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Democrats scold Obama on signing statements

Ikari said:
Nothing is perfect, so I should accept horrible expansions of government, abuse of power, and mishandling of huge natural disasters huh?
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Once more we are dealing with YOUR perceptions in a vacuum of facts and the historic record.

Ikari said:
Things which aggregated over each other have cost huge amounts of money, manpower, and lives?
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This is just more of your typical hyperbolic rhetoric in a vacuum of facts.

Ikari said:
That's your argument?
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The notion that you could comprehend what my arguments are would require the willing suspension of disbelief.

My arguments are pretty clear; when we remove the hyperbolic bile you spew and your naive notions about REALITY, Bush was not as bad as you would like to believe. But in basically short order, Obama has been everything that I expected him to be; an irresponsible big spending Liberal who wants to make the American people dependents on Government largess.

Ikari said:
As good as you can do huh, basically the Rumsfeld excuse? "This is hard, we know what we are doing, trust that we know what we are doing". Your blanket Bush defending and horrible partisanship is showing. That's about the most pathetic excuse I've heard for government treason and tyranny in quite some time. Well no one's perfect. HA
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I rest my case above; your trite and absurd assertions that my arguments are a blanket defense of Bush are more telling about your absurd notions about reality and lack of any credible facts.

What I find most amusing is your simplistic political notions that you are above the fray by claiming NO allegiance to any party as making you somehow less “partisan.” But being a partisan for foolishness, naiveté' and your obvious immaturity about how things REALLY work hardly places you above the perceptions you have about what it is to be "partisan."

Carry on. :rofl
 
TheNextEra said:
Yep Bush was an angel and Obama is the Devil. Obama's spending excuses Bush's spending. :roll:
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The sad thing is people use Bush's outrageous spending to excuse/justify Dear Leader's more outrageous spending.

It's the Joe Biden school of economic thought: we have to spend money we don't have to keep from going bankrupt.
 
TheNextEra said:
And yet you continue to excuse Bush's actions :rofl:rofl. Here's a hint for you and is FACT, Obama's spending DOES NOT excuse Bush's. When you learn that fact, come back here.
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Nothing in my comments "excuses" Bush for anything. In fact, I hardly see why Bush's Presidency would need "excusing." You see, I deal with the REAL world and REAL facts; not my personal biases and perceptions which would lead me to blather this forum with uninformed hyperbolic nonsense.

The notion that you can lecture ANYONE about "facts" is laughable. :rofl
 
celticlord said:
The sad thing is people use Bush's outrageous spending to excuse/justify Dear Leader's more outrageous spending.
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I guess this argument depends on what you believe is "outrageous."

Was it outrageous to spend billions dealing with 9-11? Was it outrageous to spend billions to fight two wars which had BI-PARTISAN support? Was it outrageous to spend billions for the re-building and victims of Hurricane Katrina? Was it outrageous to spend billions creating the Homeland Security bureacracy in the aftermath of 9-11?

I guess you can claim it was outrageous to spend billions on the Medicare drug reform act, but millions of seasoned citizens might beg to disagree.

My argument here is that it is easy to claim Bush's spending was somehow "outrageous" depending on your personal opinions and definitions of what is considered outrageous, but when we look at the REALITIES, it is hard to find serious fault with Bush's spending.

While we agree on many things, I still find this statement that Bush's spending was outrageous to be without merit compared with historic spending and the facts surrounding that spending.
 
they are both doing their jobs ... it's the 'check and balance' at work

per the Op's cite, Obama has staked out his position on the limitation on signing statements:
Obama also assailed Bush on the issue during the presidential campaign.

In March, he vowed not to use signing statements to disregard parts of laws because he disagrees on policy grounds, but only when he strongly believes provisions are unconstitutional. “There is no doubt that the practice of issuing such statements can be abused. Constitutional signing statements should not be used to suggest that the president will disregard statutory requirements on the basis of policy disagreements,” wrote Obama.

But he has issued a series of signing statements since, though not nearly as many as Bush.
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he made his (signing) move and congress has now put him in check
let's now move this to the judiciary so that it can split the baby
 
"when congress offers you a bill, do you promise not to use presidential signing statements to get your way?"

Obama: "Yes."

:bs

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seAR1S1Mjkc&feature=player_embedded"]YouTube - Obama on Presidential Signing Statements[/ame]
 
MC.no.spin said:
"when congress offers you a bill, do you promise not to use presidential signing statements to get your way?"

Obama: "Yes."

:bs

YouTube - Obama on Presidential Signing Statements
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Outstanding; hard to refute a video of his actual words; it reminds me of another video contradiction by this same man when he was asked if he was going to run for the Presidency and he said this:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2encXLmPDo"]YouTube - Obama Admits; I Should Not Run For President In 2008[/ame]

So what is Obama; a habitual liar or just someone who wallows in hypocrisy unaware of his huge ego and denial?
 
Truth Detector said:
Once more we are dealing with YOUR perceptions in a vacuum of facts and the historic record.



This is just more of your typical hyperbolic rhetoric in a vacuum of facts.



The notion that you could comprehend what my arguments are would require the willing suspension of disbelief.

My arguments are pretty clear; when we remove the hyperbolic bile you spew and your naive notions about REALITY, Bush was not as bad as you would like to believe. But in basically short order, Obama has been everything that I expected him to be; an irresponsible big spending Liberal who wants to make the American people dependents on Government largess.



I rest my case above; your trite and absurd assertions that my arguments are a blanket defense of Bush are more telling about your absurd notions about reality and lack of any credible facts.

What I find most amusing is your simplistic political notions that you are above the fray by claiming NO allegiance to any party as making you somehow less “partisan.” But being a partisan for foolishness, naiveté' and your obvious immaturity about how things REALLY work hardly places you above the perceptions you have about what it is to be "partisan."

Carry on. :rofl
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what tripe. Nothing more than partisan thinking, ad hominem arguments, with no information presented, no intellectual value, and a dishonesty that is up there with Hannity's. Incredible. The government, the entity owned by the People, which wields the People's power and sovereignty, which much be controlled and limited you make excuse for not controlling or liminting. Nothing is perfect blah blah blah. What was dumb excuse. Nothing is perfect, but that doesn't mean I have to accept bottom of the barrel either. The things you tried to excuse where some of the biggest f' ups we've had to live through in quite some time. But no one's perfect.

So why the hell are you going against Obama so hard? Healthcare? Fine, I mean, sure it's horribly conceived, won't work well, and will do more harm then good...but no one's perfect. Why would you expect it to. Sure, spending lots of money, but hell; no one's perfect. Why is it that you claim my ideals exist in some "vacuum" but yours are somehow factual and relate to the real world? There is no reason, you see the R and the D and make arguments based on that, no matter how many times you have to change your arguments and the basis for them.

Nobody's perfect....pathetic. Elementary school kids could come up with something better than that. Nothing may be perfect, but I still demand a certain amount of competency and respect for the Constitution out of the government. Pfft...big government statists will never understand, polarized partisans can't understand, non-thinkers drinking the Kool-Aid will never get it. Because to them, their world is colored by the R and the D, not the actual actions and consequences.
 
Ikari said:
That's about the most pathetic excuse I've heard for government treason and tyranny in quite some time. Well no one's perfect. HA
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Better than the current excuses..."well at least he's our first black president"
 
rugger10 said:
Better than the current excuses..."well at least he's our first black president"
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Yeah, that's another one I've heard on occasion. All this "better of the two-evils" things suck. The better of two evils is still evil. We need better control and better quality over the system, the government, and our politicians. The sins of the present DO NOT FORGIVE THE SINS OF THE PAST. That's an important issue to understand, and if we are ever to move forward and save this Republic, keep this Republic, then we must hold government responsible for its actions and the consequences thereof.
 
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rugger10 said:
Better than the current excuses..."well at least he's our first black president"
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Funny, I've never seen anybody post that. I'm sure that isn't a strawman, however, and you'll shortly be able to post plenty of links to posters offering that excuse
 
Truth Detector said:
So what is Obama; a habitual liar or just someone who wallows in hypocrisy unaware of his huge ego and denial?
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Either way, these videos and evidence will come in handy in 2012. :2razz:


Obama: Change you SHOULDN'T have believed in.
 
aps said:
I disagree that Bush and Obama are one in the same. However, I am happy that these Democrats are applying this complaint to their own party. That's the way it should be.
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Truth Detector said:
Correction; Bush is NOTHING like Obama. Bush never spent us into a $1.8 trillion deficit with more to come and Bush never made a political grab at power as this administration has with it's czars and policies.

Please do not place Bush in the same category as Obama, Obama has taken Government power grab to all time new highs.
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Reason TV says otherwise

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdETP5aR2AQ"]YouTube - Barack W. Bush?[/ame]
 
Erod said:
I sense MANY Democrats can't wait for the opportunity to bury Obama. They resent his rock-star fame and his razor-thin resume. Now that the tide is turning on Obama, perhaps they will turn on him, too.
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Well...
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZoErMxDPoQ"]YouTube - Joe Biden delivering an ominous message about Barack Obama[/ame]
"Mark my words : It will not be 6 months before the world tests Barack Obama... Watch we're going to have an international crisis a generated crisis to test the mettle of this guy."" - Joe Biden

Bush's popularity skyrocketed after 9-11 happened... what is on the verge of happeneing that have the US 'rally around the flag' like they did after 9-11, Golf of Tonkin, Pearl Harbour, etc.
 
celticlord said:
The sad thing is people use Bush's outrageous spending to excuse/justify Dear Leader's more outrageous spending..
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So me a favor, REALLY, show me those on this board that have excused Obama's spending because of Bush and the posts they have made and I will gladly post that it is just as equally bad. Maybe I have missed it. But I will be glad to say that just because Bush spent poorly, that doesn't mean that Obama is excused for it.

Now, can you show me your posts where you have said that the Bush spending was not only wrong but irresponsible?
 
Truth Detector said:
Nothing in my comments "excuses" Bush for anything.
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Actually you did by saying that At least Bush's wasn't as bad. You are excusing Bush's spending by saying it isn't as bad as Obama's

Here is what I want to see from you. Say "Bush's spending was irresponsible"

If you can do that then I will believe you, but if not, then you are just another conservative that excuses the spending Bush did.
 
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