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Thread: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

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    mad Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    For me personally the system is definitely a freaking mess. For family members and friends the system is a mess. For some it works. But it fails too many for too many arbitrary reasons and has been doing so for far too long.
    The Government did such a great job running Cash for Clunkers, they'd have no problem paying for all our healthcare...right?
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Well, even before that, I'd rather there just be a general recognition that people who disagree with you politically are not automatically dumb or evil. That would be the first step toward honesty.
    Oh absolutely. It is entirely possible to disagree and talk about the disagreement in such a way as to have a pleasant discussion. I have done that with a number of conservatives on this board. The problem here is the issue is so contentious, and people want to win at all costs, that it makes it hard at times to have the conversation with a few idiots making wild claims and repeating them over and over in the face of proof that they are wrong.

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    The Government did such a great job running Cash for Clunkers, they'd have no problem paying for all our healthcare...right?
    If health care reform is as wildly successful as Cash for Clunkers, that would be a good thing. Short term programs almost always look bad, because by the time it takes to get the bugs ironed out, the program is over. With the incredible popularity of the program, and the inevitable bugs, things are running slow for dealers, but the program did exactly what it was supposed to, put more efficient vehicles on the road, and depleted carmakers inventories(which is putting me back to work Monday, just got the call today).

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Can I ask how/why?


    Hoiw/why do you say that?
    I've listed the reasons previously

    insurance tied to job causing problems switching employers
    pre-existing conditions causing severely limited access to plans
    limited access/affordability for small employers
    private insurance dropping folks with chronic debilitating diagnosis, thus these folks are dumped into the medicare/disability system

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    If health care reform is as wildly successful as Cash for Clunkers, that would be a good thing. Short term programs almost always look bad, because by the time it takes to get the bugs ironed out, the program is over. With the incredible popularity of the program, and the inevitable bugs, things are running slow for dealers, but the program did exactly what it was supposed to, put more efficient vehicles on the road, and depleted carmakers inventories(which is putting me back to work Monday, just got the call today).
    ...and just plain ran out of money, requiring them to dump more funding in almost immediately. If they can't budget a stimulus right, why in the world do you think they could budget taking care of an entire country's medical needs?

    Oh...and convincing Americans to take on debt they likely can't afford to get a few of their own tax dollars back only looks good if you failed high school math. That's not a success in my book.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    I've listed the reasons previously

    insurance tied to job causing problems switching employers
    pre-existing conditions causing severely limited access to plans
    I mentioned this in another thread. My brother was diagnosed with cancer before the age of 30. He is in full remission right now(thank god, he was at one time given a 5 % chance to live past 90 days), but remission is not the same thing as cured. His cancer could come back at any time. As such, this is a pre-existing condition, which makes his desire to change jobs really difficult.

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    ...and just plain ran out of money, requiring them to dump more funding in almost immediately. If they can't budget a stimulus right, why in the world do you think they could budget taking care of an entire country's medical needs?

    Oh...and convincing Americans to take on debt they likely can't afford to get a few of their own tax dollars back only looks good if you failed high school math. That's not a success in my book.
    The reason the plan ran out of money is because it was wildly popular. Damn that Obama for coming up with a massively popular program!

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    The reason the plan ran out of money is because it was wildly popular. Damn that Obama for coming up with a massively popular program!
    Exactly...they had no idea what they were doing. I never said it was unpopular, just that, like government run healthcare, it was a terrible idea.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    I've listed the reasons previously
    insurance tied to job causing problems switching employers
    pre-existing conditions causing severely limited access to plans
    limited access/affordability for small employers
    private insurance dropping folks with chronic debilitating diagnosis, thus these folks are dumped into the medicare/disability system
    All of these things are rooted in the idea that the health care is a business, and that businesses exist to make a profit.

    And so, I'm not sure how these things indicate a "problem", with the "only" solution found in government.

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    Re: FACT CHECK: White House ignores health concession

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    Exactly...they had no idea what they were doing. I never said it was unpopular, just that, like government run healthcare, it was a terrible idea.
    Apparently they had some idea what they where doing, they managed to create a very successful and popular program. So successful and popular, it exceeded expectations. Welcome to the real world where that does happen, and is almost always a happy event.

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