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Thread: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

  1. #61
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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Actually, if you the people start relying upon funds from other taxpayers to subsidize your life, you allow them input into how you live that life. The gummint has no life aside from what it is given by citizens.
    Could you show me where entry into a welfare program was contingent upon the acceptance of future government monitoring?

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    At no time was entry into a welfare program contingent upon the acceptance of such draconian security measures. Only after these families became dependent upon welfare did the government seek to implement this policy. Basically, you are advocating government blackmail in the way of a retroactive ultimatum.



    Harshaw, Ikari, and I are certainly no fans of the welfare state, BUT if we, as liberty-loving individuals, have to choose between maintaining welfare or imposing draconian security measures on the "undesirables" the choice is easy. I choose liberty each and every time, as should you.
    Good enough for me, end Welfare.

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Actually, if you the people start relying upon funds from other taxpayers to subsidize your life, you allow them input into how you live that life. The gummint has no life aside from what it is given by citizens.
    No I don't. If the government is giving out money, and I happen to take it; that means nothing. No one gets a say in my life. ****, government employees all the time take money from taxpayers. Banks lend money. None of that means abdication of rights in the least. And that's most definitely true with the government. The government may not infringe upon the rights and liberties of the People without due process of law. Being on welfare or social security or medicade/medicare or the wide breadth of social programs we have is not illegal, is not criminal, and because of that the government cannot infringe upon their rights.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Harshaw, Ikari, and I are certainly no fans of the welfare state, BUT if we, as liberty-loving individuals, have to choose between maintaining welfare or imposing draconian security measures on the "undesirables" the choice is easy. I choose liberty each and every time, as should you.
    Of course I would take the welfare system over draconian security measures. Spying on people, surveillance against our own people is imposing draconian security measures against undesirables. I think you're looking at pointing the finger elsewhere. That, or you misspoke.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Of course I would take the welfare system over draconian security measures.
    That's what I said.

    Spying on people, surveillance against our own people is imposing draconian security measures against undesirables.
    That's what I said.

    I think you're looking at pointing the finger elsewhere.
    If I am pointing a finger it isn't at you.

    That, or you misspoke.
    Or you misunderstood...

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    Of course I love freedom. I would in no way think that people should be subject to having their right to privacy revoked through such means.
    You just spent the whole thread saying that you would.


    However, it strikes me as funny, that you guys feel that those who will not do for themselves, and are essentially living on a subsocialist system, are run of the mill voters.
    I think they are full-fledged people under the jurisdiction of the United States of America, where all people are to be equal before the law and where civil liberties do not only apply to limited groups.


    These people fight to preserve the freeloading lifestyle they subsist on. So end the Welfare state and I will be happy.
    I'm for ending it too. But I will not support such totalitarian measures under any circumstances.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Or you misunderstood...
    God damned it...I ain't had enough coffee yet. Sorry.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Actually, if you the people start relying upon funds from other taxpayers to subsidize your life, you allow them input into how you live that life. The gummint has no life aside from what it is given by citizens.
    These two statements have nothing to do with each other in any real way. The second is a nasty twisting of a noble concept. If your idea of government of the people, by the people, and for the people ever involves a group -- any group of non-convicts -- forced to abdicate their basic civil liberties, then you are either all screwed up, or a garden-variety totalitarian. Or both.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    You just spent the whole thread saying that you would.
    Only the group of people who place their lives in the hands of the government, not tax paying, working Americans.




    I think they are full-fledged people under the jurisdiction of the United States of America, where all people are to be equal before the law and where civil liberties do not only apply to limited groups.
    Sure, but they have determined that the government is better suited to running their lives than they are.




    I'm for ending it too. But I will not support such totalitarian measures under any circumstances.
    How is it totalitarian? It is simply cameras for the purpose of ensuring people are taking care of their children. Apparently the majority of those on Welfare are not now doing so.

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    Re: SIN BINS FOR WORST FAMILIES (aka the end of liberty in Britain)

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    Only the group of people who place their lives in the hands of the government, not tax paying, working Americans.


    Sure, but they have determined that the government is better suited to running their lives than they are.


    How is it totalitarian? It is simply cameras for the purpose of ensuring people are taking care of their children. Apparently the majority of those on Welfare are not now doing so.
    "Simply."

    This is utter madness. You people are going to richly deserve the jackboot on your throats.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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