the republicans are in a large minority and any bill would essentially be DOA.
    That almost makes it sound as though I flat out denied the Republicans had forwarded alternatives at all, but I'm sure you wouldn't be that disgenous. What they did was present some sketches and prostrate themselves for being the abused minority party, pretty much just so they could claim afterwards that they were not the party of no ideas. That might fly by people with short attention spans, but they receive no credit from me. Now if you can come up with a reason for why they deserve credit other than they technically did something (nowhere near what they were capable of doing), Iíll submit defeat on that point.

    As it is, the constitution of the Democratic Party and Republican policy history suggests there was much more they could have done, had they been genuinely interested in securing the best possible policy change on their terms. As it is, that has not been their focus. They don't care about the issues at stake anymore than they did during the Bush Administration when everyone was fretting about them but nobody was doing anything about them.

    You really need to check your statistics.

    If folks are disappearing from the "middle class", it's because they are getting richer, not poorer. Poverty rates overall have been declining for decades.
    Ö I donít know what measurements you are going by. Iíll assume they have adjusted for the soaring middle class debt (sarcasm Ė Iím not really going to assume that at all). Also, there was an explosion in middle class toward the beginning of the second half of the 20th century which would Ďoverallí tip the scales toward an increase, but thatís as trivial as it is true.

    But I'm more enjoying watching Morality Games being filled with the essence of GWB and channeling him in perfect "With us or against us" rhetoric.
    Yeah, that's what I said.

    First of all, the more the Republicans don't engage on the issue, the happier I am. That decreases the number of influences dividing the Democratic Party and thus toning down the strength of the reform. I don't want them with me -- against me is really what I expect and what I want. I've stated again and again on many threads that I think attempting to be bipartisan with Republicans is a colossal waste of time.

    But speaking on theoretical grounds, as salaried public officials who represent constituencies and have a duty to address budgetary concerns, they are responsible for their lack of engagement.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 08-19-09 at 03:30 PM.

  2. #72
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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    agree wholeheartedly. thanks!

    Originally Posted by johnny_rebson:

    These are the same liberals who forgot how Iraq attacked us on 9/11.


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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    From Day 1 the Republicans drew a line in the sand and said "We are the party of no"....be it with the Stimulus and a host of other issues. This is no different.
    This is again a massive lie propagated by Liberals who have no desire to deal honestly with what has been happening.

    It begs the question; why do Liberals and some Democrats spew such a preposterous lie in a vacuum of the facts, the truth and honesty?

    Here's a question for Liberals; why is it that during Bush's Presidency Liberals and Democrats spent every waking moment claiming the deficit was irresponsible and that Bush needed to raise taxes, yet now with massive deficits beyond any we have seen in our history not one peep from Liberals and Democrats about raising everyone's taxes.

    The notion that this administration is capable of doing what NO other administration has done or can do in reality, that is to SAVE so much they wont have to raise taxes, requires willful denial beyond logical reasoning.

    Let's face it; this party is so corrupt and incompetent that it cannot even begin extracting itself from it's own lies and distortions.

    Read my lips people; ONE POINT EIGHT TRILLION and CLIMBING. There is no revenue increasing with this economic decline and the efforts by these MORONS are only going to cause further losses in Government revenue.

    The Democrats KNOW this is what is happening, they KNOW that if they were to be honest and RAISE taxes it will cause them to lose even MORE seats in Congress than they are already facing and therefore they want to broom this under the carpet until after the mid-term elections.

    Those are the FACTS and that is the TRUTH in these debates. The FACT that Obama is avoiding an honest discussion about how he will pay for the already massive deficits we have now on top of the additional massive deficits a Government option health plan will cause speaks VOLUMES to the American people of how low Liberals and their Democrat allies have sunk and why they have to demagogue their political opponents rather than engage in honest discourse.


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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    There's absolutely no point in trying to negotiate with the "party of no".
    Have the liberals considered offering a plan that Republicans might support?
    That is, after all, what bi-partisanship is.

    No matter how hard you try, you cannot get past the fact that if The Obama's plan fails, it is because the DEMOCRATS failed to pass it.

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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    insuperable problems still remaining with obamacare, even after the elimination of "death panels" and the "public option"

    ask baucus, conrad, durbin, bill clinton, mccaskill, bayh, lincoln, landrieu, pryor, dorgan...

    ask bluedogs, freshmen, democrat governors (bill richardson, bill ritter, phil bredesen, christine gregoire), CBO...

    1. it FINES individuals caught breathing without insurance

    2. it forces individuals who can't afford it in the first place to purchase coverage for themselves, hardly the help they were promised

    3. it includes massive cuts to medicare and medicaid, alienating seniors

    4. it includes coverage of illegals, per the killing of heller in rangel's ways and means, july 17, which would have enforced use of e-verify to ensure only citizens receive coverage

    5. it generalizes funding of abortion, bluedog bugaboo

    6. it taxes small biz 8% if they don't insure their workers, either route sure to kill thousands of small companies currently barely afloat in today's troubled clime

    7. it looks to end of life costs for scary savings, once more freaking out our seniors

    8. it taxes benefits, the kerry cadillac clause, which measure murdered mccain during campaign

    9. it "surcharges" incomes over 250G, 350 for couples, politically problematic

    10. it bends the cost curve the wrong way, says the mathematician, elmendorf, at cbo

    sorry

  6. #76
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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Have the liberals considered offering a plan that Republicans might support?
    That is, after all, what bi-partisanship is.

    No matter how hard you try, you cannot get past the fact that if The Obama's plan fails, it is because the DEMOCRATS failed to pass it.

    Yes Goob...they have tried and when they did, the Party of No walked away again. THAT is the entire point of the article. The Party of No has made it clear that they are not interested in any type of bi-partisan bill.

    So as a result...that's why I say "screw em".

    As for your final contention...we agree. I'm not and have never tried to get "past" the fact that if Obama's plan fails it is because of the Democrats.

    The Democrats can get this done without a single Republican vote. Americans put the Democrats into power to get something done. If the Dems fail to recognize this and don't take advantage of the political capital that they were given by the voters, then they don't deserve to be a majority party.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Yes Goob...they have tried and when they did...
    Specifically, what plan did they offer, and how was it something that a Republican, being Republican, could support?

    THAT is the entire point of the article. The Party of No has made it clear that they are not interested in any type of bi-partisan bill.
    Remember that "bi-partisan" doesnt mean "accept/support our plan" it means "a plan that both sides can support".

    So as a result...that's why I say "screw em".
    Not a surprise -- its MUCH better to force your ideology on others, rather than work out a comprimise.

    As for your final contention...we agree. I'm not and have never tried to get "past" the fact that if Obama's plan fails it is because of the Democrats.

    The Democrats can get this done without a single Republican vote. Americans put the Democrats into power to get something done. If the Dems fail to recognize this and don't take advantage of the political capital that they were given by the voters, then they don't deserve to be a majority party.
    Good for you!

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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Yes Goob...they have tried and when they did, the Party of No walked away again. THAT is the entire point of the article. The Party of No has made it clear that they are not interested in any type of bi-partisan bill.

    So as a result...that's why I say "screw em".

    As for your final contention...we agree. I'm not and have never tried to get "past" the fact that if Obama's plan fails it is because of the Democrats.

    The Democrats can get this done without a single Republican vote. Americans put the Democrats into power to get something done. If the Dems fail to recognize this and don't take advantage of the political capital that they were given by the voters, then they don't deserve to be a majority party.


    Go for it... in 2010 Mickey mouse will beat any lib running... Goofy will be able to kick Barry's ass come 2012.... Go for it, what's stopping you libs, no guts?

  9. #79
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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    Go for it... in 2010 Mickey mouse will beat any lib running... Goofy will be able to kick Barry's ass come 2012.... Go for it, what's stopping you libs, no guts?
    Sad thing is, the right wingers make these statements at the expense of proper policy discussion and really work done by our elected officials. It's about politics and power, not about the American people.
    It's time for a revolution in our country. Not a revolution forged with guns and bombs but a revolution forged of compassion and altruism. A revolution that extends a hand to those who don't have and who cannot. A revolution that makes Health Care available to all those in the US.

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    Re: Analysis: Liberals tired of healthcare compromises [edited]

    Quote Originally Posted by formerroadie View Post
    Sad thing is, the right wingers make these statements at the expense of proper policy discussion and really work done by our elected officials. It's about politics and power, not about the American people.
    Right wingers as you put it are tired of you socialists telling us you want bipartisanship when all you want is to cram your stupid, country destroying crap down the American peoples throat when you know damned well they don't want it.... so vote for it, cram it down our throat.... you will own it, then all you socialists can go work for McDonalds come next election.

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