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Thread: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by fromderinside View Post
    Probably not. However I would have bought bread, meat, milk, vegatables, energy, shelter, without someone 'creating' demand. I'm wondering what idiot(s) came up with the idea that it was good business over produce farm products just because he wanted to gain advantage by driving prices down so others would have to sell their land to him.
    What the hell are you even talking about?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by GetAClue View Post
    The only rigging of the supply and demand chain is by our government. All things being equal and without government interference, the laws of supply and demand work. If there is a demand for an item with resources available to purchase the item, the market will respond by producing more of the item.

    However, when you introduce government incentives or disincentives into the picture, you are artificially tipping the scales of supply and demand in the favor of a product or service that best suits a political agenda as opposed to the wants and needs of the market.
    Yet until government regulation was firmly fixed in 1933 we had depressions about every 10-15 years. Now, even when conditions are ripe for a depression, government regulators were able to step in and reduce the depression to a recession. Free market and supply and demand systems don't work without intergovernmental and government cooperation and regulation.

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by fromderinside View Post
    If I confiscate enough money from one individual to provide 1000 people with enough money to meed their needs (demands) I am generating demand from taxes. Your model fails because you don't correct for units (buying and using).
    Wrong. The demand already existed. You simply took money (supply) from one group and gave it to another group.

    The question you need to ask yourself is, how many times can you do this? What happens when the one individual runs out of money or leaves the country due to having his wealth confiscated? Why not let the one individual invest his money in an enterprise that provided jobs to the 1000 people. In that scenario, their needs will be met over and over and the one individual is able to maintain his wealth so he doesn't run out of money or to another country?

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    What the hell are you even talking about?
    Life creates demand for many things.

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by fromderinside View Post
    Yet until government regulation was firmly fixed in 1933 we had depressions about every 10-15 years. Now, even when conditions are ripe for a depression, government regulators were able to step in and reduce the depression to a recession. Free market and supply and demand systems don't work without intergovernmental and government cooperation and regulation.
    So, what with all this steel that has been introduced into the metal industry, thanks to cash for clunkers, what's going to happen to metal prices?

    Another bailout, anyone?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by GetAClue View Post
    Wrong. The demand already existed. You simply took money (supply) from one group and gave it to another group.

    The question you need to ask yourself is, how many times can you do this? What happens when the one individual runs out of money or leaves the country due to having his wealth confiscated? Why not let the one individual invest his money in an enterprise that provided jobs to the 1000 people. In that scenario, their needs will be met over and over and the one individual is able to maintain his wealth so he doesn't run out of money or to another country?
    There can be no demand without resources to exercise that so called existing demand. If I am the power or the powers and I can generate enough fear I can do this forever. It's just like suppl y and demand. In fact it's what underlies a free market, greed and fear. If greed becomes excessive proper counter measures using fear corrects the excess of greed and restores a balance between the two.

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by fromderinside View Post
    Life creates demand for many things.
    You're partly right, but government can't create a demand for goods and services, then think that the economy is going to survive on that demand.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by fromderinside View Post
    Yet until government regulation was firmly fixed in 1933 we had depressions about every 10-15 years. Now, even when conditions are ripe for a depression, government regulators were able to step in and reduce the depression to a recession. Free market and supply and demand systems don't work without intergovernmental and government cooperation and regulation.
    Regulators stepped in and borrowed Trillions of dollars from the Chinese and other countries that we will probably never be able to repay. They have sold this country down the river. They will end up dragging this recession out for years longer than it would have been by their regulating.

    Read this article. You might learn something:
    http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=9880

    However, I submit that if it were not for unnecessary regulation, we would not have even gotten into the current recession. The Community Reinvestment Act of 1979 introduced government policies and regulations that helped put the economy into the recession we are currently in.

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You're partly right, but government can't create a demand for goods and services, then think that the economy is going to survive on that demand.
    Actually, I'm one of those whose job it is to 'create' demand. I know I'm on the margin. Normal exercise of life as technology develops produces sufficient awareness of what is available and effective in conducting life. that is all the demand one should require to satisfy needs for available products to sustain everybody in an enlightened society.

    The expectation that unlimited greed should be permitted to drive demand to one's benefit is in error. Take the example of Denmark. Health care, high taxes, low unemployment, happy, they have it all.

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    Re: Govt to suspend Cash for Clunkers program

    Quote Originally Posted by GetAClue View Post
    Regulators stepped in and borrowed Trillions of dollars from the Chinese and other countries that we will probably never be able to repay. They have sold this country down the river. They will end up dragging this recession out for years longer than it would have been by their regulating.

    Read this article. You might learn something:
    Not-So-Great Depression | Jim Powell | Cato Institute: Commentary

    However, I submit that if it were not for unnecessary regulation, we would not have even gotten into the current recession. The Community Reinvestment Act of 1979 introduced government policies and regulations that helped put the economy into the recession we are currently in.
    Regulators didn't borrow. They printed money which, if it isn't soaked up in the wrap up to the bailout, will have to be financed. the Congressional bailout will result in borrowing. On the other hand, if the US isn't buying, China ain't prospering. Interesting you point to the creation of Freddie and Fannie as the problem. Uh, no, that wasn't it. Adjustments made to regulation of borrowing policies in the mid nineties left open the opportunity for highly leveraged debt and insurance products which got us there.

    It's also interesting that you don't acknowledge that there were no depressions since 1933, when before that time there were depressions almost every decade from 1790 on. When ambitious people untie themselves from minimal constraints excess always results.

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