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Thread: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    Read that carefully.. no insurance company can offer new policies after the first day this bill goes into effect
    Actually, it's much worse than that. No insurance company can adjust policies to reflect a dynamic healthcare marketplace and remain grandfathered.

    This sort of grandfathering is almost farcical in its doublespeak. Business survives by being able to adapt to changing circumstance; HR3200 mandates that health insurance outside the as-yet non-existent "exchange" not adapt at all. The slightest change and the policy must be brought into conformance with the exchange.

    Additionally, no patient can adjust their insurance coverage but by moving into the "exchange". The no change provision applies to individuals as well as businesses.

    The nature of life is adapt or die. Congress, in its finite wisdom, has decided there shall be no adaptation of health insurance save what it has blessed--and thus Congress, in its infinite folly, has decided that health insurance should die.

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    It then creates new regulations for health insurance providers such as no denying for pre-existing conditions, no lifetime maximums and minimum required covered treatments.
    Translation: They are going to put private health insurance out of business.

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by celticlord View Post
    Actually, it's much worse than that. No insurance company can adjust policies to reflect a dynamic healthcare marketplace and remain grandfathered.

    This sort of grandfathering is almost farcical in its doublespeak. Business survives by being able to adapt to changing circumstance; HR3200 mandates that health insurance outside the as-yet non-existent "exchange" not adapt at all. The slightest change and the policy must be brought into conformance with the exchange.

    Additionally, no patient can adjust their insurance coverage but by moving into the "exchange". The no change provision applies to individuals as well as businesses.

    The nature of life is adapt or die. Congress, in its finite wisdom, has decided there shall be no adaptation of health insurance save what it has blessed--and thus Congress, in its infinite folly, has decided that health insurance should die.
    Absolutly true, which is why I added this:
    (2) LIMITATION ON CHANGES IN TERMS OR CONDITIONS- Subject to paragraph (3) and except as required by law, the issuer does not change any of its terms or conditions, including benefits and cost-sharing, from those in effect as of the day before the first day of Y1.
    Search Results - THOMAS (Library of Congress)

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    Read page 16...
    Page 16? Why don't you either print what you're talking about or link to it?

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    The summaries posted are short and worth reading. The bill starts by grandfathering in current healthcare plans. It then creates new regulations for health insurance providers such as no denying for pre-existing conditions, no lifetime maximums and minimum required covered treatments. Finally it creates systems that require healthcare for everyone.

    Superficially Obama is correct that it won't change your current healthcare, as it is grandfathered in. However, if passed the plan would have a radical influence on the industry, such an upheaval would certainly effect individual coverage. I see it as a technically true statement, but its misleading if you look at the larger context.
    This is why I don't want to see this plan succeed. I keep hearing about how we still have the option of private health insurance, and anyone who voices opposition is made out to be some kind of hysterical fear-mongering fool. There's an old saying....if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. No thank you. Government can keep its nationalized plan and I'll keep my health care autonomy.




    Gestures, in love, are incomparably more attractive, effective and valuable than words.
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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Translation: They are going to put private health insurance out of business.
    About 4 paragraphs in after the table of contents.... that is basically what this whole bill is about, that and Nationalizing another sector of our economy.

    How's that change working out for you?

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by hiswoman View Post
    This is why I don't want to see this plan succeed. I keep hearing about how we still have the option of private health insurance, and anyone who voices opposition is made out to be some kind of hysterical fear-mongering fool. There's an old saying....if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. No thank you. Government can keep its nationalized plan and I'll keep my health care autonomy.
    Then you better start riding your Congress critters butt, unless we make it plain they won't be re-elected, they will pass this POS and you won't be able to keep your private health insurrance... it will cease to exist.

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    The bill is unlikely to be able to kill private healthcare. Many countries that have adopted government healthcare plans have maintained a private branch as well. Keep in mind that 45% of healthcare spending in this country is government expenditure already.

    My current healthcare plan wouldn't even be effected by the new rules. All you can eat care with an annual deductible plans are fairly common, and wouldn't change under the new rules. The biggest problem I see would be the problems with being unable to deny anyone coverage for pre-existing conditions. Unless we adopt Dutch style risk equalization, some insurers could be hit hard if they get unlucky.

    I found a wikipedia article that has a list of a bunch of healthcare system around the world and gives a brief summary of how they work and how much they cost. It is a helpful in getting an basis of comparison.

    Health care system - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Translation: They are going to put private health insurance out of business.
    More jobs down the toilet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Town hall tension: Meeting turns ugly over health care

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    It looks like astroturfing town hall meetings is the new political tactic of choice. Given the organizational capabilities of modern technology, its amazing that it took this long for someone to catch on. The democrats seem to be a step behind, but I suspect they will be adopting the same maneuvers soon enough.
    The only thing the Democrats are a step behind on is understanding that spontaneous distrust of socialism is a natural human emotion and that there's little "organized" effort behind granny being pissed at her Democrat congressthing for trying to ration her health care.

    So the real story line is that enough individuals have finally gotten fed up with the Democrat's Messiah and realized that if they don't speak up the Messiah is going to steamroll them flat into a horrible and expensive nationalized medicine program that won't deliver the promised goods, only more jobs for government workers, and they started voicing their concerns loudly to their useless trash sucking congressmen who were trying to put yet another con over on them.

    The Democrats first phony response was to promulgate the lie that these protesters were "organized", and immediately the Messiah of Inclusiveness and Openness and Attentiveness labeled all who opposed his glorious plan of national self-destruction as "angry mobs", and later "organized angry mobs".

    Then they called out their goonions to start fights.


    Oh, and what does the covering of your Rapist President's old pick'em up truck have to do with the legitimate concerns real Americans have that they're being railroaded? You think because that moron Pelosi can make a phony metaphor that doesn't fly you have to promote it as if it made any sense whatsoever?
    Last edited by Scarecrow Akhbar; 08-09-09 at 08:25 PM.

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