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Thread: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

  1. #21
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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Here is the section you are referring to:

    (hhh)(1) Subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), the term ‘advance care planning consultation’ means a consultation between the individual and a practitioner described in paragraph (2) regarding advance care planning, if, subject to paragraph (3), the individual involved has not had such a consultation within the last 5 years. Such consultation shall include the following:

    ‘(A) An explanation by the practitioner of advance care planning, including key questions and considerations, important steps, and suggested people to talk to.
    ‘(B) An explanation by the practitioner of advance directives, including living wills and durable powers of attorney, and their uses.
    ‘(C) An explanation by the practitioner of the role and responsibilities of a health care proxy.
    ‘(D) The provision by the practitioner of a list of national and State-specific resources to assist consumers and their families with advance care planning, including the national toll-free hotline, the advance care planning clearinghouses, and State legal service organizations (including those funded through the Older Americans Act of 1965).
    9
    ‘(E) An explanation by the practitioner of the continuum of end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice, and benefits for such services and supports that are available under this title.
    ‘(F)(i) Subject to clause (ii), an explanation of orders regarding life sustaining treatment or similar orders, which shall include--
    ‘(I) the reasons why the development of such an order is beneficial to the individual and the individual’s family and the reasons why such an order should be updated periodically as the health of the individual changes;
    ‘(II) the information needed for an individual or legal surrogate to make informed decisions regarding the completion of such an order; and
    ‘(III) the identification of resources that an individual may use to determine the requirements of the State in which such individual resides so that the treatment wishes of that individual will be carried out if the individual is unable to communicate those wishes, including requirements regarding the designation of a surrogate decisionmaker (also known as a health care proxy).
    ‘(ii) The Secretary shall limit the requirement for explanations under clause (i) to consultations furnished in a State--
    ‘(I) in which all legal barriers have been addressed for enabling orders for life sustaining treatment to constitute a set of medical orders respected across all care settings; and
    ‘(II) that has in effect a program for orders for life sustaining treatment described in clause (iii).
    ‘(iii) A program for orders for life sustaining treatment for a States described in this clause is a program that--
    ‘(I) ensures such orders are standardized and uniquely identifiable throughout the State;
    ‘(II) distributes or makes accessible such orders to physicians and other health professionals that (acting within the scope of the professional’s authority under State law) may sign orders for life sustaining treatment;
    ‘(III) provides training for health care professionals across the continuum of care about the goals and use of orders for life sustaining treatment; and
    ‘(IV) is guided by a coalition of stakeholders includes representatives from emergency medical services, emergency department physicians or nurses, state long-term care association, state medical association, state surveyors, agency responsible for senior services, state department of health, state hospital association, home health association, state bar association, and state hospice association.


    Read, read it aloud if it helps it sink in, no where in that section is there anything remotely described like a government death panel deciding who lives and who dies.

    It is just like I described it earlier, nothing but a provision for physicians, specifically doctors or nurse practitioners to be paid for time they spend discussing medical end of life issues with a patient. It then states that any consultation they are given must fall under the guidelines of the state laws the physician practices in. Thats all it does. In fact, it will only pay for such a consultation with your physician once every 5 years.
    unfortunately, mom america doesn't have time to read all that crap

    the prez needed to explain himself simpler

    it's not like he didn't have the opportunity

    dang, he's on tv like every half hour

    LOL!
    Last edited by The Prof; 08-13-09 at 10:04 PM.

  2. #22
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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    nonsense

    and kinda sick---the kiddie porn images

    health care's dead, sorry

    it died when baucus first bawled in the gateway---back to the drawing board

    that was mere days before elmendorf's critical testimony concerning the cost curve, elicited in committee by kent conrad, july 16

    the next day the prez called his emergency presser and claimed he'd found 2/3 of the cost in a box ted kennedy, apparently, could never find

    it was tortured in the house

    bluedogs and progressives in rangel's committee and more particularly amongst waxman's group have just tormented it

    daschle's declaration more than a month ago that the "public option was dead" was a big moment

    daschle was gonna be the prez' missionary on meds, had the former senate leader paid his taxes

    but when durbin did what he did on sunday (cnn's john king), that was IT

    sorry

    the white house signalled surrender on the "public option"

    now they're playing for the purple co op in the portal (senate finance)

    that'd be grassley, enzi and snowe

    that's why obama called out the trio in portsmouth---grassley, enzi and snowe

    and examining the posture of the ranking member yesterday...

    everything that's gone on in pelosi's place (the house) is kaput

    ask durbin

    ask baucus

    ask elmendorf

    ask ms mccaskill, who insisted in hillsboro august 11 (just minutes after obama's michael jackson lookalike at portsmouth)

    ms mccaskill INSISTED before HER gymnasium of more AVERAGE americans

    LOLOL!

    she PLEDGED---no one's even TALKING ABOUT a public option, it's NOT ON THE TABLE, she's URGING

    what? i don't understand this room, she says

    you really think you're pursuading people by shouting out like that?

    you don't trust me?

    you want me to go home?

    ask ms mccaskill about the public option, hazlnut

    SHE vowed SHE'd never SIGN one

    1. you need to get a tv and watch it

    2. you need to focus on events in washingon, in committee and in places like hillsboro more

    3. while worrying less perhaps about the styles of other posters (tho i'm flattered)
    Your earlier work was more clever. The above effort is verbose and convoluted.

    The teenage daughter was 18. Get over it.

    BTW-- is the poetry fetish just so you don't have to post links to facts backing up your theories? Didn't think anyone would notice? You're not that interesting.


    Health care reform is dead, huh? Guess no one told PhRMA.

    Is that $150mil just for shows and giggles?

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post

    It is just like I described it earlier, nothing but a provision for physicians, specifically doctors or nurse practitioners to be paid for time they spend discussing medical end of life issues with a patient. It then states that any consultation they are given must fall under the guidelines of the state laws the physician practices in. Thats all it does. In fact, it will only pay for such a consultation with your physician once every 5 years.
    Didn't you know that living wills are part of the evil liberal plot for eugenics? Shhh, don't tell any one though.

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    Your earlier work was more clever. The above effort is verbose and convoluted.

    The teenage daughter was 18. Get over it.

    BTW-- is the poetry fetish just so you don't have to post links to facts backing up your theories? Didn't think anyone would notice? You're not that interesting.


    Health care reform is dead, huh? Guess no one told PhRMA.

    Is that $150mil just for shows and giggles?
    i have a link for every claim

    all have been posted on these pages

    appreciation for your patronage

    keep perusing The prophetic Prof, it perpetually pays off

    whatcha want?

    baucus?

    T-Word Looms Large In Health Care Cost Debate : NPR

    daschle?

    Daschle Urges Obama To Drop Federal Public Health Care Plan

    elmendorf?

    CBO Sees No Net Federal Cost Savings in Dem Health Plans - The Note

    you confuse poety with plain speech

    plain as a pane

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    but this was the biggie, last sunday, the 9th

    Another Blow To Public Option: Durbin Open To Dropping It

    huffington doesn't cover the story as well as fox, but i thought you'd prefer her as your source

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Didn't you know that living wills are part of the evil liberal plot for eugenics? Shhh, don't tell any one though.
    Too bad Sec. 1233 doesn't mention living wills, not even once.

    Come on, guys! Dammit, I know there's someone that can use a hunderd dollar bill. If you're all so damned correct on what the bill says, then this should be over already.

    There's enough folks on this forum that don't like me, to suggest that I'm wrong, even if only a little; even some Connies. This just shouldn't be all that hard for such obvious information.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  7. #27
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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Here is the section you are referring to:

    (hhh)(1) Subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), the term ‘advance care planning consultation’ means a consultation between the individual and a practitioner described in paragraph (2) regarding advance care planning, if, subject to paragraph (3), the individual involved has not had such a consultation within the last 5 years. Such consultation shall include the following:

    ‘(A) An explanation by the practitioner of advance care planning, including key questions and considerations, important steps, and suggested people to talk to.
    ‘(B) An explanation by the practitioner of advance directives, including living wills and durable powers of attorney, and their uses.
    ‘(C) An explanation by the practitioner of the role and responsibilities of a health care proxy.
    ‘(D) The provision by the practitioner of a list of national and State-specific resources to assist consumers and their families with advance care planning, including the national toll-free hotline, the advance care planning clearinghouses, and State legal service organizations (including those funded through the Older Americans Act of 1965).
    9
    ‘(E) An explanation by the practitioner of the continuum of end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice, and benefits for such services and supports that are available under this title.
    ‘(F)(i) Subject to clause (ii), an explanation of orders regarding life sustaining treatment or similar orders, which shall include--
    ‘(I) the reasons why the development of such an order is beneficial to the individual and the individual’s family and the reasons why such an order should be updated periodically as the health of the individual changes;
    ‘(II) the information needed for an individual or legal surrogate to make informed decisions regarding the completion of such an order; and
    ‘(III) the identification of resources that an individual may use to determine the requirements of the State in which such individual resides so that the treatment wishes of that individual will be carried out if the individual is unable to communicate those wishes, including requirements regarding the designation of a surrogate decisionmaker (also known as a health care proxy).
    ‘(ii) The Secretary shall limit the requirement for explanations under clause (i) to consultations furnished in a State--
    ‘(I) in which all legal barriers have been addressed for enabling orders for life sustaining treatment to constitute a set of medical orders respected across all care settings; and
    ‘(II) that has in effect a program for orders for life sustaining treatment described in clause (iii).
    ‘(iii) A program for orders for life sustaining treatment for a States described in this clause is a program that--
    ‘(I) ensures such orders are standardized and uniquely identifiable throughout the State;
    ‘(II) distributes or makes accessible such orders to physicians and other health professionals that (acting within the scope of the professional’s authority under State law) may sign orders for life sustaining treatment;
    ‘(III) provides training for health care professionals across the continuum of care about the goals and use of orders for life sustaining treatment; and
    ‘(IV) is guided by a coalition of stakeholders includes representatives from emergency medical services, emergency department physicians or nurses, state long-term care association, state medical association, state surveyors, agency responsible for senior services, state department of health, state hospital association, home health association, state bar association, and state hospice association.


    Read, read it aloud if it helps it sink in, no where in that section is there anything remotely described like a government death panel deciding who lives and who dies.

    It is just like I described it earlier, nothing but a provision for physicians, specifically doctors or nurse practitioners to be paid for time they spend discussing medical end of life issues with a patient. It then states that any consultation they are given must fall under the guidelines of the state laws the physician practices in. Thats all it does. In fact, it will only pay for such a consultation with your physician once every 5 years.
    Who is the, "secretary"? What's the need for a secretary? What does the secretary have to do with doctors doing end of life counceling?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    but this was the biggie, last sunday, the 9th

    Another Blow To Public Option: Durbin Open To Dropping It

    huffington doesn't cover the story as well as fox, but i thought you'd prefer her as your source
    If Dick Durbin wants to drop it, then you know the Dems have their cocks in a vice.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  9. #29
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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Who is the, "secretary"? What's the need for a secretary? What does the secretary have to do with doctors doing end of life counceling?
    The evil "secretary" would be who ever the under-Secretary of Health and Human Services is at the time that is over Medicare along with the board of trustees. All this is stating is that the Secretary is to ensure along with state agencies and senior agencies that any consultation is within the boundaries of the state laws the physician practices in. Basically its just saying that it is the responsibility of Medicare when reimbursing this physician for this consultation to make sure that nothing is being told to the patient that violates state law. Ohhhhhhh the Horrors of that...
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Finance Committee to drop end-of-life provision

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Too bad Sec. 1233 doesn't mention living wills, not even once.

    Come on, guys! Dammit, I know there's someone that can use a hunderd dollar bill. If you're all so damned correct on what the bill says, then this should be over already.

    There's enough folks on this forum that don't like me, to suggest that I'm wrong, even if only a little; even some Connies. This just shouldn't be all that hard for such obvious information.
    Not by name, no, but that is what this type of counseling is used for.

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