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Thread: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

  1. #191
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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    While I understand that, I don't think there should be the possibility of tax payers paying for something like that.
    Perhaps
    Neither do i but if they pay taxes as well, who am i to bitch?


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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    It's not a money issue. If anything, it's even further commentary on how sick the process is. Fake boobs seem to be worth more than human life in our current world. The end result is that abortion has horrible consequences, the destruction of innocent human life. And because of that I think we should caution ourselves on what we'd allow the public to fund in these cases.
    Okay, even if $1 were being contributed by gov., it wouldn't matter because for you its an ethical concern.

    So how do you explain private insurance companies who pay for abortion as part of people's work plans? Group insurance involves multiple payers. If you work for a company whose group insurance plan covers abortion, then you are, by default, supporting abortion financially. Have you quit your job over it?

    I'm not trying to paint you as a hypocrite... I'm just saying. The group paying for the individual has been the case for a long time in the work sector. Granted, it's not the public sector, but still.

    As I said before, I think more than likely what will happen with U.S. style UHC is that coverage for abortion will depend on which administration is in power. The Republicans will strike it from the bill while the Democrats will restore it. It is the same with the rest of the birth control policy in general.

    I still do not see it as a reason to not have UHC though.

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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    Okay, even if $1 were being contributed by gov., it wouldn't matter because for you its an ethical concern.

    So how do you explain private insurance companies who pay for abortion as part of people's work plans? Group insurance involves multiple payers. If you work for a company whose group insurance plan covers abortion, then you are, by default, supporting abortion financially. Have you quit your job over it?

    I'm not trying to paint you as a hypocrite... I'm just saying. The group paying for the individual has been the case for a long time in the work sector. Granted, it's not the public sector, but still.

    As I said before, I think more than likely what will happen with U.S. style UHC is that coverage for abortion will depend on which administration is in power. The Republicans will strike it from the bill while the Democrats will restore it. It is the same with the rest of the birth control policy in general.

    I still do not see it as a reason to not have UHC though.
    It's a private company. If you have ethical objections to their health care plan then you can simply purchase your own insurance. Taxes do not allow for such a choice.

  4. #194
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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    Okay, even if $1 were being contributed by gov., it wouldn't matter because for you its an ethical concern.

    So how do you explain private insurance companies who pay for abortion as part of people's work plans? Group insurance involves multiple payers. If you work for a company whose group insurance plan covers abortion, then you are, by default, supporting abortion financially. Have you quit your job over it?

    I'm not trying to paint you as a hypocrite... I'm just saying. The group paying for the individual has been the case for a long time in the work sector. Granted, it's not the public sector, but still.

    As I said before, I think more than likely what will happen with U.S. style UHC is that coverage for abortion will depend on which administration is in power. The Republicans will strike it from the bill while the Democrats will restore it. It is the same with the rest of the birth control policy in general.

    I still do not see it as a reason to not have UHC though.
    I can't do anything with private companies, I don't have a say as it's their company. I do have a say in what the government does and funds since it's my government and my money.
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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    So how do you explain private insurance companies who pay for abortion as part of people's work plans? Group insurance involves multiple payers. If you work for a company whose group insurance plan covers abortion, then you are, by default, supporting abortion financially. Have you quit your job over it?
    You CHOOSE to participate in this insurance.
    UHC denies that choice.

    Its all about choice, right?

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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I can't do anything with private companies, I don't have a say as it's their company. I do have a say in what the government does and funds since it's my government and my money.
    With UHC, you don't really. All countries with a progressive birth control policy that have UHC cover abortion for their people. It's just common sense. I realize you can't see this because we come from two different cultures, but it's more unethical to offer selective procedures based on populist morality. You either have UHC or you don't. The "universal" part is important.

    I do reiterate though that the U.S. is simply not ready for UHC. They can't make the initial leap of wanting to pay for the collective health of their society, so why should I expect them to understand why UHC being pro-choice makes sense?

    Your country just isn't ready. There are too many debates happening and UHC intersects a lot of them. You can't have UHC until the chatter dies down.

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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post

    Your country just isn't ready. There are too many debates happening and UHC intersects a lot of them. You can't have UHC until the chatter dies down.
    So US will never have UHC? :P
    It won't ever stop having such debates, there is no consensus amongst politicans let alone the people


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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    With UHC, you don't really. All countries with a progressive birth control policy that have UHC cover abortion for their people. It's just common sense.
    I've found that "its just common sense" is code for "I cannot really come up with a good argument to support the idea".


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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    Okay, even if $1 were being contributed by gov., it wouldn't matter because for you its an ethical concern.

    So how do you explain private insurance companies who pay for abortion as part of people's work plans? Group insurance involves multiple payers. If you work for a company whose group insurance plan covers abortion, then you are, by default, supporting abortion financially. Have you quit your job over it?

    I'm not trying to paint you as a hypocrite... I'm just saying. The group paying for the individual has been the case for a long time in the work sector. Granted, it's not the public sector, but still.
    There's that slippery slope. Bad enough when private companies do it. Worse when the whole nation does it!

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    Re: Gov't insurance would allow coverage for abortion

    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    So US will never have UHC? :P
    It won't ever stop having such debates, there is no consensus amongst politicans let alone the people
    You're right... which is why UHC in the U.S. will, at best, be administered in a partisan way based on who is in power. But that, to me, is not really UHC at all. Better than nothing I guess.

    Our countries legalized abortion and funded it across the board under pro-choice policy. They looked at it and said, "If you want one, we will help. If you don't want one, don't get one." But in our countries, the evangelists and religious right are given less of a voice in secular politics. They have much more power in the U.S.

    I still assert that if you don't like abortion, then don't get one... but it's not enough for the opposition. For them, it's: "Oh, but we want to control everyone and make sure people aren't being murdered!"

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