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Thread: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    thanks zyph, you hit it right on the head. I wasn't motivated enough to break it down yet.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    uh ok if you say so.


    Did you actually read what will claimed? That the "entire thing" was paid for by republicans, etc....

    Even if this hit piece was 200% accurate, he still failed.
    Well he said, and I will quote what you highlighted:

    You do realize this entire charade is paid for by billionaire rightwing activists and coordinated through the Republican party
    Both this report, and my sources posted in the other thread all lead to the same conclusion that is 100% accurate. Sorry you can not wiggle out of this one, but the statement made is proven. Watch the video, she names all the players in this little charade. You are free as beer to go look for yourself at who these people are, what they do, and what they support. Evidence presented, judgment given: You lost.

    I will be kind and tell you your one fatal flaw. You argued from a standpoint where you had absolutely nothing in support. You should not have claimed what you did, but actually made a different argument such as "Well so what, lobbyists have a right to free speech", or "The wealthy health care industry has a right to push their agenda". Both of these would have been factually correct, and would have been more correct and honest. Oh well.

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    Quote Originally Posted by WillRockwell View Post
    Cut the BS, either tell me how the MSNBC report is inaccurate or shut up and pay the forum the money you promised.
    How is it inaccurate? Are you seriously asking that question?

    A Republican could say that the sun rises in the east and Rachael Maddow swear that someone paid that person to say that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    Quote Originally Posted by sam_w View Post
    Well he said, and I will quote what you highlighted:



    Both this report, and my sources posted in the other thread all lead to the same conclusion that is 100% accurate. Sorry you can not wiggle out of this one, but the statement made is proven. Watch the video, she names all the players in this little charade. You are free as beer to go look for yourself at who these people are, what they do, and what they support. Evidence presented, judgment given: You lost.

    I will be kind and tell you your one fatal flaw. You argued from a standpoint where you had absolutely nothing in support. You should not have claimed what you did, but actually made a different argument such as "Well so what, lobbyists have a right to free speech", or "The wealthy health care industry has a right to push their agenda". Both of these would have been factually correct, and would have been more correct and honest. Oh well.





    Murphy to hold health care town hall, Aug. 8 | Libertarian Party


    Libertarians are NOT republicans, and therefore his statement that:

    "You do realize this entire charade is paid for by billionaire rightwing activists and coordinated through the Republican party."


    Is a lie, false, and now without question, destroyed.



    This place used to at least challenge the Good Reverend, that took 3 seconds.



    Game set match.
    Last edited by ReverendHellh0und; 08-06-09 at 04:07 PM.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Educator sam_w's Avatar
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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    I haven't even watched the video because I'm at work, but going off what you described.

    You realize that PAC's, that get funding from various sources, and helping to organize protests is not the same as stating "insurance companies and republicans are paying peopel to protest". Its just not.

    AND even if you want to consider it, then almost every major war protest over the past 8 years were also "illigitimate" and should've had your scorn because MoveOn.Org, Code Pink, and other such liberal PAC's and groups that recieving funding from people tied directly to liberal causes helped promote and organize them.

    AND even if you want to consider that, then Obama using his office of the presidency to spread messages to people that they need to go out and protest/rally FOR his plans is ALSO making any of those publicly supporting the bill illigitimate as THEY are being influenced by people who have alterior motives as to why they want people to come out and speak for it.

    Regardless of all that though, none of what you just said proves the original assertion:

    "You do realize this entire charade is paid for by billionaire rightwing activists and coordinated through the Republican party."

    There was no proof from what you've stated that the REPUBLICAN PARTY was helping to "cordinate" this effort. And there's still no proof that EVERY protest and protester out there is being "paid" for by "billionaire rightwing activists".

    Will's got own up to the fact that he made an absurdly ludicrous and asinine statement, got called on it, tried to move the goal posts when providing his "evidence", and is now having a hissy fit along with some of the rest of you that that its not being allowed to somehow "prove" his original idiotic statement.
    Well said, here is his statement:

    You do realize this entire charade is paid for by billionaire rightwing activists and coordinated through the Republican party
    He has proven, as well as I have in another thread, that "billionaire rightwing activists" are coorrdinating. This is a fact. It is also pretty much to assume as fact that this is coordinated through the Republican Party considering so many of the people involved are current and former GOP elected officials, longtime supporters with close ties, lobbying firms that work exclusively with Republicans and Republican issues.

    All we have left is one word: entire. Is the entire mass of protesters paid for, probably not. And I do think I can speak for Will in that he would agree with that. Of course you are going to have normal everyday people that would show up at a normal everyday townhall to oppose an issue. That is the nature of the townhall.

    But what has transpired has been organized by "billionaire rightwing activists", and Republican PACs and lobbying firms.

    At this point, because of these actions, no town hall can be considered free of open discourse. The right screwed the pooch on this, too much got out too soon, so that even if there are some legitimate people protesting legitimately at a town hall, it will not be seen by most as legitimate because of the organized protests that were pushed and organized by lobbying firms.

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    This probably deserves it's own thread, but I think it fits well here, since the topic is, "mobs paid to protest", basically. I'm sure the Libbos will be vehemently opposed to this strategy. It appears that the Liberals in our government are opposed to free speech and any kind of dissention. Now, they're bringing their muscle into the fray. I hope youo Libbos are proud of what you elected.

    The nation's largest federation of labor organizations has promised to directly engage with boisterous conservative protesters at Democratic town halls during the August recess.

    In a memo sent out on Thursday, AFL-CIO President John Sweeney outlined the blueprint for how the union conglomerate would step up recess activities on health care reform and other topics pertinent to the labor community. The document makes clear that Obama allies view the town hall forums as ground zero of the health care debate. It also uses the specter of the infamous 2000 recount "Brooks Brothers" protest to rally its members to the administration's side.

    Unions To Take On Conservative Groups Health Care Town Halls
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    according to quinnipiac yesterday (not prudential insurance, get a piece of the rock), 71% of AMERICANS do NOT BELIEVE the president when he says he can extend coverage to some 50 million or so (about 1/3 of them illegals) without significantly impacting the deficit

    that sounds pretty groundswell to me

    problems with pelosi/obama's health care reform:

    1. waxman/rangel FINES those caught breathing without insurance, as criminals, this is not quite the HELP these folks were promised or looking for, this is hardly the benificent view of universalism sold to the electorate

    2. they are FORCED to BUY IT THEMSELVES

    3. waxman/rangel proposes massive cuts to MEDICARE and MEDICAID

    4. the COST CURVE, according to CBO/elmendorf, steepens upward significantly under waxman/rangel

    5. it covers ILLEGALS, since the heller amendment was voted down in rangel's ways and means

    6. it changes the public funding of abortion on demand, bluedog bugaboo

    7. it looks for huge savings in END OF LIFE COSTS, which is FREAKING OUT seniors (THIS is what's really animating those noisy town halls)

    8. the prez is on record as not even having read the 1000 pages himself, his press secty said this week the prez does not expect ever to peruse the plan

    9. according to obama and barney frank, the various plans under consideration are seen BY THEM as foot-in-the-door incrementalist starting points towards eventual full nationalization

    10. john kerry's plans purpose to tax med benefits, ala john mccain, which obama used so to beat over the head, quite correctly, the slightly doddering senator from AZ during the campaign

    these are the things which are bugging americans, state farm insurance has nothing to with it, i'm pretty sure NONE of the folks on THIS THREAD, for example, ever received an email, let alone a penny, from prudential or allstate the good hands people

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    according to quinnipiac yesterday (not prudential insurance, get a piece of the rock), 71% of AMERICANS do NOT BELIEVE the president when he says he can extend coverage to some 50 million or so (about 1/3 of them illegals) without significantly impacting the deficit

    that sounds pretty groundswell to me

    problems with pelosi/obama's health care reform:

    1. waxman/rangel FINES those caught breathing without insurance, as criminals, this is not quite the HELP these folks were promised or looking for, this is hardly the benificent view of universalism sold to the electorate

    2. they are FORCED to BUY IT THEMSELVES

    3. waxman/rangel proposes massive cuts to MEDICARE and MEDICAID

    4. the COST CURVE, according to CBO/elmendorf, steepens upward significantly under waxman/rangel

    5. it covers ILLEGALS, since the heller amendment was voted down in rangel's ways and means

    6. it changes the public funding of abortion on demand, bluedog bugaboo

    7. it looks for huge savings in END OF LIFE COSTS, which is FREAKING OUT seniors (THIS is what's really animating those noisy town halls)

    8. the prez is on record as not even having read the 1000 pages himself, his press secty said this week the prez does not expect ever to peruse the plan

    9. according to obama and barney frank, the various plans under consideration are seen BY THEM as foot-in-the-door incrementalist starting points towards eventual full nationalization

    10. john kerry's plans purpose to tax med benefits, ala john mccain, which obama used so to beat over the head, quite correctly, the slightly doddering senator from AZ during the campaign

    these are the things which are bugging americans, state farm insurance has nothing to with it, i'm pretty sure NONE of the folks on THIS THREAD, for example, ever received an email, let alone a penny, from prudential or allstate the good hands people
    If Obama's plan were simply "you have to buy at least basic, catastrophic insurance, and here's a tax rebate to help; oh and we're instituting this long list of price caps...." I'd be all over it.

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    If Obama's plan were simply "you have to buy at least basic, catastrophic insurance, and here's a tax rebate to help; oh and we're instituting this long list of price caps...." I'd be all over it.
    What I would like for them do is subsidize 50% of any policy I purchased.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Ark. crowd mocks lawmakers over Obama health plan

    Quote Originally Posted by sam_w View Post
    He has proven, as well as I have in another thread, that "billionaire rightwing activists" are coorrdinating. This is a fact.
    First, we'll assume the report is honest. I can't help but seem to remember you were one bitching about someones source the other day because it was from the Free Republic but we'll leave that for now.

    What you stated simply proves that SOME of the ones have been financed by "billionaire rightwing activists". He stated however the "entire" thing was, which has in no way shape or form been proven.

    It is also pretty much to assume as fact that this is coordinated through the Republican Party considering so many of the people involved are current and former GOP elected officials, longtime supporters with close ties, lobbying firms that work exclusively with Republicans and Republican issues.
    No, its not. See, an assumption without fact is just that...an assumption. You can't "assume" something is a fact without facts. It doesn't work like that. The ONLY way one can assume that is fact is for one to believe it in the first place so because of their world view they just assume it that way. We can ASSUME its not being done through the Republican Party because the RNC has not been directly linked to "coordinating" this "entire" thing and just becasue previously active republicans are active in this (Who would've THOUGHT! Republicans....active....protesting things....based on conservative values?! What the hell!? It must be a conspiracy!) does not PROVE anything in regards to the REPUBLICAN PARTY coordinating this "entire" thing.

    All we have left is one word: entire. Is the entire mass of protesters paid for, probably not.
    To bad that's what he stated.

    Not to mention you've of course not touched the fact that your alls feigned, hypocritical outrage is just that since what you've just described above is the same thing that happened with immigration protests, war protests, environmental protests, along with protests in regards to getting national health care, with even the President of the United States of America using the power of his office to do such things.

    Its either wrong in principle, or its not. If you're basing whether its wrong on whether or not you think the thing they're protesting is "good for americans" or not then its nothing but hyper partisan, double talk, bull**** and does nothing but show someone whose opinion is worth less than mud.

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