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Thread: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

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    Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    They dropped it, because they go caught with their hand in the cookie jar, not because the provision would be misinterpreted...LOL!!

    There's a bunch more crap in the bill that's going to have to go, before the heat will die down.


    The Senate Finance Committee will drop a controversial provision on consultations for end-of-life care from its proposed healthcare bill, its top Republican member said Thursday.

    The committee, which has worked on putting together a bipartisan healthcare reform bill, will drop the controversial provision after it was derided by conservatives as "death panels" to encourage euthanasia.

    "On the Finance Committee, we are working very hard to avoid unintended consequences by methodically working through the complexities of all of these issues and policy options," Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) said in a statement. "We dropped end-of-life provisions from consideration entirely because of the way they could be misinterpreted and implemented incorrectly."

    TheHill.com - Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Seriously, what is it with you hard core right wingers. You took a provision that would have done nothing more than paid physicians for the time they spent with Medicare recipients discussing end of life issues and turned that into government "death panels" deciding who will live and who will die.

    First off, the only occasion I can think of off of the top of my head where the federal government attempted to involved itself in the end of life decisions of a private individual was when the Republicans did it with Terri Schiavo, the brain dead woman in Florida.

    However, more to the point, if someone was to actually believe that the federal government would institute government death panels that would essentially weed out unproductive seniors, then they would have to believe that Washington Democrats and President Obama are quite literally on the same level with Joesph Stalin. Aside from being offensive, its irrational to the point of being truly psychotic. Seriously, you guys have taken a guy that is by all accounts a decent man, a good husband, and a wonderful father and turned him into Joesph Stalin, an unconscionable sociopathic dictator out to murder your grandparents and sick children......... All because you disagree with him.

    Bad ideas does not equal evil person. If this health care debate has accomplished anything, its demonstrated how much we have neglected mental health care in this country as its truly an epidemic right now. Seriously, if you think that Obama is on the level of Joesph Stalin, and with this loony death panel bull**** you obviously do, then you need to check with your insurance providers and see which anti-psychotics are on the coverage list for you.
    Last edited by SouthernDemocrat; 08-13-09 at 07:30 PM.
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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Seriously, what is it with you hard core right wingers. You took a provision that would have done nothing more than paid physicians for the time they spent with Medicare recipients discussing end of life issues and turned that into government "death panels" deciding who will live and who will die.
    I'm having a hard time believing that it's as simple as paying a doc for spending time talking to a elderly patient with one foot in the grave. Did you read the section, at all?

    One has to wonder, though, how the healthcare bill that will be the savior of the nation has to have a section written into it that says doctors are going to paid for end of life counseling. One would think that would be an understood thing. Is there a provision in the bill that allows doctors to be paid for cancer treatment counceling? What about abortion counceling?

    No, I believe the section was what Palin said it was. No one has yet proved otherwise, with actual documentation from the bill. In fact, I haven't seen the first post by a supporter of the bill that includes actual language from the bill to prove themselves right. Why is that, ya reckon?

    However, more to the point, if someone was to actually believe that the federal government would institute government death panels that would essentially weed out unproductive seniors, then they would have to believe that Washington Democrats and President Obama are quite literally on the same level with Joesph Stalin. Aside from being offensive, its irrational to the point of being truly psychotic. Seriously, you guys have taken a guy that is by all accounts a decent man, a good husband, and a wonderful father and turned him into Joesph Stalin, an unconscionable sociopathic dictator out to murder your grandparents and sick children......... All because you disagree with him.
    Zeke Emanual is all for that exact kind of thing. He's going to be ramrodding the healthcare system. Isn't he?
    Last edited by apdst; 08-13-09 at 07:35 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    They dropped it, because they go caught with their hand in the cookie jar, not because the provision would be misinterpreted...LOL!!

    There's a bunch more crap in the bill that's going to have to go, before the heat will die down.
    SCOOP!!!

    HUGE breaking news, apdst!

    thanks!

    EXTREMELY MEANINGFUL!

    baucus is the GATEWAY

    grassley's got the ball right now

    this occurrence happened STRAIGHT in the GATE

    obliged

    how anyone could "blame" this on republicans

    LOLOLOL!

    must not OWN a tv

    why, GRASSLEY's trying to RESCUE this FOO

    hello

    he BETTER NOT

    he'll get CRUCIFIED by his OWN

    the blues can't ditch this bitch fast enough

    THEY'RE the ONES

    and you'd also be as ABSURDLY off the mark pointing your tattle tell tally at them too

    NOT AFTER WHAT THE IDIOT IN THE WHITE HOUSE HAS PUT THEM THRU

    for antenna's sake, LAND

    it's called EARTH

    great SCOOP, apdst

    keep em coming

    grassley better NOT

    watch HIM

    watch him CLOSE

    cliff
    Last edited by The Prof; 08-13-09 at 08:00 PM.

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I believe the section was what Palin said it was.
    Of course you do...even though there have been numerous sources exposing her lies.

    Palin is perfect for these fanatical fringe crowds. It gives her another opportunity to preach her propoganda and rile people up to yell "kill him" and so forth.....
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I'm having a hard time believing that it's as simple as paying a doc for spending time talking to a elderly patient with one foot in the grave. Did you read the section, at all?
    Yes, I did. As did AARP, and they saw nothing at all wrong with it either.

    One has to wonder, though, how the healthcare bill that will be the savior of the nation has to have a section written into it that says doctors are going to paid for end of life counseling.
    Because even if what ever health care reform that is enacted succeeds far beyond anyone's wildest dreams, everyone will still die one day and as every family that has dealt with that with a love one knows, it is best that you make those decisions about what care you want at the end of your life rather than your family.

    One would think that would be an understood thing. Is there a provision in the bill that allows doctors to be paid for cancer treatment counceling?
    Neither Medicare or Private Insurance pays for you to just go and chat with your doctor. They pay for services and procedures. For example, if you go to the doctor after being diagnosed for cancer, your insurer is paying your doctor for the time they spend with you discussing your treatment options. Your insurer would not pay your doctor for time they spent with you discussing cancer treatment options with you if you were not diagnosed with cancer. Similarly, if you just called up your physician right now and said that you wanted to just come in for an appointment to discuss end of life issues with them and nothing more, they would tell you that your insurance will probably not cover it, and it may be out of your pocket. All this provision did was allow for doctors to offer this counseling to seniors as an optional service and file a claim with Medicare to reimburse them for their time spent with you.

    What about abortion counceling?
    Medicare does not cover abortions. Seniors being they are all well past menopause don't tend to get pregnant, much less have unintended pregnancies, thus don't tend to seek abortions.

    No, I believe the section was what Palin said it was.
    How many times is Palin going to whore her special needs child out for her personal political use? Seriously, as someone that has adopted 2 special needs children I don't get it. Its beyond shameless to whore your special needs child out there like she does and make these insane claims that the government is going to deem them unworthy of Medical treatment. For most parents, any issues their kids have is a private matter, they don't go out and shamelessly throw it out there every conceivable opportunity when they think it might benefit what ever loony argument they are trying to make. I honestly believe that the day that loon found out she found out she was having a special needs child she jumped for joy screaming "Whoo Hoo I get to have a special needs child now that I can throw out there every time I want say something stupid to America. Yeehaw, pass the moose meatloaf."

    No one has yet proved otherwise, with actual documentation from the bill. In fact, I haven't seen the first post by a supporter of the bill that includes actual language from the bill to prove themselves right. Why is that, ya reckon?
    No one other than Fact Check, the AARP, and every single responsible news outlet on earth.

    FACT CHECK: No 'death panel' in health care bill - Yahoo! News
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Of course you do...even though there have been numerous sources exposing her lies.

    Palin is perfect for these fanatical fringe crowds. It gives her another opportunity to preach her propoganda and rile people up to yell "kill him" and so forth.....
    Which sources, using actual language in the bill, have exposed Palin as a liar. I await your response with baited breath.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Seriously, what is it with you hard core right wingers. You took a provision that would have done nothing more than paid physicians for the time they spent with Medicare recipients discussing end of life issues and turned that into government "death panels" deciding who will live and who will die.

    First off, the only occasion I can think of off of the top of my head where the federal government attempted to involved itself in the end of life decisions of a private individual was when the Republicans did it with Terri Schiavo, the brain dead woman in Florida.

    However, more to the point, if someone was to actually believe that the federal government would institute government death panels that would essentially weed out unproductive seniors, then they would have to believe that Washington Democrats and President Obama are quite literally on the same level with Joesph Stalin. Aside from being offensive, its irrational to the point of being truly psychotic. Seriously, you guys have taken a guy that is by all accounts a decent man, a good husband, and a wonderful father and turned him into Joesph Stalin, an unconscionable sociopathic dictator out to murder your grandparents and sick children......... All because you disagree with him.

    Bad ideas does not equal evil person. If this health care debate has accomplished anything, its demonstrated how much we have neglected mental health care in this country as its truly an epidemic right now. Seriously, if you think that Obama is on the level of Joesph Stalin, and with this loony death panel bull**** you obviously do, then you need to check with your insurance providers and see which anti-psychotics are on the coverage list for you.
    you're the one who concedes they're BAD IDEAS

    look, there's the reality

    and then there's the politics

    the prez is responsible for both

    he must create reality

    he must manage the appearances

    ie, politics

    the prez is 1000% responsible for creating a political context that puts him in the spot of having to promise little girls that he's not gonna kill their gramma

    in the first place

    hello

    HE's the one who's called all these emergency press conferences

    HE's the one who keeps going on primetime

    HE's the one who sent his members home without any ONE single plan to defend so that they were open to every imaginable charge dreamed up by any critic in the last 25 years

    (how do you folks keep from LOL'ing? i am rolling as i write)

    HE's the one who summoned an emergency presser on friday july 17, the day after cbo/elmendorf testified in the GATE, senate finance, that the COST CURVE went the wrong way

    the next day, obama by all accounts to get the ball back, summons an emergency conference, friday the 17th

    and that's the first day i ever heard him say he was gonna get 2/3 of the money he needs from wellness/prevention and IT

    and "SAVINGS" from MEDICARE AND MEDICAID

    HE's responsible for THIS landscape

    whether gramma's gonna get guillotined or not, our SENIORS are FREAKING OUT

    and the middle aged who LOVE THEM MOST are too

    hell the freak'n oh

    look the heck around

    HE's the one who keeps bringing up END OF LIFE COSTS

    how just KILLER they are to his DAMNED DEFICIT

    going FORWARD

    in THE OUT YEARS

    you just can't do that and BE PRESIDENT at the same time

    NOT in america, anyway

    i don't know what nation you been lookin at all your life

    but obama's in KENYA, or something

    sorry

    he's TOTALLY responsible for every WRONG IDEA anyone in this entire country has cooked up

    he's INEPT

    he's responsible for a LOSER legislation

    and the worst national SALESMANSHIP any of us have ever seen

    the results are utterly predictable

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Yes, I did. As did AARP, and they saw nothing at all wrong with it either.
    Except they're now embarressed to support the bill. They started out supporting the bill, now they're afraid to show their faces in public under that same banner.



    Because even if what ever health care reform that is enacted succeeds far beyond anyone's wildest dreams, everyone will still die one day and as every family that has dealt with that with a love one knows, it is best that you make those decisions about what care you want at the end of your life rather than your family.
    You're right, there's no way out-a-here alive. But, why does there have to be a specific provision in the bill, for doctors to decided if an, "order", for retention of medical care should be given to an elderly person? That's what the section says.



    Neither Medicare or Private Insurance pays for you to just go and chat with your doctor. They pay for services and procedures. For example, if you go to the doctor after being diagnosed for cancer, your insurer is paying your doctor for the time they spend with you discussing your treatment options. Your insurer would not pay your doctor for time they spent with you discussing cancer treatment options with you if you were not diagnosed with cancer. Similarly, if you just called up your physician right now and said that you wanted to just come in for an appointment to discuss end of life issues with them and nothing more, they would tell you that your insurance will probably not cover it, and it may be out of your pocket. All this provision did was allow for doctors to offer this counseling to seniors as an optional service and file a claim with Medicare to reimburse them for their time spent with you.
    Ok, they don't pay for counceling, either. Why have a provision that only deals with end of life counceling? Why not just a section that deals with all counceling? Are there provisions elsewhere in the bill that provide for medical counceling? If so, show me. If not, then why?



    Medicare does not cover abortions. Seniors being they are all well past menopause don't tend to get pregnant, much less have unintended pregnancies, thus don't tend to seek abortions.
    This bill will cover abortions. Wouldn't it be a good idea to provide a little counceling before sticking a fork in that baby's head?



    No one other than Fact Check, the AARP, and every single responsible news outlet on earth.

    FACT CHECK: No 'death panel' in health care bill - Yahoo! News

    So, you can't use the actual bill to prove yourself right? Dontcha think there's something basically wrong with that?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Why have a provision that only deals with end of life counceling? Why not just a section that deals with all counceling?
    nice play, my friend!!!

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